Just in general creating an artificial environment to emulate real life situations ends in disaster as you’re not creating a soldier but raising a child. — invicta
Again personal growth is a personal journey, but the closest way to achieving your aims would be through sport. — invicta
A justification might go something like:
1) In order for truly fulfilled humans to exist, struggle needs to exist.
2) Truly fulfilled humans are an inherent good and I can bring that about.
3) I create struggles to bring this about.
4) I have created states of affairs of truly fulfilled humans and thus inherent goodness.
4a) Collateral damage of burdens that only bring about suffering and not fulfillment may come about, but this collateral damage is permissible in the pursuit of the inherent good of fulfillment.
4b) Collateral damage of burdens that bring suffering, may be useful in some grander sense anyways, so not so bad. Maybe it has been helpful, but unknown to the sufferer how the burden was helpful.
4c) Violating the non-harm principle and autonomy principle are less important than the possibility of bringing about inherently good states of affairs of fulfilled humans.
Is character building more important than non-harm or autonomy? Does the pursuit of virtue and the meaning that comes from being burdened and suffering trump deontological principles of non-harm and autonomy and not using people?
Even more interesting, is the notion that one is bringing about good states of affairs by creating humans that need to overcome burdens even accurate? Rather, perhaps is creating negative states of affairs of deficits that didn’t exist that now need fixing. — schopenhauer1
The outcome of goodness is not guaranteed in the individual despite the pain and suffering one is put through irrespective of the moral dilemma of putting one through such suffering and the morality of depriving them of autonomy (liberty-freedom) — invicta
Nothing in the world—indeed nothing even beyond the world—can possibly be conceived which could be called good without qualification except a good will — Kant
does Kant above help you at all ? — invicta
It’s also called tough love. — invicta
People generally enjoy life and wish others to enjoy life too, hence having children is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, ... — I like sushi
It's fine that you think that way, but this is obviously what is up for debate, so simply saying it is reasonable isn't really partaking in the discussion.
The argument presented seems rather slippery.
When I enjoy something and wish for others to enjoy it too, can I just impose it on them?
That doesn't seem to hold up anywhere else in ethics or life in general, biological processes or no.
It’s just difficult to believe that feeding, educating, clothing, housing, playing, and caring for someone for the better part of their life is a burden or imposition on the child, when it is the parent who is spending the time, resources, and energy to do so. — NOS4A2
Procreation suggests that a child is created, and not taken against his will and forced into some realm not of his choosing. — NOS4A2
It’s like saying planting an acorn is an imposition on an oak, and we shouldn’t burden it by watering it. — NOS4A2
The parents choose to have a child. That child has no say in whether it is born. That's an imposition by the parents on the child. — Tzeentch
No. This does not logically follow. — I like sushi
the folly of ‘debate’ (which I have strong dislike for being nothing other than a political weapon used to bend people to your will). — I like sushi
If children were created by some randomised process absent of parents then it would not be a question of ‘right’ or ‘wrong’ at all. Let us say some machine. Let us go further and say a biological system. Further still, some biological reproductive system by creatures that have a primary instinct to reproduce. Such creatures may then evolve to have something they refer to as ‘choice’ … it is here where you seem to think ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ overrides any personal perspective on life being ‘good’. — I like sushi
Words are related and I fear you are being far too liberal with their use to suit your means - the folly of ‘debate’ (which I have strong dislike forbeing nothing other than a political weapon used to bend people to your will). — I like sushi
An imposition happens when we knowingly bring about a set of circumstances that affect another human being without their say in the matter.
That applies to child-having, regardless of where one stands on the ethics question.
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