But you wouldn't be knocking on your own door. — Corvus

This is more apt than you might have intended. That it was my door did not even occur to me.

And each organism is identical to its biology. — NOS4A2

That is simply not true. If you understood the meaning of the term 'biology' you would see why it is not true. If you understood the meaning of the term "convention' you would see that what is by convention is not what is biologically.

This is the sense in which I am using the term.

Biology - the physiology, behavior, and other qualities of a particular organism or class of organisms.
"human biology"

But, given your stance, you should have seen that this was the meaning the word was conveying.

Why are you using a dictionary definition? A dictionary is not a biological organism. It is, by your lights, a collection of meaningless marks.

As to your claim that each organism is identical to its biology. The unique experiences that play a role in shaping who we are as individuals is not a matter of our individual biology. Our biology plays a role in our ability to use language, but the fact that I speak English and not Chinese is not determined by my biology.

You said I didn’t understand the term. The dictionary records usage, so I showed you one sense in which many people (biological organisms) use it, including myself.

It is determined by your biology. It was your biology that learned, understands, and speaks English and not Chinese.

This is more apt than you might have intended. That it was my door did not even occur to me. — Fooloso4

If you were asleep, and didn't want to get disturbed by any visitors, then any knocking on the door will disturb you, even if it was you who knocked on the door (via sleepwalking).

I showed you one sense in which many people (biological organisms) use it, including myself. — NOS4A2

And thus contradict your claims about words. Words have meaning and the words used in the dictionary inform us of the meaning of the word in question. They are then not arbitrary.

They do what you say you cannot believe they do:

I cannot believe words transport meaning from A to B — NOS4A2

The words in the dictionary transport meaning from A to B.

It is determined by your biology. It was your biology that learned, understands, and speaks English and not Chinese. — NOS4A2

My biology did not determine whether I grew up learning English and not Chinese. If I was adopted and grew up in a Chinese family my biology would remain the same, but I would speak Chinese rather than English.

f you were asleep, and didn't want to get disturbed by any visitors, then any knocking on the door will disturb you, — Corvus

Well it way the girl of my dreams knocking on my door it would not disturb me, although I might be hot and bothered.

And thus contradict your claims about words. Words have meaning and the words used in the dictionary inform us of the meaning of the word in question. They are then not arbitrary.

They do what you say you cannot believe they do:

If words had meaning you wouldn’t need a definition. You’d just hear the word or say the word, and the meaning would float through the air in the sound-waves, from one mind to the other. Except they don’t do what you believe they do, so you refer to a dictionary, contradicting your own claims.

My biology did not determine whether I grew up learning English and not Chinese. If I was adopted and grew up in a Chinese family my biology would remain the same, but I would speak Chinese rather than English.

Your biology allows for language acquisition, and determines the faculty of language in general. It’s why placing a chimp in your same scenario doesn’t lead it to speak Chinese, or any other language. The biology is different.

Well it way the girl of my dreams knocking on my door it would not disturb me, although I might be hot and bothered. — Fooloso4

Biology can precede meanings suppose. :nerd:

If words had meaning you wouldn’t need a definition. — NOS4A2

In a dictionary words are used to define the meaning of other words. You might need a dictionary to define some of the words used to define the word in question, but it is not an endless cycle. Some may rely on a dictionary more than others but no one can use a dictionary who does not understand the meaning of any of the words.

You’d just hear the word or say the word, and the meaning would float through the air in the sound-waves, from one mind to the other. Except they don’t do what you believe they do ... — NOS4A2

That is not what I believe words do. It does, however, seem to be a picture of your own making that you have either struggled against or set up to knock down.

so you refer to a dictionary, contradicting your own claims. — NOS4A2

Do you mean my claim that:

Words have meaning and the words used in the dictionary inform us of the meaning of the word in question. — Fooloso4

?

Your biology allows for language acquisition, and determines the faculty of language in general. — NOS4A2

Yes, you are agreeing with the first part of what I said above:

Our biology plays a role in our ability to use language ... — Fooloso4

Now address the second part:

...but the fact that I speak English and not Chinese is not determined by my biology. — Fooloso4

Biology can precede meanings suppose. — Corvus

Yes, and biology can somethings betray what we really mean.

In a dictionary words are used to define the meaning of other words. You might need a dictionary to define some of the words used to define the word in question, but it is not an endless cycle. Some may rely on a dictionary more than others but no one can use a dictionary who does not understand the meaning of any of the words.

Right, you need to be able to understand the language before being to read a dictionary. This is possible because you are already in possession of the meaning, which you are able to supply to the text in order to make sense of it. If meaning was in the words, learning the language would be unnecessary.

That is not what I believe words do. It does, however, seem to be a picture of your own making that you have either struggled against or set up to knock down.

It was my understanding that you believed words transport meaning from A to B, that meaning is conveyed by the words, that words are in possession of meaning. If I’ve been wrong this whole time I apologize.

but the fact that I speak English and not Chinese is not determined by my biology.

Your biology is ever-present and determines your acquisition of language, no matter what language you acquire. It cannot be excluded from any scenario.

This is possible because you are already in possession of the meaning, which you are able to supply to the text in order to make sense of it — NOS4A2

If you are already in possession of the meaning of a word then you would not have to look it up to find out what it means. It makes no sense to say that we go to a dictionary to supply meaning to the words we look up to find the meaning of.

If meaning was in the words, learning the language would be unnecessary. — NOS4A2

You have done a good job of convincing anyone who did not already realize it that you do not know how words work. Learning a language involves learning the meaning of words in that language. You stubbornly and ignorantly cling to the false idea that words are just marks and sounds devoid of meaning.

It was my understanding that you believed words transport meaning from A to B ... — NOS4A2

No. I used your term 'transport' . It is not a term I would use in this context, but we work with what we have. In any case, to transport is to convey, and meaning is conveyed through words. In this case, from a dictionary to the reader. So close enough.

What I denied is that I believe:

You’d just hear the word or say the word, and the meaning would float through the air in the sound-waves, from one mind to the other. — NOS4A2

But all of this has been covered already. It is clear that you are fond of arguing, but since facts, truth, and understanding may bring an argument to its end, you avoid them.