Comments

  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Isaac

    The Russians should follow your advice and surrender. :grin:
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪ssu
    :clap:
  • Ukraine Crisis
    I think it's important to say these things unambiguously, not just "not say otherwise". — Olivier5

    Yep. Recognizing that we live with contradictions might help us with clarity. Maybe.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Baden

    I was recently reading about the concept of the ethical dilemma, specifically of the sort where a particular action is right and wrong at the same time.

    One view is that ethical dilemmas of this kind only exist for world leaders as they act to advance the interests of their countries in the context of competition for political survival.

    I think this issue is in the background of the discussions in this thread, though we seem to want to avoid facing it. What makes this interesting to me is how and why parties get close to dealing with it.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Baden
    Oh. OK.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    I originally wasn't referring to him in particular — Baden

    You mentioned my voting record, so,

    For someone who likes to enjoy performative condemnation, you sure do alot of wiggling out of such performances when its people you like. — StreetlightX

    wut
  • Ukraine Crisis
    No, my point is it may have been just a soundbite for the gullible like most politician's campaign promises. Good night. — Baden

    Oh. No, he just ended it.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Was this before or after the US$650 million arms deal with SA in November 2021? — StreetlightX

    After. Liar.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Baden

    Your point is that Biden didn't end the support quickly enough to avoid becoming partially responsible for the deaths of innocent people.

    I appreciate your pointing that out.

    It's bedtime.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Being Irish doesn't make you any more moral than any one else, frank nor does being Catholic, I'd wager. But thanks for the vote fo support, I guess. — Baden

    Biden ended the support for the war against Yemen. The support came from Obama and Trump.

    But yes. Some Irish people are scum.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    don't think the exact figures are available on whatever discounts were involved but the principle of indirect financing here stands, regardless. — Baden

    I think you actually know it means to finance something. :rofl:
  • Ukraine Crisis
    The human garbage that runs your country should be at least as concerning for you as the human garbage that invaded Ukraine, seeing as you may have voted for the former. — Baden

    Of course. That was never in question. Biden is a Roman Catholic of Irish descent, BTW.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Baden
    I can't find the info on the discounted arms sale. Could you point me to it?
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Can we not get the facts straight? — frank

    So that's a no. :chin:
  • Ukraine Crisis
    I'm happy to be corrected on the facts. I just wonder if you agree that ethically there's no major distinction. If you sell someone a weapon knowing they're going to use it to kill civilians, you are partly responsible for those deaths, right? — Baden

    Yes. You're partly responsible.

    We have two different narratives here. In one, the US finances a war crime. This suggests that the US had a particular interest doing damage to Yemen. This is not true.

    In the second narrative the US assisted Saudi Arabia, but did not directly finance anything. It was a deal with the devil.

    Let's say the weight of American sin is equal in both cases and Americans will spend the same amount of time in Hell either way.

    Still, one story is true and the other is a fucking lie. Can we not get the facts straight?
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Ok, can you explain to me the huge ethical difference you see between e.g. selling someone a gun knowing they're going to murder someone with it and giving them money knowing they're going to go buy a gun and murder someone with it. — Baden

    Why can't we just get the facts straight? Is that a problem?
  • Ukraine Crisis
    It's a distinction without much of a difference. — Baden

    I disagree.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Yes. The Saudis do pay hard cash for the M1 Abrams tanks, for those F-15 strike aircraft and smart bombs. — ssu

    Of course. The Houthis are Shia, so Saudi Arabia doesn't need any prodding from the US to attack them. The shame is for supporting them while they did it.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    OK, supported through arms sales and technical assistance, primarily. — Baden

    Yea. What you said was in line with what StreetlightX said earlier. Most of his posts contain outright lies. That was one of them.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    financed by the U.S., — Baden

    Not financed by the US. Supported in other ways.
  • Matrilineal Matriarchy.
    ↪unenlightened

    Navajos aren't Plains Indians. They live around the Grand Canyon. Plains Indians are usually Siouxan.

    What sort of property did Navajos have before white people showed up?
  • Matrilineal Matriarchy.
    There's a bunch of stuff on Native American tribes as well, you can find for yu'sen — unenlightened

    That’s funny. There are quasi native people near me who say "youen" to mean "you all."

    Plains Indians weren't exactly matrilineal, but to the extent that they had property, it was owned by the people who made it. Dwellings were made by women, so they owned them. Arrowheads were made by men, so I guess they owned them.
  • Aristotle: Time Never Begins
    Do you think Aristotle's argument is sound or valid? Why or why not? — Kuro

    I think it's valid with the premise that time accords with the way we usually imagine it.

    But there are other ways to imagine it and maybe some ways we haven't considered yet (as a species). So the conclusion may be wrong.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪ssu


    It works well on both sides. "We're prepared for war because they are." The arms vendors win.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Putin is a piece of shit.
    — frank

    All the empty smart-arse rhetoric from the Putin apologists in this thread, and yet that is indeed what it comes down to.     — Janus

    Yep.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Putin is a piece of shit.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Putin is beyond a revanchist. He’s an old school communist, nearly a Bolshevik-an apparatchik- who still thinks history is trending towards”workers of the world unite.” — Reshuffle

    No he's not.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    inundation — boethius

    I think the only people who are being inundated are people who watch cable news all day long. Get rid of your TV.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪StreetlightX
    you suck
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Maybe get a better hobby? Have you tried Elden Ring? — StreetlightX

    I haven't. But then, I'm not glued to Twitter as you seem to be. I'm making a fence out of painted shapes. It's supposed to look like a giant lichen. That's my hobby.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Yeah, the world is really in danger of not talking about Putin's crimes. Just a hair's breadth away from that untenable situation. — StreetlightX

    I prefer to hear it. It honors the victims (for me, anyway). The ones who are silent spit on their graves (basically).
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪StreetlightX

    So they're hypocrites. I'd rather that than have them be silent about Putin's crimes (like some people I know).
  • Ukraine Crisis
    As Cuthbert implied -- very philosophically -- about nuclear annihilation: it's not that bad; there is always the possibility that we will fail better next time. — Olivier5
    :blush:
  • Ukraine Crisis
    frank

    Ok, well then re-imagine my little bully story but you're not motivated to do anything at all about the situation except for some purely academic analysis on the internet.     — boethius

    I don't know what you're talking about. I'm sure that on the basics, we agree. Maybe we differ on strategies for dealing with bullies, but we're still on a dead rock hurtling through nowhere on the way to nowhere for no reason.

    As we pass into oblivion we whisper into the darkness: "we did the best we could..."
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪boethius

    I don't have any righteous rage. This is nothing new. Same shit different day.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Olivier5

    He wandered home wondering if he had any frozen peas in the freezer to nurse his black eye, and since he'd crapped his pants, should he wash them? Or just throw them away?

    “Damn NATO", he mumbled.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Satan himself is in charge of Russia — Isaac

    Republicans love him. You're the only one thinking in supernatural terms. Weird.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Zelensky is amazing. Holy shit.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    That was back in the good old days when I didn’t think Russia would invade, — jamalrob

    Ah. So you actually thought Joe Biden was lying about that. That kind of blows my mind. Why on earth would you think that?
  • Ukraine Crisis
    But if the West doesn't oppose military annexations (which neither should the UN accept), then naturally there's an opening for anybody to be retro-imperialist. — ssu

    The conventional wisdom is that China is supposed to start playing the role of global peace keeper. They want to be a super power, so that goes with the job.
Home » frank