Who exactly is 'denying climate'? — Tzeentch

Climate is a word that plays a part in language games, but it would be a mistake to think it has a foundation beyond that. That's just rank foundationalism.

you are easily amused. And wholy converted. I wish I was as susceptible to gullibility

Climate is a word that plays a part in language games, but it would be a mistake to think it has a foundation beyond that. That's just rank foundationalism. — frank

:lol:

Climate is a word that plays a part in language games, but it would be a mistake to think it has a foundation beyond that. That's just rank foundationalism. — frank

Climate is a logocentric tool of oppression created by the white colonialist patriarchy!

Climate is a logocentric tool of oppression created by the white colonialist patriarchy! — Merkwurdichliebe

Or it's Marxist. Depends on which direction the polar vortex is blowing.

Or it's Marxist. Depends on which direction the polar vortex is blowing — frank

That damn shifty polar vortex

That damn shifty polar vortex — Merkwurdichliebe

Ain't that the truth?

I'm astounded at how these climate crisis radicals refuse to acknowledge how essentially racist and sexist they actually are.

I'm astounded at how these climate crisis radicals refuse to acknowledge how essentially racist and sexist they actually are. — Merkwurdichliebe

Are they?

I don't think the point of critical race theory is that the entire universe is racist. It's just that our society didn't pop out of an egg yesterday. We have a legacy of racism. There are ways that racism was incorporated into the world in the past. Those worldly things still exist, like the projects put black people into a sink hole and forces of rehabilitation wax and wane.

Besides, the new Republicans are batshit. They'll gladly load racism into their basket along with refusing to accept that there is any such thing as a climate.

Are they? — frank

Yes.

We have a legacy of racism. — frank

And science is a part of that legacy.

They'll gladly load racism into their basket along with refusing to accept that there is any such thing as a climate. — frank

Are racism and climate crisis completely interdependent? Does acceptance of one necessitate acceptance of the other? If that is the case, how do we reconcile the fact that science is part of a legacy of racism that is assumed to simultaneously be cabable of solving the problems of the modern world (such as racism and climate change)?

Uh huh.

Uh huh — frank

I suppose you are big into phrenology

I suppose you are big into phrenology — Merkwurdichliebe

Sort of. I'm making a series of puppets that have human bodies and animal heads.

Sort of. I'm making a series of puppets that have human bodies and animal heads. — frank

Awesome! put me down for a full pantheon

Awesome! put me down for a full pantheon — Merkwurdichliebe

:grin: They all go to a gift shop down the road.

I'm astounded at how these climate crisis radicals refuse to acknowledge how essentially racist and sexist they actually are. — Merkwurdichliebe

The term "climate justice" is used a lot by people who are worried about the climate crisis. Can anybody please explain to me what "climate justice" is?

The term "climate justice" is used a lot by people who are worried about the climate crisis. Can anybody please explain to me what "climate justice" is? — Agree-to-Disagree

Justice is nothing more than the instinct of resentment, refined by cleverness. — Nietzsche

I suppose it is a slave morality - the weak are using climate as a pretense to express their will to power.

Here are a couple quotes from the godfather of "sustainability":

The environmental crisis is linked to other forms of oppression, such as racism, sexism, and classism. For example, the disproportionate impact of environmental pollution on poor and minority communities is a form of environmental racism. (Ecology and Revolution)

The struggle against environmental destruction is not just a struggle for a clean environment. It is also a struggle for a more just and humane society." (Counterrevolution and Revolt) — Herbert Marcuse

Here is a timeline of environmental history, good news and bad news. There's a bit of an American slant, and curiously, no mention of Marcuse that i have come across.

https://environmentalhistory.org/about/

I never liked Marcuse, I came across him in the early seventies, but he always seemed to me an exploiter of environmental concerns for political purposes. and his writing style was awful. But as one reads the timeline, it is clear that the poor and working class are the ones who suffer most from pollution and poor environment, because the rich have the ability to live well away from the sources of their income. This is perhaps why one might get the impression that it is a left wing conspiracy.

But if anyone wonders what environmentalism ever did for us, this timeline has some answers.

The term "climate justice" is used a lot by people who are worried about the climate crisis. Can anybody please explain to me what "climate justice" is? — Agree-to-Disagree

I think it means the costs of climate change shouldn't be shuffled off onto the poor.

I think it means the costs of climate change shouldn't be shuffled off onto the poor. — frank

Are there any benefits from global-warming/climate-change? If there are, then what are they?

Are there any benefits from global-warming/climate-change? If there are, then what are they? — Agree-to-Disagree

I don't think anyone is expecting more plusses than minuses.

I don't think anyone is expecting more plusses than minuses. — frank

There are probably people in some locations who will get more plusses than minuses. Can we expect these people to help to solve global-warming/climate-change?

There are probably people in some locations who will get more plusses than minuses. Can we expect these people to help to solve global-warming/climate-change? — Agree-to-Disagree

Anyone who benefits better have a nuclear arsenal ready to defend themselves from invasion. :grin:

There are probably people in some locations who will get more plusses than minuses. Can we expect these people to help to solve global-warming/climate-change? — Agree-to-Disagree

This is not as likely as you might imagine. The obvious places are the very cold regions like the North of Russia and Canada. But the problem is that what currently lives there is adapted to the cold and will not thrive in the warmth, not just the mammals like polar bear and reindeer etc, but humble lichens. The first thing that will happen is more extremes and instability, that will degrade the environment, melting permafrost, more rain less snow leads to faster runoff and soil erosion. There are at the same time already more wildfires in these areas.

The problem for any environment is the speed of change. A 2 degree C. increase in temperature is equivalent to perhaps 1000 km move towards the pole, and most plants cannot move that far in a few decades. (These numbers are not to be taken too literally, because life is complicated, and much is still unknown.) The disastrous costs will have a long run though, before any benefits can begin to accrue.

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0118069

Anyone who benefits better have a nuclear arsenal ready to defend themselves from invasion. :grin: — frank

O Canada! Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sons command.
With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!
From far and wide, O Canada,
We stand on guard for thee.
God keep our land, glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee;
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee

A 2 degree C. increase in temperature is equivalent to perhaps 1000 km move towards the pole, — unenlightened

How far would you need to move towards the nearest Pole to reverse one degree Celsius of global warming?

A 2 degree C. increase in temperature is equivalent to perhaps 1000 km move towards the pole, and most plants cannot move that far in a few decades. — unenlightened

Humans can move the plants that they want to move. This solves the problem for plants that can't move themselves. All of our food crops etc will be easy to shift.

Humans can move the plants that they want to move. This solves the problem for plants that can't move themselves. All of our food crops etc will be easy to shift. — Agree-to-Disagree

Things are not that simple.

The Canadian Shield (French: Bouclier canadien [buklje kanadjɛ̃]), also called the Laurentian Plateau, is a geologic shield, a large area of exposed Precambrian igneous and high-grade metamorphic rocks. It forms the North American Craton (or Laurentia), the ancient geologic core of the North American continent. Glaciation has left the area with only a thin layer of soil, through which exposures of igneous bedrock resulting from its long volcanic history are frequently visible.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Shield