Dogma to you maybe what the world thrives on, but it is not what birthed you nor any other individual who entered this parenthesis of time. So, to you the question: What dogma is the causation of cause and effect? - jufa

What is metaphysical poetry? I've come to understand from the rhymatic thumping beat of my heart metaphysical poetry is abstract writing of rhythm for life's dances. Much akin as a musician, a painter of abstract musical tones and noted symbols, serving ideas for a mental idealist abstractionist of silent projections individualized for interpreted thinking.

The metaphysical poet brings forth the rhythm of words stepping in tune with ideas speaking to one's mind with hope their words become a dance seen within consciousness' invisibly movement in the abstractness of musical notes upon the painted screen behind the uvea as ideas yet to be noticed tangibly by the mass.

The metaphysical poet is driven by hope and belief and gratitude in the Spirit of the Creator's gift to him or her, made available if only for a moment recognized to be brought forth in the Spirit of synchronized alignment.

The dreamer, the painter, the philosopher, the ditch digger, the prostitute, the alcoholic, the executive, the statesman, presidents, kings, rulers, and all individuals who make up the rhythm of breathing that is descriptive of the rhythm of poetry, dancing, and the musician's vibrating tone of atonement to value one, to value all, for all are an extension of the waves of life and living.

We ask so much and give so little to the collective whole of our being. We only realize a fraction of the beat of the infinite movement of the law of the Spirit of life, which is the true empowerment of the vibrating waves defining poetic living in all degrees, realms, spheres, dimensions, circumstances, situations, and conditions of our awareness.

We do good when we find we are empowered by the rhythm of poetry, dancing, and music more than the poet, dancer, and musician.

We are all poets and dancers. dancing to the rhythm of the musician's musical notes, and painted visions captured on canvas within our idealistic minds. Living is all poetry, all rhythmic music.

Come, won't you please? Come dance on the words of the poet to the breath of life, and -The Dance of Grace.

Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

Before one reply to anything they should discern who the conversation is from and to who. With this said it should be understood no individual can understand, answer another individual, or give precise insight to words concerning anyone journey into themself if they have not been in that individual's mind. They can only relate to their own experiences. With this stated let's leave the air of assumption and what is another individual's opinion released and remember everything a person experiences can be seen as truth. In this context, the truth is that the Principle and Pattern of the universe dictates that everything reproduces after its kind. Consciousness does not discern between sizes, moral judgments, or various dimensions and realms. It only recognizes the intention behind thoughts, even if the person is unaware of this intent. Thus, when one questions the presence of God or man during hardships or wonders why certain events occur, it's important to understand that the Principles and Patterns governing life, and the living within it, remain constant.

Everything in an individual's life constitutes their truth - [You have presented Krishnamurti truth, not yours] It is a truth that each individual person has shaped, lives, and instills in their children. When I refer to their children, I am not speaking of those born of physical intercourse.

Man's true offspring are his thoughts. Not a single second passes in the continuum of life without him being both the birth mother and father to his thoughts. Thoughts are the true offspring of mankind, and the decisions, the by-products of what one has assimilated, adhered to, and chosen to guide oneself, shape the nurturing of these thought offspring. These nurturing dictates who a person becomes, the nature of their life, and the manner in which they interact with and are influenced by their thoughts as they venture out, find their place, and return bearing the fruits and weights of their upbringing and their acceptance of it.

Everything that occurs in a person's life unfolds according to the Principles and Patterns of Consciousness's intention and purpose. Whether one believes in or comprehends the Principle and Pattern of Consciousness, it is certain that all Consciousness can offer to humanity, or an individual, is to bestow upon each what is sought through words, actions, and thoughts—whole, perfect, complete, and pure—because it is the law of the Spirit of life of the Principle and Pattern of infinity, extending into infinity..

All the smartness, arrogance, and self-righteousness a person exhibits towards themselves, and others are their just deserts. These rewards manifest in all forms perceived as good and evil. So, when one asks, "Why me?" the answer is, "Why not you?" You have set your circumstances, conditions, and situations in motion according to the intent of the thoughts you conceived and nurtured. They cannot return to you empty; they are your reality. No one escapes the consequences of their actions in this world; it always returns to complete its cycle. And since the physical realm is connected to one's thoughts and interpretations, including physical children, family, friends, and loved ones, they too are impacted in your conscious world of thought. This is why it is said to be careful with your words and actions, for the magnitude and intent of what you set in motion will return after many days, whole, perfect, complete, and pure, without discrimination in your conscious world of thoughts.


Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

I find your words agreeable to my soul.

"IN THE OLD DAYS THE STORY WAS TOLD AS THIS, ---WOD, THE WILD HUNTSMAN---

The hounds of the wind often howl on a dark night over the moors, within the woods, or beside a crossroads. Country folk know that the leader of the sky-dogs is Wod and they pity the poor traveler who has not yet reached his home, for Wod is often malicious and seldom kind. The wild huntsman spares only those who keep to the middle of their path. He thus often calls out to travelers, "In the middle of the way!" - jufa

In order for you to say those things are part of the course, you must tell what the course is, and whether it's original intent & purpose included suffering & struggle. Generalizations makes your reply empty of volume. - jufa

Simply minimal, progression is thinking beyond how one thinks at 20yr than at 10yrs.
Odyssey complications is learning how to keep moving in the high and low of one's situations, circumstances of the walk of life. - jufa

Dogma is what the world thrives on. One can say whatever they may, think and
believe they wear big hats on small heads because of their academic, philosophical psychological learning, but at the end of , no one has any probative absolutes to offer anyone other than experience, which is singular and personal. So regardless of subject matter all projected information given and received is hearsay. Or pure dogma, or I think, I. a believe assumptive dogma. - jufa

No one can receive anything that is not of their conscious. Everything in one's conscious is of the life they are. Being no one can leave out of their life regardless of the term used (astro-projection - out-of-body experience) they must be within themselves to be aware of the event. This is saying their is nothing out-of-body to be aware of but what they are aware of behind their uvea. - jufa

Posted: 29 Jun 2007 17:14

There is no logic for existence - Julius Fann Jr

There is no logic for anything in this universe to exist. To be more precise, there is logic to existence. Now this means that all that exists in the universe should not be, and therefore, dealing with the effect will always lead one to deduce that which has no meaning.

Let me step back and offer a personal analysis and interpretation by asking myself, what is? In asking, the answer was pulled out of thin air and fell at my feet, saying there is no logic to creation; therefore, there is no logic to the universe nor humanity. Being such, that which occupies the universe as a mind filler has no logic to exist, inclusive of man, which is the reason no human mind can find intellectual cognitive fillers to anything beyond the eyelid. No philosophy, spiritual, nor reasoning comprehensible has ever given reasoning for creation to exist. Such dialogue, as here then, is pure assumption for that which should not be for humanity to worship that which should not exist - materialism.

Regardless of one's belief in the logic or illogic of creation, belief alone is not enough, and does not overarch the truth as articulated by the Apostle Paul: "I perceive that in all things ye are superstitious. For as I passed by, and beheld your devotion, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. WHOM THEREFORE YE IGNORANTLY WORSHIP, HIM DECLARE I UNTO YOU. God is the world and things therein, seeing that He is Lord of heaven and earth figuratively, dwelleth not in temples made with hands, neither is he worshiped with men's hand, as though he needed anything, seeing he giveth to all life, breath, and all."

Now for this writer, this alone nullifies any metaphysical, or scientific, or attempt to speak one cause and effect, being they ae of the mindset of laws dealing with human speculations, religion or other teaching which has rules and by-laws dealing with materialism and human mind cognition. Furthermore, it nullifies the belief that there is another god of this world who has dominion over inner Spirit, Christ, whose altar no human is attentive. At this point, it must be emphasized that mere belief is not sufficient to make one a true believer, as the supposed god this world, whom some call Satan, also believes in God. Yet, considering the impact of his beliefs on the world, should a Satan indeed be real.

In short, there is no logic to the universe because there is no logic for existence, with one exception, and that is found in Rev.4:11, "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honor and power; for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created." - jufa

Come on khaled, stop playing the 'I don't know what you mean game', you know the deal. Thank you for the conversation, I take my leave at this point.

It is self-explanatory, but since you don't want to acknowledge what I 'm saying, let's regress to a lower stage. A noun needs an adjective to have an active life. That is saying if the noun can never clarify its meaning, it is as the salt in the dead sea. The adjective is therefore noun's substance for it gives the noun size, shape, age, color, origin or material. What is the adjective for nihilism? Please elaborate!

It can not only not be the main point of nihilism, there can be no point for nihilism to be objectified for an object needs a subject, and nihilism has none.

There is no logic for existence, and so, there can be no logic for nihilistic relativism.

There can be no logic to nihilistic relativism, for nihilism cannot exist when everything is a continuation of The Oneness which constitute not only the eternality of thinking, but also the infinity of life and being. Surrounded by the continuum of The Living One (you), and life indwelling all within and without the surround of that living one, the thought of nihilism can't be anything but nothinglessness, and, therefore, nihilistic relativism can't be anything but a misnomer in the mind which entertain such a thought, or utter it from windpipe. But this is typical of a metaphoric thinking intellect. It is no different than fishing in a dead sea. What is the logic for fishing in a dead sea?

In reading through this topic I stepped into a void of nothingness. This is what nihilistic thinking is, it has no value whether secular or spiritual inclined. How can value be placed upon assertion which project life has no distinct meaning or purpose when this topic is meaningful to its participant's expressions? What is the logic for nihilism? Does it matter what nihilism state or not when all thinkers who enter this 4square circle of human living are on a mission of nihilism? What philosophy, religion, socialistic moral, or religious consciousness will seed words and usher mankind beyond the reciprocal dialog here, when these elements of the human race has not changed relativism to Oneness of Consciousness which constitute the activity of eternal meaning for all who live?

Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa

"A rose by any other name is still a rose."

A deductive or Inductive argument, whether claimed to be what one knows or expressing what they have experience, has no strength when the premise of their knowing is not exposed. And irrespective of what you state to be your inductive argument it is reasoning, and reasoning flat line is conceptual. And not only that, no man has ever found anything which would allow him to open a door into his invisible foundation, which cannot be verified by his sense mind. Why? Because men climb the backs, and ride the thought wave of other men, and advance those thoughts according to their human indoctrination, teachings, and beliefs, and intellect. What you state you know does not belong to you.

Now you keep saying I have not presented a a specific premise of argument, but when I tell you

You cannot say testimonial evidence is not testimonial evidence when given as a testimony.

and you do not refute it, then your lack of response says you have ran into a dead end, and you have no other recourse by to say I have not presented myself specific in context. Oh well!

Sam26, I have gave my opposition. You cannot say testimonial evidence is not testimonial evidence when given as a testimony.

What are discussions, or debates but differentiating opinions. Is not your topic an opinion?

I have responded to what you have presented in points, and irrespective of what you state

I've clearly distinguished between testimonial evidence that's hearsay, and testimonial evidence that has an objective basis

. No matter what argument you present you cannot separate the object from the subject.

Hello, I am a new member of this forum, and after reading some of the comments here, and skimping others, to me what is called valid testimonial evidence fits into the system of 'hearsay' because of relativism, not precision. Relativism is an assumptive meaning, so out of the gate it's strength is weak for a testimony produces a multi-variety is images which does not bare witness with the experiential experience testified to.

Testimonial evidence is nothing new, abstract, or even mystical, it is the common language of people the world over in communicating issues of relativism.

All language is metaphysical for language express thoughts relative to what is understood by individuals, or a society for recognition of accepted images, or stories presented to individuals or a society. But language is not mystical. Mystical language cannot be expressed, only conceptualized relatively metaphysical, for mystical language is beyond the reach of another's interpretation, or mass idealism.


Never give power to anything a person believes is their source of strength - jufa