Bergson once wrote that "a philosopher worthy of the name has never said more than a single thing: and even then it is something he has tried to say, rather than actually said"; and I think this is basically right. If anything, I think one should be suspicious of those who don't have some kind of basic, even if unconscious framework in place in order to approach issues; else thought becomes like Kant's dove, thinking it can fly all the better without the resistance of air which enables its flight.

Kind of from left field. I never suggested or hinted at a complete lack of frames... just hoping not to get too wed to any particular ones, and just seeing everything through them forever and ever until the end of time. I like the idea that I can move around, without getting stuck, not that I can jump without any ground.

1) your post made me think of my favorite experimental rock record:


Which I think might be no small coincidence. But,

2) as to your philosophical concept, the metaphor of the frame is personally very appealing, but after awhile, it seems to get a little stale? At some points it seems like the metaphor might benefit by changing to some other shape? Or maybe not...the frame, after all, is the very concept in which the picture is formed...as Mike Vennart from Oceansize, above, says: "I am not the picture, now...I'm the frame". I, the one who creates such a frame within which to hold beliefs, am that very frame. Seems to hold.

I do like the imagery a lot, but I was thinking of a frame like a scaffolding (mentioned both in the OP), like the beginning outline of a structure. Carpentry imagery. For I'm a builder of worlds.

I build worlds too. I think we're pretty similar. It's just that we're individuals, so we're not allowed to agree on much, supposedly. I actually agree with you pretty much all the way. I was just mentioning how I perceived your idea, which was different than your own conception of it.

I didn't mean to come off as like disagreeable, but only explain that I never even thought of a picture frame, which really adds rather than subtracts from the imagery. Not really contrary, just complimentary.

I know that we're all world builders. I do love me some music, I didn't listen to what you linked, but I will now.

I didn't mean to come off as like disagreeable, but only explain that I never even thought of a picture frame, which really adds rather than subtracts from the imagery. Not really contrary, just complimentary. — Wosret

No problem at all; trust me, a thin-skinned dude like me has learned to develop a much thicker skin when dealing with ideas here. I was merely answering in typical kind. Glad you find my ideas complimentary. I literally was just basing my thoughts off of that Oceansize album, which has been a profoundly influential album on me as an artist and person. I thought the similarities were too serendipitous to ignore. Call me a philosophical dilettante; I'll take it in stride.

I know that we're all world builders. — Wosret

Oh, are we? :P

I didn't listen to what you linked, but I will now. — Wosret

Prepare to either be bored out of you mind, or sucked inextricably into my Scorpio world...

I didn't realize that it was a whole album. Are there a couple choice songs off it for like an introduction? I am more of a song liker than band liker.

...Nah dude. The first four songs on that record are your best bet. If those first four don't suck you into hearing the entire record, then I guess you've done your due diligence, because the last track is the best of all. So, you only get that experience if you have the patience to hear the whole thing...damn, sorry that sounds so pretentious...just approach it as a philosopher, not as a music lover...or not...?

the truth is, this album, titled "Frames" has had a profound influence on me, more so than most philosophy...so, that's really the reason I felt the need to comment here at all...perhaps its better to just move on...

Alright, I'll give it a go. I was just wondering, because it's different to how I usually take things in is all.

Cool. I mean, the wonderful thing about music is, you might hate this record, but that doesn't affect my assessment of you as a forum member, or the music. That's why I tried to downplay it just now; for me personally, this record has been profound, and that's why I posted. But hey, you may decide that I'm out of my mind, and you may decide this record sucks, after listening to it. And that's fine, and that would be a valid response.

No pressure eh? Lol. Well, I post for my own benefit, because I feel the need to put thoughts into garbled misspelled words, lol.

I have a hell of a lot of nervous energy, and need like multiple distractions going at once, and never commit to much for long. Most of all I like lyrics, and words, and songs I like have one important similarity, the singing is always very clear, and easily made out. I'm not a huge appreciator of the music itself, and never listen to instrumentals, and prefer to just fast paced stuff, to match my excitable disposition.

Mostly though, it's a really topical album and political album, seemingly about 9/11, and the preceeding wars in the middle east...

No pressure eh? Lol. — Wosret

None at all. I can't make anyone magically appreciate great art. Take that on a philosophical level, not a personal level.

Well, I post for my own benefit, because I feel the need to put thoughts into garbled misspelled words, lol — Wosret

Well, same here, other than I'm a bit more of a spell check freak.

I have a hell of a lot of nervous energy, and need like multiple distractions going at once, and never commit to much for long. — Wosret

Man, again, if you'll notice, I'm the same. I tend to go on posting sprees here. I'll post for a few days, and then run out of philosophical energy. The thing that keeps me going is the general impulse that the analytical bent is fundamentally flawed...

Most of all I like lyrics, and words, and songs I like have one important similarity, the singing is always very clear, and easily made out. I — Wosret

Ah. Oceansize is probably not for you, then. Cheers to you, though, for being philosophical and giving it a try! Maybe you would like Sigur Ros? That's another band I really like that has very clear (nonsensical) lyrics that create a very specific feeling. You might like it, or not. Check out their "Untitled" album, or instead, for something way less depressing, their album "Takk...".

I'm not a huge appreciator of the music itself, and never listen to instrumentals, and prefer to just fast past stuff, to match my excitable disposition. — Wosret

Maybe you would like Sufjan Stevens newest album "Carrie and Lowell"? The lyrics carry that record in a really profound way. Damn, the words on that record are intense.

Mostly though, it's a really topical album and political album, seemingly about 9/11, and the preceeding wars in the middle east... — Wosret

Oh, no, Frames by Oceansize is not at all about 9/11. That's a common misconception about it.

That first song is about cashing in on 9/11 topicality, the thing they're doing with the song ironically, as I doubt that the album is being given away. The second was about war, and turning a blind eye, or not opposing it.

Many posts I write, particularly about me because I need to get those thoughts out of me, and due to some level of disgust, I'm not likely to even look at them again, and often don't look at posts I've written until sometime later anyway, to see how horrible and garbled they are. I used to be a lot more meticulous, but got lazy. My brain is like a rhyming dictionary, and doesn't seem to store articles or prepositions properly, and without going back and fixing them they are usually all messed up, and words that rhyme with the one I intended are often there instead.

I don't know if I gots an ax to grind, it's more that I'm deeply isolated, and need some level of human contact, and I've been hanging around this little group for like a decade, and feel like I know many people that come here, so it's like my source of human connection, or community...

I'm super boring and "typical" in my tastes, I tend to like pop, or what is popular and widely appreciated for the most part, yet see myself as totally existing on the fringes for some reason... lol. Never been very hip, or with it.