Truss reminds me of a quote Christopher Hitchens once made about David Cameron:

Q: What do you think about David Cameron?

A: He doesn't make me think.
— Manuel

That's from Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead.

Toohey: Mr. Roark, we're alone here. Why don't you tell me what you think of me? In any words you wish. No one will hear us.
Roark: But I don't think of you. — Michael

Also Casablanca:

Ugarte: You despise me, don't you Rick?
Rick: Well if I gave you any thought I probably would.

Will this show the supporters of Tories, Republicans and other right-wing populist parties how they're not political parties for low to mid-income households and not improving for anyone but the rich? People voted for Brexit, people voted for Tories, people voted for Trump, and people now recently also voted for Giorgia Meloni as well as the Swedish Democrats getting more seats in the Swedish parliament.

I mean... the ideological information is right there in front of anyone if they were to look, but people have learned to stop listening to experts and instead listen to influencer-style con-artists without any second thought as to any underlying agendas of these people.

This is what people get for wanting irrational people in power to "shake things up a bit"... because now they have shaken things up quite a bit. Hopefully, the people who voted for them are happy now that the whole economy has been shaken up because that's what happens when you give the power to these people and stop listening to experts who tried to warn about upcoming issues.

UK PM Liz Truss joins first meeting of new ‘club of European nations’

Initially sceptical

Ms Truss’ decision to attend today came as something of a surprise when announced last week, as she was initially sceptical about the idea of an EPC.

She said in July that there were too many organisations in Europe and that existing bodies should instead be made more effective.

Her Foreign Secretary James Cleverly has also said more recently that the UK does not need“to be a member of more institutions in the European sphere”.

She is even more Eurosceptical than Boris Johnson.

The British government also reportedly asked that the name be changed to the ‘European Political Forum’ – possibly to avoid associations with the ‘European Community’, an earlier name of the EU – but other European governments appear to prefer the term ‘community’. :yikes:

Trying to characterise the woman... imagine an angry toddler with a bag of spanners painted by Hieronymus Bosch.

Warning. Do not attempt to make sense of this government.

I thought Truss would be a disaster when she was winning the Tory members vote. But I never imagined she'd be quite such a huge disaster quite so quickly! So now she has sacked Kwarteng, in the hope of making him a scapegoat for the Mini-budget fiasco; and appointed Hunt, a more experienced and sober pair of hands. And she really seems to think the disaster of the policies she and Kwarteng brought to confidence in the UK will somehow not hang around her neck like the Ancient Mariner's albatross. Surely the reason that we have not been given sight of the overdue OBR forecast for the effect of her unfunded tax cuts is that she knows it will send the markets into panic mode again. Then the focus will be on the spending cuts she has to make to bring the books into some kind of balance over the next 3-5 years, most of which will be politically suicidal. The crisis-hit NHS was due to benefit from the NI hike, so having cancelled that, its decline will presumably continue even without more cuts. I can only assume she is some sort of tunnel-vision optimist, who sees the future sunlit uplands but not the years of pain needed to get there. It's patently obvious she has no empathy with the ordinary people and was neve ran election winner. For all his short-termist populism at least Boris Johnson knew he had to take public opinion with him. Sunak would have had a chance against Keir Starmer in 2022. Truss has none. The fatal flaw in the Tory party's leadership election process is that it lets its blinkered hard-core members choose the leader, not experienced MPs. Starmer should be sending 160,000 extra Christmas cards this year..

Who would want to be a PM in the UK right now? Every household knows you need to balance the budget. We lived through the period of austerity and cuts. Global issues like Covid and war in Ukraine impact on energy prices. Rising interest rates. Rising inflation. It was a big mistake not to cost the budget properly but printing money is also not a proper answer.

The reality is a better progressive tax system. The job of government is to support everyone to provide the required services a modern society needs and provide support for proper investment in infrastructure and maximising business opportunities in a fair way.

Globally however the normal expectation of continued gdp growth fuelled by consumer spending and the reality of growth fuelled by energy and the modern reliance on oil and hydrocarbons to support unsustainable growth given we are at peak oil means overall sadly for the majority standards and quality of life will be reduced with no easy answers.

Historically it has been those with power and money that have provided for themselves and close friends and political allies that maintain their position.

For sure democracy and voting with the one person one vote seems on paper the right idea but you get the government you vote for. Those with the wealth and power are still the minority yet the majority voting are arguably still getting it wrong so we end up with the government we voted for setting aside the recent vote to change pm.

The biggest issue for the tories is no obvious leader with the right ideas and enough support to plan and implement it. Manifestos become wish lists to fool voters. Yes who would want to be a pm in those circumstances but no political party would ever be able to solve all these problems.

Individuals can help themselves by doing their own budgets and working out how to get by with the basics. Inflation although the problem is going to face the stark reality of falling demand as we cut back as the majority will focus on just spending on the essentials. I expect certain industries like tourism and arts and entertainment, the luxuries will suffer the most.

The Tory’s have done the right thing. It is imperative that they self destruct and retreat into electoral oblivion. So that we can rebuild our country. If they were to win the next general election it would be a dark day for the U.K. The populism and economic failures we are experiencing would be baked in, endorsed and the populism would take a more aggressive, destructive form.

Imperative for the country, yes. But we can assume the Tory party will pursue self-interest first. The question therefore is whether there's anything they can do to stop defeat in 2024. Installing Hunt was a wise move - although it destroys Truss's credibility. I don't see how she can win even if all goes well from now on. 'Well' that is given the looming cuts, inflation and mortgages crises - which is not really 'well' at all. Their only chance I think is to ditch Truss ASAP and install Sunak in a coronation. However the party seems so divided now that that looks unfeasible. Anyway, I think Sunak is sensible enough to know that even then he'd probably lose in 2024, so he'll bide his time and wait to step in in the aftermath of the 2024 rout as the unity post-Truss candidate..

In office, but not in control. There is a lively expectation that this thread will end in about 2-3 days. It may take a bit longer, but why would she resist at this stage? I don't know who will volunteer to run the shit-show for 2 years and then go down to an annihilating defeat. Jeremy Hunt might do it because he is, I think, a genuine patriot, or Rishi might because he just wants the feather in his cap, and he's going nowhere otherwise. There'll be no more consulting the rank and file about things after this, surely, so it can all be tidied up quickly.

Or, if the zombie economists have made their killing, they might just call an election and let Labour take the blame for the long grind of poverty and the breakup of the union.

But the chances of the Prime Muppet making it to Christmas are

I’m guessing, with no evidence, that she hangs on and continues for some time. Take a page out of Boris’ playbook.

Her only supporter is the Philosophical Zombi himself,Grease-Knob. Even in the Gory party, you need a bit more than that. But there is now cross-party support for the idea that it is a mistake to consult the plebs about the leader. And of course The US can confirm that.

Q: What do you think about David Cameron?

A: He doesn't make me think. — Manuel

:cool:

Here's a clear, concise report from the Financial Times on how the 'promise' of Brexit is being fulfilled under PM Truss.

Out by the end of the day.

here is a lively expectation that this thread will end in about 2-3 days — unenlightened

:snicker: El Rachum!

I was hoping she'd survive until the next election because she's so absolutely awful, she'd bury the Tories. But, yeah, I reckon, we'll get a lunchtime announcement of her political demise.

They'll try to get Boris back in. The Conservatives are lost cause. The irony of Cameron's "chaos with Ed Miliband" remark.

Maybe the most tragic part of this is Jacob Real Snob turning full thug and physically bullying backbench MPs into voting with the government. Guy looks like he couldn't push over a daisy and suddenly he's a Victorian hall monitor. Smh.

I'll give her another 30 minutes in office. The clock is ticking...

Truss meeting 1922 committee chairman

Prime Minister Liz Truss is meeting Graham Brady, the chairman of the influential 1922 Committee of backbench MPs, No 10 has confirmed.

No reason has been given for why the meeting is taking place.

The 1922 Committee oversees the election of Conservative leaders.

:smirk:

He spoke to her a couple of days ago and said that the normal threshhold for a confidence vote had been passed, but because of the rules there cannot be two confidence votes within a year, but also said that if half of the Conservative MPs issued letters then they'd change the rules. Pretty crazy if she's managed that already.

Whether she's got to the exact number or not, she has no authority left and the Tories are in full panic mode. I'm sure he'll explain the inevitable to her.

What an embarrassment if she goes. List of longest serving Prime Ministers:

It will just be a case of another donkey leaves and yet another donkey enters. Every tory is a personal careerist first and foremost and their lowest priority is the well-being of the individuals that make up the masses.
Only a general election in the UK and a labour government down South will improve things a little for the UK. But labour under Keir Starmer and the right wing of the labour party is just a less offensive shade of capitalist blue. It's a shame so many people will have to continue to suffer until some kind of UBI system/economic parity alongside a resource-based economy is finally embedded.
Not in my lifetime probably but we are moving snail speed in that direction imo.

Only a general election in the UK and a labour government down South will improve things a little for the UK. — universeness

Unfortunately with the current polling there is no chance the Tories will call for a general election. They'd become the 4th party. As much as I'd love to see it. Labour and Lib Dem as the top two parties would be so much better.

Yep, I think you are correct, BUT, only the tories themselves could call for a general election, and they may actually do that, if they think that they have no alternative but to spend time in opposition, so as to rebuild their nuked party. If they continue as they are, no matter who steers their crippled ship, they might totally sink without trace before the two years they have left, passes.

They wouldn't even be the opposition at this point. :sweat: And I don't think 300+ Tories would be okay with losing their seats as they'd no longer be able to abuse the system to their own benefit.

True, they could become the third party or even 4th behind the SNP. But they would at least survive. The liberals were almost wiped out after their very bad coalition with the tories and they have made a respectable comeback since. But you may well be correct that the tories will be too scared to drop down the league so far, even temporarily and will prefer to try to rebuild their status over the next two years and hope they don't shatter into a hundred factions in that time.

The other point to consider is that the country is in such a mess that giving labour the reigns and watching them probably fail to make any significant positive improvements in the next 4 years, might be the best way to dupe the populous into liking the tories again.