. A lot of time friends don't tell you they think your significant other sucks because they don't want to alienate you, and then when it all falls apart they say "yeah, I knew she was a train wreck," and you're like, "why didn't you tell me," and they're like "because you wouldn't have listened" and you're like "true." So what I'm saying is that there is a degree of maturity in listening to others and hearing them out. Other people can bring a perspective you don't have, and it's not an abandonment of individuality to listen to them. — Hanover

I cannot tell you how many times I have been the person not saying anything because they would never hear me...until they are ready.

Likewise, I have selectively shared times of rough waterz in my marriage with two friends, one of whom has confessed that they knew but didn't say anything to me. The other friend here in the forums, is able to bring a perspective to the situation people who have been together for decades can posses and are willing to share.

It's not how I usually use conversation, except when I want to be manipulative. But you bring us neatly back to transactional analysis - I'm ok, you're ok. — unenlightened

:up: Excellent read

Now, if they react to your comedy-take, and especially if eye-contact is made, then you're dealing with a grand-master. The end-game is much harder to train for as it is both seldom reached and highly circumstantial. I've only entered a handful of end-games myself, but luckily all my opponents immediately reigned by mentioning the weather. Good thing too. Lord knows what I'm capable of when backed into such a corner... — VagabondSpectre

To which I see your "nod" and raise you one more level of the "elevator" game.

Just as the elevator door is closing, with no eye contact, move your body close to the another passenger, invading their personal space and see the response. Many will stop the doors from closing, exiting quickly without explanation. A few will mumble about forgetting something before departing the elevator.

Once in a blue moon I will get someone who does exit the elevator, does not stare blankly at the wall but rather smiles brightly and says "Hello".

Grand Master Level :cool:

Isn't that the whole point of "for better or for worse..." — Hanover

God I hope so as I have no desire to start over.

If my dog doesn't like you, chances are there is a reason and I trust them with my life so...... :chin:

I now accept that the big event is going to have to happen first before we will be able to get our minds around the revolutionary situation the knowledge explosion has created. — Jake

Hi Jake!
I missed the thread in which you are speaking of but as a late comer may I ask you what "big event" you speak of?

Chocolateeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

@Moliere @Caldwell
I don't know if you have seen this but for those that doodle? I think this is AWESOME! You pull out fresh paper as you need it and roll the used paper into a scroll. For someone like me who keeps calendars as a record of sorts this is a huge discovery. It would be something I would love to inherit from someone like my Mom, to read her life right there on paper. An amazing diary without realizing you are entering in it.

The view I had of Heaven from the back patio of a ranch I was caring for this week

Indeed. The act of seduction and its anticipations is so stimulating that some, I believe, sabotage every stable situation resulting from successful seduction to repeat that initial excitement. As you imply, that excitement is founded on projection and therefore ignorance. Successful monogamy seems to me to involve a trading of excitement for security. — fart

What do you mean by trading excitement for security? Do you mean between the two people in the monogamous relationship? Or do you mean something else?

And we might also ask about the degree to which fantasy invades actual sex. I've known some who claim not to fantasize at all during sex acts, but I'm inclined to believe that many supplement the sensual happening with an imaginative frame. — fart

I agree with "some you have known" that the best sex acts with another achieve a state of nothingness in the mind. It takes a LOT of distraction to get the thinking mind lost on physical sensations and vulnerable enough to allow another to carry their sense of control, to the degree that allows for that blank minded orgasm to occur. Maybe it is a female thing? Maybe it is a 'thinker' thing? Or maybe it is just a "Tiff" thing? Regardless of how many of us there are, it makes for a challenge to clear the mind in a society that always has us thinking.

And this is how I learn how my name has been demeaned and used for a cheap thrill? — Hanover

:rofl: I'm sorry Hanover. I would ask for your forgiveness but not before coming completely clean and informing you that you are also a fire fighter. :up: :halo:

Can't a man write satirical erotica for a woman without everyone trying to make it about sex?

It's 2018 people... — VagabondSpectre

I am guessing you are speaking tongue in cheek as most "erotica" satirical or not is still dipping into the inner sensual pool of others.

Which is why I made the comment about penning personalized erotica. Written erotica, especially for women, is some of the most favored form of sexual self arousal. As a result inserting someone's name or nickname into the written story increases the connection between the reader and her inner being that she often keeps protected from being put into vulnerable positions.

The fantasy that is created in the mind by words read, can rarely be matched by a partner in bed. :wink:

Did it actually make anyone uncomfortable? — VagabondSpectre

Nope.

Why all this talk of flowers?
Have I not mentioned in the last decade the word chocolate once or twice to you guys? :roll:
It's like a pony keg of beer for you all...

I will be in your lovely state a week from today. Dilion I believe. We are our states sales representative for a company based in CO. They have always held the event in Long Beach, CA but that is right next door to us, so I am really excited about it. :starstruck: I haven't been to CO since 2004

The sound of the pouring rain. God what a treat :flower:

@Rank Amateur
Welcome to The Philosophy Forum!
We are glad you are here.

She farted..." — VagabondSpectre

Damn you were doing so well, I almost suggested you pen personalized soft porn and will make a mint but then reality crashed thru the fantasy. Surely you could edit that out for the printed rendition. :up:

A Tequila free Margarita! Ole'

Amputation is a possibility but not probable. Can I get you a beer to keep you busy resting your foot?

No major spasms today yet... hope it's not saving it all for tonight. — Lone Wolf

A banana before you got to bed should keep the spasms at bay. The other thing you can do is take Magnesium, slow release Magnesium if you can find it. It loosens the muscles.

Itchy. Very itchy. I think that is from the wrap though. It can pop in like 2 or 3 different places too. — Lone Wolf

Ughhh...will it heal on it's own?

Gun controls should be focused on people that are obviously dangerous, criminals and mentally ill, and more money should be spent on preventing guns getting into their hands. — Sir2u

Amen.

Ask them, not me. But what does this have to do with gun control? — Michael

It has everything to do with the reason behind people's desire to control firearms.

The legislature is quite capable of passing legislation to pay for scientific institutions to look into why people kill each other. So why do they not do so? — Sir2u

Because most of the mass shootings stem back to an imbalance in the mind within one person or very rarely two and mental illness cannot be seen but only expressed. When it is expressed in the non verbal way with a firearm, people listen and begin to think about where the motive part of this action was formed.

Anytime someone says "God Damnit" I respond with "Why are you bringing HIM into this?"

Calling out the wrong child's name in anger and then having to swear yourself into finding the right name! You know which one of you I am talking about! Get in here!

Hard work is called hard for a reason. - BFF Gidget

Never judge another for you never know what they might be dealing with behind closed doors. - Mom

There is a difference between "knowing" and "doing". - My response to telling my kids to do something and they say "I know Mom!"

If someone has a problem with you and you like who you are, that is their problem not yours. - me

Don't get mad, kill them with kindness. - Mom

When it's harder to suffer than change, we change. - not sure

Do what you love, do it honestly and with everything you have and the 'rest' will follow. - Dr. S

Only you know the answer to that question. - Grampa about relationship advice

If the truth hurts, it is time to change it. — Sir2u

Ouch

Maybe it was a personal request to be banned? Either way I think this thread will be moved to "Feedback" so while it remains public (not within the administrators den) you must be a member to log in and read it.

@frank
I honestly appreciate you asking my opinion. I am sorry that I have been unable to convey it to you in the personal manner in which I am expressing it for you insist on making it into an untrue generalization.

Thank you for saying what I was trying to get at. You did it so much better than I could ever. It took courage. I know it also means you trust us, which means a lot to me. — T Clark

At the moment I am horrified with myself but I am honest, to a fault at times, but not this time. I am glad you can feel the words and the spirit in which they were spoken for they speak for themselves. I do trust you and those here attending this thread or I wouldn't share. Nothing in my opinion of you or anyone else here has changed except for a deeper understanding of us all. :heart:

Ok, so I'm learning something new. You're saying that it is normal for a woman to be afraid of her husband. — frank

I think I have answered you're question with my own words, so there is no need to generalize what I said from a personal perspective. If it is enlightening to you, than I am glad I shared my view, gained from my own personal experiences.

However, let me be crystal clear, I had no idea who made the quote you asked me to address and I don't regret being brutally honest with you. I do however feel as though I have been slighted by myself for not reading back to who said it before I answered. I would never want to hurt someone for being honest and this is a place that I am just now reconsidering a "safe place" to share and for that reason I offer my apologies to @T Clark for not researching the quote.

I wouldn't have changed my response but I would have, WOULD HAVE addressed my honesty with him in a Private Message. Why? Because I care very deeply about how vulnerable we have to allow ourselves to be, in order for us to grow as lovingly as we can, when we are examining/extracting something that doesn't come from the most beautiful place in who we are as humans.

I trust that we are all adults here and can continue on this thread, respecting each other for who we are and what we have attempted to rise above within ourselves. Sharing, unfiltered, is the only way to live. Otherwise? We are wasting time playing games with one another.

Anyhow, hi, again, attempting to write in a grammatically correct fashion is taxing, so I hope there's a chill spot on this forum I can go to. I can't stand always sounding like I have a stick irreversibly lodged in my ass. — AlmostOutlier

Hiya AlmostOutlier and welcome!
The chillest place is also the place where some of the best conversations take place and that is in the "Shoutbox" thread. Feel free to jump into the conversation! As far as swearing is concerned, as long as your posts are not laden with them for no real purpose, you should be okay.
Enjoy your stay~

In my dreams, maybe. lol. — Lone Wolf

How's the foot?

Sexual relationships (as distinct from friendships) on its own is only sex and economics, thus to maximise the pleasurable and meaningful experience of sexual intimacy one must form an honest friendship, as an absence of which would make it this bleak capitalistic transaction with false "games" or social requisites (hey, i'll buy you chocolate on Valentines day, that must mean I love you :roll: ) in order to play 'house' or pretend that there is some meaning other than it being sex and economics. Friendship between two lovers makes the relationship real, it generates the conditions that produces a consciousness of ourselves and our place in the world, or what meaning and goodness is through the interpersonal experience. — TimeLine

Your response is making me examine my own time line of how things came about from my being single to being 'in love' with someone and which came first, the horse or the carriage. I think many times it is easy to fall in love with the idea of being 'in love' but the newness wears off, the work begins and one of us would bail. It seems like how that work/attention (on the growth of the synergy) is silently delineated between the two people but never verbally expressed that causes a lot of hair line cracks, that over time shatter the relationship. If I never express to him how I feel, how can I hold him accountable for not fulfilling my expectations about the chores or my desires in the sexual realm? I shouldn't have held him accountable but I did even though I never verbally expressed my wants to him.

From this I learned that I am the only one I can set expectations for and truly be disappointed in for not reaching. I try REALLY hard not to set up expectations for anyone else and I am rarely disappointed and often gently surprised with others actions. If I am disappointed by someone's behavior, I look back over where it was that I formed and placed an expectation on who they are, how I think they should behave and analyze why I allowed that expectation to creep in and how to keep it from happening again. I am hardly good at it but at least I keep the control to do something about it, in the only place where I can do something about it, in my wheelhouse, not theirs.

This is why I said that I wish I could have been friends with that guy because what that would mean is that he would have had that 'switch' turn on, that he would not have been so cruel and callous but rather he would have stopped and become conscious of me and how his behaviour is hurting me. The love in friendship is what makes one understand and care without any ulterior motives other than wanting them to be happy. He did not have any empathy and friendship enables empathy or moral consciousness, that 'switch' that makes one understand others and ourselves, the importance of our behaviour and our responses. — TimeLine

In a way, I wish you could have been friends with that guy too but honestly, I don't know that friendship alone would have made the difference. I would like to think that I am friends with my husband but even we know how to be cruel to one another and when times get bad, those bad habits can come out. It doesn't always feel wrong and maybe that is where I need to do some work, maybe I should feel bad for having feelings or anger that is unwarranted but regardless I can acknowledge that they exist.

I don't wait anymore if I feel something about someone, good or bad, I am pretty quick to express it directly to them. It frees me up to move onto the next feeling that is heading towards me and how I will express that one. I admit I can be a long day when it comes to interacting with me and my stream of consciousness. I am not everyone's cup of tea but I like who I am and that is what truly matters. I need not tell you that you need to love yourself completely before you can love another but since I already typed it, I'll leave it.

Suuuuure lol. If I could even wiggle my toes enough to be level, that would be an achievement. — Lone Wolf

I sure hope you have a ranch hand to help you out as you STAY off of your foot.

I have a friend who's fearful of his wife's emotional tirades, so he walks on eggshells around her. Why does he tolerate it? Some folks are just fucked up I guess. They're on to 20 years like this, so maybe this is their brand of happiness. — Hanover

So is he physically afraid of his wife as I was asked?

You'd probably get more insight by asking the person who said it, rather than inviting us to talk about it. — fdrake

I could really only answer from my own experiences which are as sorted as the next gal's. Much more of a generalization than a specific answer.

I am not sure Hans is entirely aware of just how offensive it is to tell me that I am in love with a man who treated me so badly and that speaking of him and trying to understand him equates to having those feelings for him. The rhetorical landscape that we find ourselves traversing may ultimately lead to some errors in communication or misunderstandings - particularly when I speak of love which I see as moral consciousness and not romantic or sexual love, to be morally aware and care for all people - and being told that I am romanticising my understanding of moral consciousness is clearly a misunderstanding of who I am. In addition, people often project their own experiences and feelings and forcefeed it to others claiming that this is what you think rather than actually attempting to understand what they are trying to say. I am aware that what he said to me was completely wrong, so I can only conclude that he is the one feeling that way. — TimeLine

My feeling is that once I meet someone, from that moment on, I have a relationship with them, shallow or deep, long lasting or just a "Hi" in passing, they are now part of my life experience. Not all become close to me, in fact I let very few people in life close to the real me, because those I allow close have an ability to toss a question into the heart of who I am and I am eager to entertain that thought and if it is someone I trust, they can challenge who I am fundamentally. Those close to me make me look inward, when I thought the answer was within another or my failure to not have what it took to make the relationship work.

My point being that my relationship with my exes are just as much a part of who I am as those who choose to be around me today. Even if I swear to never speak to someone again, that is a relationship, one that needs resolving but that would be for another day. Relationships exist once they are formed, we meet someone and our energies mix with theirs and if we are lucky there is synergy created between the two of us. That synergy needs nurturing and attention or it will fade away, not completely but just out of view. As soon as I pay attention, good or bad, to that synergy, it thrives. The best I can do is make peace with what I have invested in the relationship and hope it is reciprocated but only if it is freely given.

Maybe he is having a hard time moving on? — TimeLine

Like I said, relationships morph over time and circumstance but I cannot "move on" or act like it never existed because I gave my love and I will never regret that. I may regret whom I give it to and who I trust but that will not stop me from giving the next relationship a fair shake.