• Art48
    477
    Just some thoughts. Would appreciate comments, positive or negative.
    (Endnotes are in my Word doc. Message me if you want a copy.)

    [Edit: added a few items and they are now numbered]

    Symptoms In Need Of A Cure

    1. [Actress Roseanne Barr] says people are eating babies and drinking their blood. Oh, and she says she's not crazy.
    2. North Texas megachurch pastor blasts Democrats as 'godless' and 'demonic'
    3. Pastor Rebukes Democrats in Church
    4. Pastor calls autism demonic
    5. 2-Year-Old Girl Dies After Faith-Healing Parents Refuse Medical Treatment: Officials
    6. Video shows [Sarah] Palin in anti-witchcraft prayer
    7. 17 Reasons Why Evolution is a Lie
    8. The 10 Best Evidences from Science That Confirm a Young Earth
    9. My Flat Earth: Why I Believe God's Creation (Biblical Cosmology)
    10. Does the Bible Teach That the Earth Is Flat?
    11. Predicted dates of the Second Coming of Jesus through history
    12. Catholic Church sexual abuse cases by country
    13. Jesus is their savior, Trump is their candidate. Ex-president’s backers say he shares faith, values
    14. Why Evangelicals Went All In on Trump, Again
    15. The Republican Party Is Coming for Birth Control
    16. Letting them die: parents refuse medical help for children in the name of Christ
    17. Some religious leaders oppose IVF, causing tension among churchgoers struggling with infertility
    18. Witch Trials & Witchcraft
    19. We Must Extinguish Faith-Based Violence, Xenophobia by Tackling Hate Speech, Protecting Religious Sites, Secretary-General Tells Interfaith Summit
    20. Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting 'Liberal' Teachings of Jesus
    21. Another look at religious objections to obstetric anaesthesia
    22. Fundamentalists are not as "intelligent"
    23. A Blasphemous Invention–Religious Objections to Ben Franklin’s Lightning Rod
    24. What are Christian arguments against the use of anesthesia?
    25. Christian Nationalism: A grave threat to America
    26. Christian Nationalism Is ‘Single Biggest Threat’ to America’s Religious Freedom
    27. The Radical Evangelicals Who Helped Push Jan. 6 to Wage War on “Demonic Influence”
    28. Federally Funded Abstinence-Only Programs: Harmful and Ineffective
    29. Militant Christian Nationalists Remain A Potent Force, Even After The Capitol Riot
    30. Well, We Have a Speaker. He’s an Election Denier and an Extreme Christian Fundamentalist.
    31. When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.
    32. Is Fascism Coming to America? | Opinion
    33. Trump repeats baseless claim about Haitian immigrants eating pets
    34. Republicans Declare Banning Universal Free School Meals a 2024 Priority
    35. 14 GOP-led states have turned down federal money to feed low-income kids in the summer. Here’s why
    36. Christianity and Xenophobia
    37. No, Christians Cannot Support the Democrat Party
    38. Could My Child Have a Demon? (Part I)
    39. After 30 years, a father is exonerated in 'satanic panic' case
    40. Christian Pastor Calls for Killing All Gay People
    41. Is 'Thank God for dead soldiers' protected speech?
    42. Homophobic pastor says LGBT+ people should be killed: ‘As much as God loves, God hates’
    43. 45% of Americans Say U.S. Should Be a ‘Christian Nation’
    44. Pope Reaffirms 'No Salvation' Outside Catholic 'Church'
    45. Roman Catholicism Is Not Christianity
    46. IS THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH THE ONE TRUE CHURCH?
    47. The Pro-Slavery History of the Southern Baptists
    48. Racism among white Christians is higher than among the nonreligious. That's no coincidence.
    49. Man is a Religious Animal. He is the only Religious Animal. He is the only animal that has the True Religion--several of them.
    50. Becoming Catholic #22: What Did the Ancient Church Believe? The Catholic Church is the One True Church
    51. About four-in-ten U.S. adults believe humanity is ‘living in the end times’
    52. Watch a US Senator Cite the Bible to Prove That Humans Aren’t Causing Global Warming
    53. There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been.
    54. President Trump: 'I am the chosen one'
    55. Opinion: How a misreading of the Bible fuels many Americans’ apathy about climate change
    56. Fascism in America: It’s Happening Here, According to Professor's New Book
    57. So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.

    Imagine the people who believe such things and who are not ashamed to ignore, totally, all the patient findings of thinking minds through all the centuries since the Bible was written. And it is these ignorant people, the most uneducated, the most unimaginative, the most unthinking among us, who would make themselves the guides and leaders of us all; who would force their feeble and childish beliefs on us; who would invade our schools and libraries and homes. I personally resent it bitterly.
  • T Clark
    13.7k
    the most uneducated, the most unimaginative, the most unthinking among us,Art48

    Smug, arrogant crap. Makes me want to vote for Trump just to piss you off.
  • Shawn
    13.2k
    The patient is terminally ill.
  • kazan
    150
    T Clark,
    Art48 may be being purposely provocative with elitist bias using those words you outlined and throughout this OP's opening salvo. But that there is a concern, regarding the views of fellow voters being the results of this type of thinking, held by many other voters is a valid issue. Not only is this an issue in the US context, but also amongst voters in geopolitically allied/ aligned nations where this religious thinking is gaining traction. That it ( this type of religious thinking) appeals to some who will possibly, if organized correctly, noticeably influence or transform the outcomes of democratic elections in other nations as it may in the US, is not to be taken lightly, as history shows.
    Agreed not all, of this religious persuasion, can realistically be written off as "the most uneducated... among(st) us". But given the nature of geography based ( i.e. electoral boundaries) democracy and the electoral college voters system of US presidential elections, the great example of democratic nationhood that the US espouses to be and wants to encourage in the world may not be very appealing to the growing better educated world citizens.
    There is no argument intended that this is the only issue of concern nor that changes in technologies haven't amplified these types of concerns to possibly have world wide ramifications.
    The above is not intended to denigrate your reaction, but merely to offer a different reaction, or opinion, if you will.
    concerned for one's personal future smile
  • unenlightened
    9.2k
    Imagine the people who believe such things and who are not ashamed to ignore, totally, all the patient findings of thinking minds through all the centuries since the Bible was written.Art48

    Stop imagining that there are these two kinds of people; the patient thinkers like you, and the others, infected by religion. That is itself the root of fanaticism. The godless are also capable of horrors and especially in the name of rationality. It is the certainty of righteousness that always justifies human horrors, and everyone is capable of them.
  • javi2541997
    5.7k
    And it is these ignorant people, the most uneducated, the most unimaginative, the most unthinking among us, who would make themselves the guides and leaders of us allArt48

    This thread is basically focused on American folks. Some things, such as Christian nationalists don't exist here and religion split apart from politics a way ago...
  • I like sushi
    4.8k
    Freedom has its price, but few are willing to pay.

    I do not think finger pointing and blaming gets anyone anywhere good very quickly (the opposite usually).

    There is of course the question of the limitations of toleration. Where to draw the line if at all?
  • RussellA
    1.8k
    [Actress Roseanne Barr] says people are eating babies and drinking their blood. Oh, and she says she's not crazy.Art48

    Just taking your first point, you give no attribution for the quote, which is a form of plagiarism, and you don't mention the fact that Roseanne Barr is also a comedian, one of whose jobs is to mock the silliness and stupidity of society.
  • fishfry
    3.4k
    Symptoms In Need Of A CureArt48

    Nice troll bait. I'll play.

    There are plenty of anti-science types on the left. Look at the woo community, the astrologists, spiritualists, believers in crystals, etc. Mostly leftists. Marianne Williamson is a Democrat.

    And you know you can't get elected to high office in the US without professing belief in God and at least showing up in church from time to time. Obama survived his Reverend Wright scandal ("God damn America!") but he'd never have gotten elected if he was a proud atheist. He may have gone to an America-hating church, but at least he went to church.

    Then there's the Reverend Martin Luther King, the Reverend Jesse Jackson, the Reverend Al Sharpton (an MSNBC host), etc. You'll find as much Christian godliness among liberal American blacks as you will among conservative Evangelical whites. Could you possibly be unaware of that?

    45% of Americans Say U.S. Should Be a ‘Christian Nation’Art48

    A goodly percentage of those are black liberal Democrats. You are misinformed if you think religiosity in America is confined to white conservatives.

    Anti-science on the left. Before covid, the anti-vaxxers were upscale liberals in places like Marin county, north of San Francisco. This was commonly known and reported on at the time.

    From 2015: "... the anti-vaccination movement is fueled by an over-privileged group of rich people grouped together who swear they won't put any chemicals in their kids (food or vaccines or whatever else), either because it's trendy to be all-natural or they don't understand or accept the science of vaccinations. "

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/01/22/vaccine-deniers-stick-together-and-now-theyre-ruining-things-for-everyone/

    From 2017: "Because the outbreak started in the wealthy, liberal enclave of Marin County, California, and because some of the best-known “anti-vaxxers” are Hollywood actors, some right-leaning media outlets connected opposition to vaccination to liberals and related it to other “anti-science” beliefs like fear of GMOs, use of alternative medicine, and even astrology. "

    https://theconversation.com/anti-vaccination-beliefs-dont-follow-the-usual-political-polarization-81001


    Is 'Thank God for dead soldiers' protected speech?Art48

    You'd more likely hear that from a leftist. At least ten or fifteen years ago, before the left embraced the national security state.

    In any event, the First Amendment gives everyone the right to say that. Are you making an anti- free speech argument? I didn't follow your point. Of course it's protected speech. The US has extremely strong protections for free speech.

    Witch Trials & witchcraftArt48

    Witch trials? Have you got a link to such an event in the US recently? I can't recall such an incident.

    As for witchcraft itself, it's almost completely a leftist pursuit. I'm sure you know that.

    Witchcraft is the perfect religion for liberal millennials

    You know if you come upon a group of people dancing naked in the woods reciting pagan incantations, they're almost certainly on the political left. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
  • Art48
    477
    Just taking your first point, you give no attribution for the quote, which is a form of plagiarism, and you don't mention the fact that Roseanne Barr is also a comedian, one of whose jobs is to mock the silliness and stupidity of society.RussellA
    I mention that endnotes are in the Word version. Barr was quite serious; watch the video.
    Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSSpCsj248Y
  • RussellA
    1.8k
    Barr was quite serious; watch the video.Art48

    There's no context to the video. Who are "they"?

    In the context of being a comedian, Barr also said in 10 Feb 2023:

    It's just beautiful. Like, I look out my bedroom window. I can't believe it, I see all these gorgeous little tiny baby deer in my yard eating the grass around my pool. I's so fantastic you know, because I can pull out my AR-15 and blow them just to Smithereens, legally.

    Is Barr being serious, or using exaggeration to make a point? Exaggeration, hyperbole, metaphor, simile and figures of speech are important aspects of language, and understood for what they are within context.

    As regards drinking human blood, there is a BBC article The people who drink human blood which writes

    In most major cities around the world, communities of ordinary people – nurses, bar staff, secretaries – are drinking human blood on a regular basis. The question is, why?

    In the French quarter of New Orleans, John Edgar Browning is about to take part in a "feeding". It begins as clinically as a medical procedure. His acquaintance first swabs a small patch on Browning’s upper back with alcohol. He then punctures it with a disposable hobby scalpel, and squeezes until the blood starts flowing. Lowering his lips to the wound, Browning's associate now starts lapping up the wine-dark liquid. “He drank it a few times, then cleaned and bandaged me,” Browning says today.

    There are thousands of people drinking blood in the US alone.
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    Whoda thunk we'd have our own Cassandra. Welcome to Mycenae.
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    Smug, arrogant crap. Makes me want to vote for Trump just to piss you off.T Clark
    I did not detect anything false or untrue in the OP. What offended you so much? Or were you trying to make a joke?
  • Outlander
    2.1k
    Seems like more of a Lounge topic so will be replying as such but not without an underlying authenticity. Note you seem to be asking for solutions which require knowledge or understanding of the person's underlying reasoning (logical or otherwise), which is all I claim to provide.

    Reveal
    1. [Actress Roseanne Barr] says people are eating babies and drinking their
    blood. Oh, and she says she's not crazy.

    Out of 8 billion or so people, I'd wager someone somewhere is.

    2. North Texas megachurch pastor blasts Democrats as 'godless' and 'demonic'

    If the religion is to be believed, that is to the default state of men, susceptible to worldly influence and energies. That said, I'm sure there's many a Republican who would fit that criterion. Problem is many religious folk simply hijack the idea of divine providence and tailor it to artificially inflate the purpose or justification of whatever it is they happen to be doing at the time.

    3. Pastor Rebukes Democrats in Church

    See Answer 2.

    4. Pastor calls autism demonic

    It was a common belief in earlier civilizations that illness, death, disease and all things bad come from bad entities. In the Testament of Solomon (not considered Biblical canon) there is allegedly a demon that causes sore throats that could be "cast out" (and thus the person healed) but only if you knew its true name.

    5. 2-Year-Old Girl Dies After Faith-Healing Parents Refuse Medical Treatment: Officials

    Some people just believe when it's your time to go, it's your time to go. A parallel would be a person who signed a Do Not Resuscitate or No Life Support paper. Unfortunately, many people are as incompetent as they are "religious" these days. The legal system serves a purpose.

    6. Video shows [Sarah] Palin in anti-witchcraft prayer

    If you believe in something, odds are in an indirect way it has power over you. Physical rituals of verbal reassurance are proven to help people. No harm, no foul.

    7. 17 Reasons Why Evolution is a Lie

    The theory of evolution, like all theories, is open to scrutiny/improvement. Why wouldn't it be?

    8. The 10 Best Evidences from Science That Confirm a Young Earth

    I have a theory on the matter that would make everybody right, though I keep it to myself to avoid the common folk from looking at me a bit tilt.

    9. My Flat Earth: Why I Believe God's Creation (Biblical Cosmology)

    Live your truth, I'm told. We have laws for a reason. No harm, no foul.

    10. Does the Bible Teach That the Earth Is Flat?

    See Answer 9.

    11. Predicted dates of the Second Coming of Jesus through history

    What? People can't theorize? Now who's exhibiting symptoms.

    12. Catholic Church sexual abuse cases by country

    Human nature. I can think of no legal or humane solution.

    13. Jesus is their savior, Trump is their candidate. Ex-president’s backers say he shares faith, values

    The two seem to be polar opposites at times, yes. Though the religion is by design for the imperfect. As all men are.

    14. Why Evangelicals Went All In on Trump, Again

    See Answer 13.

    15. The Republican Party Is Coming for Birth Control

    Nobody said democracies were just or fair.

    16. Letting them die: parents refuse medical help for children in the name of Christ

    See Answer 5.

    17. Some religious leaders oppose IVF, causing tension among churchgoers struggling with infertility

    And? Listen to them or don't.

    18. Witch Trials & Witchcraft

    I will flat out agree people cannot handle most knowledge or even everyday life without getting carried away. Laws are in place for a reason.

    19. We Must Extinguish Faith-Based Violence, Xenophobia by Tackling Hate Speech, Protecting Religious Sites, Secretary-General Tells Interfaith Summit

    ?

    20. Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting 'Liberal' Teachings of Jesus

    People call themselves whatever they please I've noticed.

    21. Another look at religious objections to obstetric anaesthesia

    I'm not aware of any scriptural reference, though again people like to see things that coincide with whatever they feel or please.

    22. Fundamentalists are not as "intelligent"

    The more you know, the greater the burden. I think the world might very well be better off if nobody discovered nuclear weaponry. Though I could just as well be mistaken.

    23. A Blasphemous Invention–Religious Objections to Ben Franklin’s Lightning Rod

    One person saying something hardly amounts to a "thing", really.

    24. What are Christian arguments against the use of anesthesia?

    This is a question, not an assertion. Again, ?

    25. Christian Nationalism: A grave threat to America

    See Answer 20.

    26. Christian Nationalism Is ‘Single Biggest Threat’ to America’s Religious Freedom

    Any minority is naturally at risk to a given majority.

    27. The Radical Evangelicals Who Helped Push Jan. 6 to Wage War on “Demonic Influence”

    You said it yourself: "radical". They're all kinds, theist and otherwise, many who claim the opposite of their actual persuasions.

    28. Federally Funded Abstinence-Only Programs: Harmful and Ineffective

    Hard to speculate without any actual reasoning given. Builds character from the sound of it.

    29. Militant Christian Nationalists Remain A Potent Force, Even After The Capitol Riot

    There's something I recall about "obeying government authorities" and "letting Jesus fight [one's] battles", If I'm not mistaken. Absent of any of that, there is something in the highest legally binding document in the land about "overthrowing" a government that fails to serve the people. Not defending it, just, it's there.

    30. Well, We Have a Speaker. He’s an Election Denier and an Extreme Christian Fundamentalist.

    People are often critical of their government and honesty of politicians. Nothing new.

    31. When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.

    Fall of Troy.

    32. Is Fascism Coming to America? | Opinion

    No society lasts for very long without laws. People can worship and speak freely more or less. No president has ever made laws or decrees that undermine a person's personal desires in life that don't include breaking laws, to my knowledge.

    33. Trump repeats baseless claim about Haitian immigrants eating pets

    If it's untrue that's unfortunate. What is true is in third world countries, dinner is whatever you can catch.

    34. Republicans Declare Banning Universal Free School Meals a 2024 Priority

    I suppose ideally a parent should be able to feed their child. Generosity is nice but I hardly think it should be legally mandated. Federal welfare benefits remain for those who are eligible (low income).

    35. 14 GOP-led states have turned down federal money to feed low-income kids in the summer. Here’s why

    See Answer 34.

    36. Christianity and Xenophobia

    "Love others as you love yourself". Who knows, maybe that terribly misspelled e-mail really was from a Nigerian prince wishing to share his fortune with you.

    37. No, Christians Cannot Support the Democrat Party

    This is getting tiresome.

    38. Could My Child Have a Demon? (Part I)

    While I'd agree there's more to this world than we may know, See Answer 18.

    39. After 30 years, a father is exonerated in 'satanic panic' case

    See Answer 18.

    40. Christian Pastor Calls for Killing All Gay People

    I'd start with murderers and people who don't signal before changing lanes but I'm an odd type. Definitely not a patient one is he? Not like they'll be reproducing anytime soon. Again, you can take 30 minutes and spend $15 and declare yourself whatever religion (or branch of whatever religion) you'd like. Religions and related figures are not copyrighted nor do they follow any true central authority.

    41. Is 'Thank God for dead soldiers' protected speech?

    ? I don't like every person and opinion on Earth either, but unless you're capable of overthrowing not only the U.S. government but its allies and installing a new law of the land, your time and effort would be better spent on other matters in my opinion.

    42. Homophobic pastor says LGBT+ people should be killed: ‘As much as God loves, God hates’

    See Answer 40.

    43. 45% of Americans Say U.S. Should Be a ‘Christian Nation’

    It's nice to have opinions.

    44. Pope Reaffirms 'No Salvation' Outside Catholic 'Church'

    Gotta keep that flock from grazing elsewhere now, don't we?

    45. Roman Catholicism Is Not Christianity

    That's common talk among differing denominations and other schools of general thought and belief as well. Purists, etc.

    46. IS THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH THE ONE TRUE CHURCH?

    See Answer 45.

    47. The Pro-Slavery History of the Southern Baptists

    I assumed we were discussing present symptoms not a chart of a patient's history.

    48. Racism among white Christians is higher than among the nonreligious. That's no coincidence.

    What is this saying? White people are inherently prone to racism (dislike or distrust of the unfamiliar whether or not they act on it or just "quietly believe so" with no actual effect) or those who identity as Christian? The difference is, you can identity as any religion you please and no one can, with any actual standing, disprove your claim.

    49. Man is a Religious Animal. He is the only Religious Animal. He is the only animal that has the True Religion--several of them.

    Thinking beings think. That is correct. I suppose a lobotomy would work if that's enough of a problem in your eyes.

    50. Becoming Catholic #22: What Did the Ancient Church Believe? The Catholic Church is the One True Church

    See Answers 44, 45.

    51. About four-in-ten U.S. adults believe humanity is ‘living in the end times’

    Assuming this is religious based and not say, fear of a civilization-ending event such as an asteroid or cosmic flare, one has to admit if things are to be believed, this is truly a unique time, unlike the understandable idea that every society came across new inventions and interconnection and disasters due to the technological factor (nuclear warheads, the entire world being connected, both of which are very unique factors or incredible magnitute not present in any time prior).

    52. Watch a US Senator Cite the Bible to Prove That Humans Aren’t Causing Global Warming

    What should be fixed, the fact that there's a consumer (buyer) or the fact that there's a supplier (seller)? Pandering is nothing new.

    53. There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been.

    Everyone thinks the way they live (and most importantly, the choices they've made) are the best, otherwise they'd feel foolish. The brain does not like to be wrong. As far as measurable lack of intelligence, schools only go so far I suppose. You can lead a horse to water. The rest is up to the horse.

    54. President Trump: 'I am the chosen one'

    Well he's certainly lived a rather charmed and fortunate life. Without knowing his reasons one could only speculate.

    55. Opinion: How a misreading of the Bible fuels many Americans’ apathy about climate change

    The downside of democracy. People often don't know what's best for them.

    56. Fascism in America: It’s Happening Here, According to Professor's New Book

    See Answer 32.

    57. So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.
    Art48

    It's not a coloring book. Solomon's wisdom is put on display many times, to name one example. I'm sure a child's version says in big goofy letters "And this is a good thing, see, king smart" for the tragically incompetent.
  • Count Timothy von Icarus
    2.7k


    Agreed. I've moved this to the Lounge due to lack of substantial philosophical content. It seems like just a list of headlines of people saying silly things, although one where the selection shows no little amount of sectarian bias as well.

    Honestly, it strikes me like exactly the sort of thing I see on Q Anon sites, except that there the selection would simply target a different group of people.
  • T Clark
    13.7k
    I did not detect anything false or untrue in the OP. What offended you so much? Or were you trying to make a joke?tim wood

    Not a joke, although it would take more than this obnoxious OP to make me vote for Mr. Trump. I’m pleased to see it’s been moved to the garbage dump in the lounge.
  • T Clark
    13.7k

    Your response is certainly more reasonable than mine.
  • Art48
    477
    Honestly, it strikes me like exactly the sort of thing I see on Q Anon sites, except that there the selection would simply target a different group of people.Count Timothy von Icarus

    I'm puzzled. If it's "exactly the sort or thing I see on OAnon sites" then do you believe one of the two following choices?
    1. The OP's items are factual but so are QAnon posts so the two are similar.
    2. The OP's items are as false as QANon posts so the two are similar.

    If 1., I've nothing more to say to you.
    If 2., what are the numbers of the items in the OP you consider as unfactual as QAnon posts?
  • Art48
    477
    I did not detect anything false or untrue in the OP. What offended you so much?tim wood
    I'd answer what offended him is "The truth"
  • Art48
    477
    NOTE: I was able to post on Reddit with the endnotes. So, if anyone is interested in where the items in the OP come from, go here.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/Trumpvirus/comments/1frbs2g/comment/lpbox89/?context=3
  • BitconnectCarlos
    2.2k
    57. So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.Art48

    Right on. I think the closest we get to it is when J tells his followers to be as cunning as snakes and as innocent as doves. But don't forget that the Kingdom of Heaven is for little children.

    The gospels are a fair bit anti-intellectual and this is one of the aspects that makes the gospels so radical. And by "radical" I mean it really straddles the line between brilliancy and absurdity.
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    Not a joke, although it would take more than this obnoxious OPT Clark
    My question was sincere and specific. What offended you so much?
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    It seems like just a list of headlines of people saying silly things,Count Timothy von Icarus
    What exactly, please, do you mean by silly?

    Children say things we often think of as silly, which is nothing less than our in-a-word unthinking dismissal of what they said. The only non-adults I know of that say silly things are those absent sense or people trying to be humorous. After all, in the last, say, 125 years at least through current - never mind before that - a lot of people said, have said, are saying very silly things. Care to consider how much harm was done and is being done by those "silly" things? Care to reconsider your "silly"?
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    The gospels are a fair bit anti-intellectualBitconnectCarlos
    They are, or you find them so - not the same thing.
  • BitconnectCarlos
    2.2k


    Unless you change and become like a little child you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    Unless you change and become like a little child you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.BitconnectCarlos
    Non-sequitur. Try answering the question. Try thinking before you answer.
  • BitconnectCarlos
    2.2k


    What question did you ask me?
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    Ok. Another way. Do you assert the Gospels are in-themselves anti-intellectual? Or do you merely assert that you find them so, being agnostic as to whether they are or are not in-themselves anti-intellectual? My point being that while you and I might very well find them so, that is not to say that they were intended or understood to be so. By Gospels I mean the New Testament, but at the same time I do not exclude the Tanakh.
  • BitconnectCarlos
    2.2k


    I speak here only of the gospels - not the entire New Testament, and certainly not the Tanakh which is a different work that existed before Jesus & the Church.

    But yes, my assertion comes from a perspective and that perspective has a cultural background.
  • tim wood
    9.2k
    But yes, my assertion comes from a perspective and that perspective has a cultural background.BitconnectCarlos
    Pulling teeth! So your judgment of M-M-L-J, Acts? And nothing else in the NT? is anti-intellectual from your perspective? Is there anything about your perspective that we should consider or think valuable?

    I read the first five books as what I call exemplary stories. As to supernatural elements, I don't buy them, but apparently they did, and that matters. In any case, imho, not anti-intellectual at all, but requiring what any literature requires, a "suspension of disbelief." If you (choose to) goggle at the miracles or the resurrection, then likely whatever else those books have to say may well be lost to you. Which leaves the reasonable question, is the science of the NT all that matters to you? Rhetorical; I suspect it does mean more to you. So why bother with "anti-intellectual" about something not intended to be "intellectual" - and that was not intended for you as audience in any case?
  • T Clark
    13.7k
    My question was sincere and specific. What offended you so much?tim wood

    I don’t doubt your sincerity. I wasn’t offended, I was angered by the mean spirited and ignorant characterization of the people he disagrees with.
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