The idea of conformal bootstrapping is simple. In the S-matrix all particle scattering probabilities are encoded as matrix elements (initial and final states). On every scale the same fields procedure is present. Where does this leave the particle? The problem arises when modeling the particle as a point. The most silly concept ever invented in physics.

:snicker: I don't get it but since you're so smart, I know it's funny! :grin: — Agent Smith

:joke: :snicker: :love: :starstruck: :kiss:

...

:snicker:

↪universeness I've hit the limits of what I know and my analytical ability. I kinda feel stupid right now. :snicker:

Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent.
— Ludwig Wittgenstein

:zip: You shut me up! — Agent Smith

mysticism!
— universeness

A desperado's escape hatch! Something must give, si — Agent Smith

Cryptic! I think you like the fact that I have no idea if you are attacking me or supporting me.
Perhaps a little of both? :chin:

Cryptic! I think you like the fact that I have no idea if you are attacking me or supporting me.
Perhaps a little of both? — universeness

I try to stay literal!

I try to stay literal! — Agent Smith

I haven't completely 'sussed' the subtleties of your approach yet agent smith.
Your typing above would suggest your meaning is easy to follow if you look at the literal meaning of the words you type but it could also be an admission that the exact opposite is true.
I remain, as I expect you prefer, fogged, concerning your actual opinions on most topics.
I don't mind the dance! :party:

I haven't completely 'sussed' the subtleties of your approach yet agent smith.
Your typing above would suggest your meaning is easy to follow if you look at the literal meaning of the words you type but it could also be an admission that the exact opposite is true.
I remain, as I expect you prefer, fogged, concerning your actual opinions on most topics.
I don't mind the dance! — universeness

I'm not a sophisticated person, mon ami! I've always had the feeling I have barbarian blood in me. :snicker:

I'm not a sophisticated person, mon ami! I've always had the feeling I have barbarian blood in me — Agent Smith

Barbarian was from a Greek word that just meant foreigner. It was the nasty Romans who used it to refer to hordes of tribal folks that just charged them en masse with manic fervour and in what seemed like complete disregard for their own lives. Especially when the Romans were in strong supportive formations, backed up by the lethal artillery systems that Rome also had.
There were/are plenty of sophisticated foreigners/barbarians now and in the days of the Romans.
I think it's a shame that 'barbarian' is such a negatively burdened word, which is not historically fair. Same with Vandal, or Goth.
I personally think Celtic and Germanic art, jewelry etc is better than Roman.
If you are not being 'sophisticated' or deliberately cryptic then perhaps you are just trying to be diplomatic. If so, then being considerate is a strength imo.

I see. Good to know. Muchas gracias.

EEEE
E
EEE
E
EEEE — Agent Smith

Fractal / hologram. :cool:

My idol, David Bohm
— Hillary

Clever man who sadly, was often very ill and depressed. As I have stated before, I will never understand why he associated with a mystic like Jiddu Krishnamurti.
It's like Einstein taking advice from a woo woo guru! — universeness

:up:

I kinda feel "stupid" right now. — Agent Smith

And, no doubt, "contagious" ... :smirk:

↪universeness I've hit the limits of what I know and my analytical ability. I kinda feel stupid right now. :snicker: — Agent Smith

I kinda feel "stupid" right now.
— Agent Smith
And, no doubt, "contagious" ... :smirk: — 180 Proof

I am still pretty foggy on the message here.
It could be that Agent Smith is roleplaying me and thinks I should be uttering the words in the quote he typed above and 180 proof is simply suggesting something general like 'yeah there is a lot of 'stupid' being demonstrated on this site!
When I try to 'decipher' what others truly mean, I oscillate between self-accusation of being overly analytical to a kind of embarrassed feeling of 'no shit Sherlock,' of course, that's what they really mean.
I suppose, In the final analysis, such analysis is more about me than it is about anyone else.
All interesting stuff!
Again I go back to one of my favourite Rabbie Burns Quotes:
'Oh wad some power, the giftie gie us, tae see oorsels as ithers see us.'

Thus, the bootstrap philosophy represents the culmination of a view of nature that arose in quantum theory with the realization of an essential and universal interrelationship, acquired its dynamic content in relativity theory, and was formulated in terms of reaction probabilities in S-matrix theory. At the same time, this view of nature came ever closer to the Eastern worldview and is now in harmony with Eastern thought, both in its general philosophy and in its specific picture of matter." — universeness

Let's analyze.

"a view of nature that arose in quantum theory with the realization of an essential and universal interrelationship "

Which view? Which universal and universal relationship? It's about the whole of interactions between all particles, like there is already an infinity of couplings (if we consider particles as points) involved in two particle interaction (there is a theorem in quantum field theory that allows the decoupling of the Hilbert spaces in the direct product space of the whole if they are far away from each other). The leaving out of the point particles is an artificial procedure, and it originates in treating particles as point-like. In other words. Woowoo.

We go on.

" and is now in harmony with Eastern thought, both in its general philosophy and in its specific picture of matter."

Complete woowoo.

the universe is seen as a dynamic web of interrelated events. None of the properties of any part of this web is fundamental; they all follow from the properties of the other parts — universeness

Which events?

The properties of any part follow from the properties of the other parts. This is the core of the bootstrap. Now while it's true that there is a mereology to be found in nature, if you read what is stated you will see the circularity and impossibility to draw reality out of the swamp by it's own hair. But by leaving out the particles this can magically be done. Which we call: WOOWOO!

Well, thanks for your opinion of the description of 'bootstrap philosophy,' I inlcuded in the OP.

I take it that you also read my words:

I am not personally a strong advocate of 'bootstrap philosophy' as it is described above — universeness

So I have no intention of defending the description in the OP.
A point particle was always a purely mathematical construct as it has 0 dimensional extensions. It only has coordinates in 3D space. 0 dim point particles were therefore not an important concept in the bootstrap approach.
As the quote about Chew in the OP suggested:
S-matrix theorists sought to understand the strong interaction by using the analytic properties of the scattering matrix to calculate the interactions of bound-states without assuming that there is a point-particle field theory underneath.

We go on.

" and is now in harmony with Eastern thought, both in its general philosophy and in its specific picture of matter."

Complete woowoo — Hillary

I think they are referring to the 'universal harmonious interactions' suggested in Eastern thought as being evidenced by the harmonious interactions which occur in subatomic reality, nothing more.
I wouldn't call that woo woo, certainly not when compared to your woo woo about dino gods etc.

Which events? — Hillary

All subatomic events!

But by leaving out the particles this can magically be done. Which we call: WOOWOO! — Hillary

Well , you the polytheist, calls it woo woo! :rofl: You who suggest heaven exists and is full of gods of extinct animals, who must vastly outnumber your humanoid gods around the ratio of 1 humgod to 99 ani/dinogods. :rofl: A Trex god who is entertained by human activities on this single tiny wee planet Earth. :rofl:

I am not personally a strong advocate of 'bootstrap philosophy' as it is described above — universeness

Ah! I thought you had joined the mystics! Thank god!

All subatomic events! — universeness

Which are?

Well , you the polytheist, calls it woo woo! :rofl: — universeness

Brother Uni! We're over that now. We talk science now. Don't you call leaving out the particles woowoo? And even worse, point particles, though maybe in this context it's precisely this stupid assumption which makes it possible. One point more or less... That's the problem in QFT: point particles! The continuum cant be broken up in points.

You who suggest heaven exists and is full of gods of extinct animals, who must vastly outnumber your humanoid gods around the ratio of 1 humgod to 99 ani/dinogods. :rofl: A Trex god who is entertained by human activities on this single tiny wee planet Earth. :rofl: — universeness

I have to admit, you are the first on Earth getting the picture! :lol:

Not sure if the Trex god gets off by watching us though...

Do you understand the connection between the S-matrix, bootstraps, Regge trajectories, the strong force, and strings,?

why he associated with a mystic like Jiddu Krishnamurti.
It's like Einstein taking advice from a woo woo guru! — universeness

Personally I quite like Krishnamurti - I still own a few of his books. As mystics go, he is one of the better ones. And I say this as a heathen.

The properties of any part follow from the properties of the other parts. This is the core of the bootstrap. Now while it's true that there is a mereology to be found in nature, but if you read what is stated you will see the circularity and impossibility to draw reality out of the swamp by it's own hair. But by leaving out the particles this can magically be done. Which we call: WOOWOO!
2h — Hillary

It’s also known as German Idealism. Physics tends to recapitulate early movements in philosophy( Capra, Kant and Schelling, Bohr and Hegel)

A point particle was always a purely mathematical construct as it has 0 dimensional extensions. It only has coordinates in 3D space. 0 dim point particles were therefore not an important concept in the bootstrap approach. — universeness

Which only goes to show what nasty influence math can have.

Personally I quite like Krishnamurti - I still own a few of his books. As mystics go, he is one of the better ones. And I say this as a heathen. — Tom Storm

:up:

I think Bohm wouldn't mind. He was called a Trotskyan, a mindless juvenile, a %$%#% etc. No wonder he got depressed. Blaming him to have had intercourse with a mystic is not too hard to swallow.

A point particle was always a purely mathematical construct as it has 0 dimensional extensions. It only has coordinates in 3D space. 0 dim point particles were therefore not an important concept in the bootstrap approach — universeness

But particles are exactly what stuff is made of. How can you ignore them?

Nice analysis! You, sir/ma'am, are on the right track.

And, no doubt, "contagious" ... :smirk: — 180 Proof

:snicker:

Question: It appears that stupidity is more contagious than smarts! I don't know why. Any ideas big fella?

It appears that stupidity is more contagious than smarts! I don't know why. Any ideas big fella? — Agent Smith

:point:

Life, then, is a struggle against foolery.

Here's an interesting thought. You of course know that nature's been characterized as lazy (paths of least resistance, that's how she likes to do it). If philosophy, sensu amplo, is so god damned hard, doesn't it mean that nature doesn't want us to take that route. Zen Buddhism's concepts of mushin no shin (mind without mind), shoshin (beginner's mind), Koans (virtual lobotomy tools) and Taoism's wu wei seem to suggest that we should...er...stop thinking and the sooner we do that the better. :chin:

Am I stupid?

Am I stupid? — Agent Smith

Arent we all?

Arent we all? — 180 Proof

:snicker: Double whammy! Moron + Dunning-Kruger effect!!!

I like psychology - it shows me things about myself I would've never found out on my own. We should ask senate to fund psychology research at the same level/higher as/than space exploration. They should take helpful hints and tips from Star Trek: Most epsiodes are a blend of space & mind. Mindspace! :chin:

Ah! I thought you had joined the mystics! Thank god — Hillary

At least your interpretative skills are consistent in this area. Unfortunately, they are consistently wrong.

All subatomic events!
— universeness

Which are? — Hillary

Are you trying to get me, who regularly confirms that my qualifications in physics (1st year Uni) + my own reading since) is limited. You are so obvious. Anyway, how about pair production.

Brother Uni! We're over that now. We talk science now. — Hillary

Noooooooooooo! You will never be allowed to do that. Your scientific musing will always be related to your dalliances with theism. To me, it makes your rationality as suspicious as a socialist who accepts a place in the house of lords and uses the title that comes with it. Such a person is no socialist imo!

But particles are exactly what stuff is made of. How can you ignore them? — Hillary

If QFT is correct and space itself consists of properties (which are currently being presented as 'fields,' scalar fields, vector fields, spinor fields etc) then all particles are disturbances/excitations of the fields.
I see this as a universe that in its entirety, is like a liquid. Nothing can separate from the liquid ln the way that happens during a 'splash' in water. There is no 'outside' of the universe. But space is internally dynamic and individual particles/concentrations/excitations/ripples/perturbations etc can 'interact,' and that is what creates the content of the Universe. A very simplistic overview of reality I know, but then, I am not a physicist. I also still am currently most convinced by the idea that our Macro 3D space could be due to something akin to or exactly like string vibrations in > 3 dimensions. Phenomena like Gravity and time etc would result purely as a consequence of subatomic interactions in a similar way to wind or weather phenomena being a consequence of interactions rather than a separate fundamental force, which perhaps relates to the bootstrap philosophy.

Personally I quite like Krishnamurti - I still own a few of his books. As mystics go, he is one of the better ones. And I say this as a heathen. — Tom Storm

I have a sister that would agree with you. We often argue about Jiddu. I think he was a flim-flam man who was clever enough to earn an easy living.
From wiki:
In his early life, he was groomed to be the new World Teacher, an advanced spiritual position in the theosophical tradition, but later rejected this mantle and withdrew from the organization behind it

I am not so sure he left his 'theosophy' behind him. I use the theosophist label for characters from such as Rasputin to Aleister Crowley, the Maharishi, Elijah Mohamed etc. All flim-flam artists.
Imo, Jiddu made so many inane quotes that were dressed up in contrived wording but were actually more like 'no shit Sherlock.' observations.
Examples from the internet (again, I stress this is just my opinion) are:
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
"Tradition becomes our security, and when the mind is secure it is in decay."
"Religion is the frozen thought of man out of which they build temples."
"Freedom from the desire for an answer is essential to the understanding of a problem."
"One is never afraid of the unknown; one is afraid of the known coming to an end."
"The constant assertion of belief is an indication of fear."
"With increasing age, dullness of mind and heart sets in."
"When I understand myself, I understand you, and out of that understanding comes love."
"Truth is a pathless land."
"This is love: the flowering of love is meditation."

Jiddu was a BS artist in pursuit of a free lunch in my opinion, sorry Tom, sorry sis!

Nice analysis! You, sir/ma'am, are on the right track — Agent Smith

Thanks but I don't know which analysis you are referring to? But thanks! :smile:
Btw. I can confirm I am male so no need for the sir/madam.