We haven't really got started here — bongo fury
No, I'm just unpacking what's already there. 'Snow is white' is true if and only if snow is white. I merely unpacked, pedantically really, the right side. Nothing is missing. — TonesInDeepFreeze
waiting to be discovered — RussellA
However, if given fire is hot as the expression on the right hand side, this means that the denotation of "x" as fire and the denotation of "y" as hot are already within the expression fire is hot, waiting to be unpacked.
If that is the case, then what are "x" and "y" ? — RussellA
Denotations are stipulated — TonesInDeepFreeze
where exactly is "snow" denoted as snow and "white" denoted as white — RussellA
the denotation of 'snow' is:
precipitation in the form of small white ice crystals formed directly from the water vapor of the air at a temperature of less than 32°F (0°C)
and the denotation of 'white' is:
has the achromatic object color of greatest lightness characteristically perceived to belong to objects that reflect diffusely nearly all incident energy throughout the visible spectrum — TonesInDeepFreeze
The denotation of a word is the thing the word refers to. — TonesInDeepFreeze
The denotation of a word is the thing the word refers to. — TonesInDeepFreeze
...the extension of a predicate or function symbol is the relation or function the symbol maps to — TonesInDeepFreeze
precipitation in the form of small white ice crystals formed directly from the water vapor of the air at a temperature of less than 32°F (0°C)
snow
is it really the case that the former is the denotation of the latter? — Banno
Or do they just happen to denote the very same things, the denotation being those very things? — Banno
we don't want it to be the. case that one doesn't know what snow is until one knows it is precipitation in the form of small white ice crystals formed directly from the water vapour of the air at a temperature of less than (0°C). — Banno
Or maybe 'cueball': 'The cueball on the table is white' is true if and only if the cueball on the table is white. — TonesInDeepFreeze
The problem is that we don't want it to be the. case that one doesn't know what snow is until one knows it is precipitation in the form of small white ice crystals formed directly from the water vapour of the air at a temperature of less than (0°C). — Banno
There's perhaps a slight problem with the choice of 'snow' for the Tarski example. — TonesInDeepFreeze
I don't see how it's a problem for Tarski's definition or my remarks about it. — TonesInDeepFreeze
If, with the interpretation of the language we are using, the denotation of 'snow' is:
precipitation in the form of small white ice crystals formed directly from the water vapor of the air at a temperature of less than 32°F (0°C) — TonesInDeepFreeze
Consider
"The kettle is boiling" is true if [and only if] the kettle is boiling[.]
"The kettle is boiling" is true if [and only if] the water in the kettle has reached the temperature at which its vapour pressure is equal to the pressure of the gas above it.
"The kettle is boiling" is true if [and only if] the kettle is one of the items in the list of things which are boiling.
The last strikes me as most closely resembling what Tarski does. — Banno
I don't know where you're headed with this, — TonesInDeepFreeze
Simply because the item and the list is closer to the strategy of designation and satisfaction Tarski adopts.I don't know why you regard it as the most close. — TonesInDeepFreeze
the denotation is not the expression but the items themselves. — Banno
item and the list is closer to the strategy of designation and satisfaction Tarski adopts. — Banno
That's an excellent point. — TonesInDeepFreeze
list — Banno
The thing about the first is, is it incontrovertible. — Banno
I prefer 'set' rather than 'list', since 'list' could be taken as a sequence of the things in the set, or even suggesting a countable sequence. — TonesInDeepFreeze
if the difficulties of opacity and circularity can be overcome. — Banno
But recall that my unpacking was a conditional: — TonesInDeepFreeze
What difficulties of opacity and circulaity? — TonesInDeepFreeze
I chose "list" by way of avoiding using a technical term — Banno
The list is not in any particular order and might be innumerable. — Banno
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.