Well, let's see.Which is why I asked my original question. What was wrong with the Afghans? Lacked 'the will'? — Isaac
Well, I do have noticed the absolutely huge arms shipments made to Ukraine. The numbers are quite astonishing. Even my country sent there some stuff, first time in history. So did Sweden, second time in it's history. So did puny Estonia. So did many other countries, so it's not only an American action.Meanwhile I imagine most people who are not in kindergarden will probably lean a bit more into the material support of almost the entire Anglo-continental world as a preponderant factor of Ukranian action. — StreetlightX
...precision guided weapons like cruise missiles are so popular. They don't disengage from the attack if there's a lot of tracers around them. A human pilot might do that. — ssu
Especially in civil wars, there has to be reasons for the fight. And that's why the bloody and long civil wars tend to divide between lines of religion and ethnicity. — ssu
Or then look at the marvelous surrender peace deal that US President Trump did leaving out your government in the cold? — ssu
Sometimes, even if quite rarely, you may say something rather smart that I agree with. (One exception that proves the point: Gulf war and it's limited objective of liberating Kuwait.)To be fair, since WWII the US has more or less given up on winning wars. — StreetlightX
I think the reason is that whole society has been separated from being at war — ssu
Why? Colonial wars have been fought now for hundreds of years.More likely before fighting wars across the other side of the planet does not work very well as a logistics excercise. — StreetlightX
Why? Colonial wars have been fought now for hundreds of years. — ssu
What do you mean about logistics? — ssu
what I have not seen from you is a "what should we do" plan of action (and apologies if you have specified this and I missed it). — EricH
What should I encourage my senators/representatives to do? Should I tell them to vote against giving further aid to Ukraine? Should I write a letter to Biden saying that he should encourage Ukraine to surrender to avoid further death & destruction? — EricH
If your weapons are 60's era light arms and fertilizer, then I guess you have to have something else too. — ssu
Those who run away and leave you in the field to handle your fellow Afghans who happen to be the enemy. That's your leadership. — ssu
Or then look at the marvelous surrender peace deal that US President Trump did leaving out your government in the cold? Would that instill you some reason to fight? — ssu
Money is not a problem. There's vast amount of it everywhere. Europe is rich. Now that the Brits are gone, the EU has a better chance of making progress. We were slowed down by these free wheelers. — Olivier5
Any sanctions that cut off the westward flow of Russian gas need to be well-thought-through, otherwise those laying the sanctions might suffer more than those sanctioned, according to multiple German business and labour leaders.
The question of whether to lay an embargo on Russian fuel is tying Europe up into knots. On the one hand, few want to buy Russian oil and gas and funnel payments to a country that has attacked its neighbour, Ukraine.
But, on the other hand, most of Europe is unsure how it will heat its homes and power its economy without Russian fuel, which makes up a significant portion of the continent's fuel imports. Germany is particularly reliant on Russian gas to keep the lights on, with 50% of its gas originally from Russia.
In a joint statement, umbrella groups representing German employers and unions told dpa that they are worried that not enough care is being put into making sure that any sanctions are targeted, apply pressure properly and prevent harm to the economies implementing the sanctions.
"We don't see that in the current gas embargo debate," said Rainer Dulger, head of the Confederation of German Employers' Associations (BDA) and Reiner Hoffmann, head of the German Trade Union Confederation (DGB).
The two said current proposals would harm the German economy and employment levels more than it would those same factors in Russia, arguing that no gas means production stops, industrial slowdowns and loss of jobs.
The way to help Ukraine, they argued, is to make sure Germany has a stable economy and labour market.
These are all examples of morale winning out over equal or sometimes bad tactics — Count Timothy von Icarus
The unfortunate conclusion that I have come to is that this war was only avoidable if Ukraine could have somehow made it clear to Russia that they indeed would defend their country and it would be costly to attack them. — ssu
Evidently you didn't get my point at all. So I'll try to explain....the key being the bolded 'only'. The idea that it was entirely within Ukraine's power to determine that they would mount this great a defence, or that Russia's offence would be so poor as to render it effective. To hold that belief, one would have to hold the corollary - that in cases where the defenders lost, they simply weren't themselves courageous enough to do the job. — Isaac
idea of 'rebuilding the manufacturing base' is nothing but Trumpian nationalism meant to hide the fact that the destruction of the manufacturing base has in every case enriched powers in the West, and been carried out deliberately by Western power holders
I don’t see why we shouldn’t assess your moral choice (wrt Zenesky’s moral choice) based on a geopolitical “de facto” situation that has moral implications that matter to you (“Seeing this crisis as an inevitable result of capitalist imperialism lend support to the fight against capitalist imperialism, which is a good thing.”) — neomac
And what do you mean by “arbitrary” here? Are they “arbitrary” because you didn’t tell them yet? Or because they are random? Or what else? — neomac
My point is that, given the “de facto” circumstances, the victory of Russia (even at the additional price of a regime change) will still be the lesser evil for you because both it could immediately end the war (so no more deaths) and it would be a blow “against capitalist imperialism, which is a good thing.” — neomac
you want to help Russia win — neomac
> My objections were entirely against the claim of implausibility, so entirely pointed.
What claim of implausibility are you raving about?! Fully quote myself. — neomac
when I questioned your 2 moral claims my objections were not entirely based on considerations relying on experts’ feedback about the war in Ukraine, but also on conceptual considerations and common background knowledge. — neomac
even if a layman doesn’t have an expert view, still a layman can reasonably question how the expert input was collected and further processed by another layman — neomac
if your point now is not a question of legitimacy grounded on the nature of the philosophical inquiry and the purpose of this philosophy forum (which is all I care about), but of feeding your little intellectual echo chamber for your own comfort, then just stop interacting with me, who cares? Not to mention, how hypocritical would your whining about other people not being opened to alternative views inevitably sound, if that’s your intellectual approach in this forum. — neomac
What on earth did you just write?! — neomac
This must be thrown out, but capitalism in principle is essential for such a densely populated planet to live in any semblance of peace and prosperity. — Punshhh
So in this case, what would be Ukraine's deterrent?
It didn't have much modern weapons. It didn't have security guarantees from the West. What could be it's deterrence in this case? Well, the only thing available to it is that it would put up a fight that would be costly to Russia. And that is what I meant. — ssu
The unfortunate conclusion that I have come to is that this war was only avoidable if Ukraine could have somehow made it clear to Russia that they indeed would defend their country and it would be costly to attack them. — ssu
I don’t think it’s quite as simple as that. — Apollodorus
That's a lie. — Olivier5
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