Maybe a soulless technical performance is just one without much of an interpretation or 'personality'. — Tom Storm
don't think it is emotion - that doesn't generally work for me, it has to have something more. It's a visceral thing. — Tom Storm
I love bridges. Well-built stone structures - Machu Picchu is the most beautiful thing in the world. 2000 year old Roman aqueducts. New England is a good place for that. I like things that are like stone walls - arguments laid out like bricks to build a wall of evidence. That's one of the reasons I loved "Origin of species." When I write non-fiction, I try to write like that. I love houses. Small towns. Big cities. Things made with workmanlike economy for practical purposes without cutting corners. Structures that grow organically and fit in with their neighbors. Things that are beautiful because they are well-made. I guess that's what craft means to me. I think this is what Pirsig meant when he said art is high-quality endeavor. — T Clark
This gets to the heart of it for me. If you believe, as I do, that art is anything made to be judged aesthetically, how do you classify things that are made to be useful, comfortable, and reliable for which aesthetics is secondary at most? — T Clark
Interesting as well. I equivocate visceral with emotional. What is something visceral that doesn't hit you emotionally? — Noble Dust
But a Waits song will. — Tom Storm
Anyway apart from old school blues (Muddy Waters, Little Walter, etc) I generally don't listen to any music with voice, certainly no folk, rock or pop. — Tom Storm
Ok, I think I'm starting to get a sense of "craft". Craft seems separate from artistic. — Noble Dust
I know people that love beautiful glassware, cabinetry, motorcycles, etc. — Noble Dust
I'm not the type of person who appreciates that; I've been a musician since I was a kid, so my appreciation of aesthetics tends to be pretty heavily focused on art for arts sake. — Noble Dust
I guess I do like good glassware. But when I break a piece, I'm annoyed for a day or two, and then I forget it existed. — Noble Dust
With other arts it is so variable with different segments. For example, someone trained in classical music may look down on the music of Oasis or Ed Sheeran, for example, but some may not. There is popular culture and so many genres and it is likely that each have different criteria for evaluating skills. — Jack Cummins
Even with fiction books there are so many different ways of thinking about skill and technique, with the tension between popular, the many specialist genres, as well as classical fiction and literary fiction. There may be a change in emphasis on technique and skill as more people are publishing their own work online. — Jack Cummins
I think many people can separate what they like from what they respect. — T Clark
I wonder if this is because I appreciate the craft, but don't respond emotionally to the art. — Tom Storm
I always loved that section of the Boston Museum of Fine Arts. Furniture, silver, stained glass, clothing. — T Clark
Is that art? That's the question at hand. If we use my criteria - art is something presented to be judged aesthetically - maybe not. But that brings us back to my original question - how important is skill to art? I'm confused. This is fun. Just what I wanted to talk about. — T Clark
wrote earlier he sees good writing as craft. I agree. Can't the same can be said for music? — T Clark
For me, one of the best things about glassware is that it's breakable. In order to love it, you have to be ready to let it go. I made a Christmas tree ornament for my daughter. It's a small cardboard box. Inside is a broken glass ornament. If you shake it you can hear the pieces jangle. On the cover is a label that says "Is this art?" When I gave it to her I gave her a picture of what was inside. Now, whether or not that is art, I think it is clearly not craft, except maybe in the sense we mean it when kindergarteners make napkin rings from old cardboard toilet paper tubes. — T Clark
What happend Agent Smith? — Noble Dust
Nuthin'. Thanks for your concern. — Agent Smith
I'm not concerned, I'm wondering why you made some latin joke about "no offense" in regards to Jackson telling me to get lost, and then it and my response to it disappeared. — Noble Dust
Alright. Sorry for assuming otherwise, Agent Smith. From my perspective it just looked fishy. — Noble Dust
A thousand apologies. — Ranjeet
Hey ND, don't derail the discussion. Agent Smith just likes to get involved in every discussion even when he doesn't have anything to say. His comment was likely more playful than malicious, and I deleted it because it wasn't a good contribution. — Jamal
I know people that love beautiful glassware, cabinetry, motorcycles, etc — Noble Dust
I wouldn't want to say that art = [craft, skill, and technique] + [vision, emotional investment, imagination], because it seems simplistic and reductive, but it might be a way of looking at it. For instance, some conceptual artists have the second addend, and the first is applied by the employees of the artist. And what does this say about conceptual art? — Jamal
the inflated status of the artist as creator, which is an ecomonic and sociological phenomenon. — Jamal
What is an alternative role for the artist if she's not a creator? — Noble Dust
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