It's interesting to think about. I don't think such a service is possible, and I think the closest thing you're going to get to relieving psychological pain is drugs. If such a service were a thing people could charge good money for it.

I've already answered what I thought about Ngo being hit. It's in my previous post.

My problem with your comments was, that you claim multiple journalists were assaulted by Antifa. I haven't seen one example of it and the one you did give is a bad example for various reasons. Meanwhile, there was a lot of footage of journalists being assaulted by police in the beginning of the BLM protests. — Benkei

You said that it was criminal which is not the same thing as saying that it was wrong. Do you think it was wrong and that it shouldn't have happened?

For multiple journalists you've got Ngo and I said the "colored conservatives" which is a small youtube channel of conservative journalists/reporters. Those are a few I can name off the top of my head but I'm sure there's more. Antifa also routinely shouts down and tries to shut down conservative speakers on college campuses so it really should be no surprise that they've got an anti-conservative journalist bent. I'm sure there are more journalists who have faced assaults or threats; it fits with their view of "fighting fascism."

We're not talking about the police either and I don't see how it's relevant to the discussion. The police doing bad things doesn't justify groups in opposition to the police also doing bad things.

With real partisan talking points; once you scratch the surface most of it turns out to be untrue. Andy Ngo does not deserve to milk this situation and he certainly shouldn't be lying about his injuries. The guy that hit him should be fined. The rest is just milkshakes and spaghetti spray which a provocateur and probable criminal like Ngo deserved. — Benkei

Have you seen the medical reports on Andy Ngo? How do you know that he's lying about injuries? I've seen interviews with him and his speech definitely seems off and likely indicates some form of brain or face damage. I don't know how you can immediately conclude that he's lying. I don't even know how Rolling Stones can conclude it unless they've seen the medical reports. There were actually two separate assaults on Andy Ngo, according to Andy Ngo, but then we go down this rabbit hole of you probably not believing Andy Ngo and etc. etc.

If you look on the video though there were numerous men who attacked him with fists and hit him with objects. You can't dispute that. I feel like we should move on from this point because it's not too important to our central discussion.

Your identification of people being clad in black being part of Antifa is problematic because likely to be wrong. — Benkei

I never said everyone clad in black is antifa, but some % of them are likely to be. The truth is we're just dealing with uncertainty and this makes plenty of people uncomfortable. I'm happy to extend the definition/our conception of antifa to militant far-left groups in general, here in the states we just mostly refer to that group or groups as "antifa." Would you be more satisfied if we referred to them as far left militants? There's also quite a bit of documentary footage and literature out there about these groups. I think the umbrella term used here is just the "antifascist movement." They consider themselves warriors, fighters.

While it's true that some lone wolfs may identify as Antifa, it is not the case that Antifa falls within either category the FBI is really worried about. — Benkei

Antifa isn't destabilizing the government anytime soon. I've never claimed them to be a massive threat to US national security. And yes, like you've said earlier they're often difficult to identify and we can doubt whether random people dressed in black and assaulting others are antifa - but whether we like it or not that's the clothing we've come to associate them with. It could be some other far left group, who knows. The crips and the bloods and other gangs have their own dress codes and we could see people in these dress codes committing crimes but we'll never know for certain whether it's them until much later after they've been arrested and interrogated. I don't think antifa's violence is a real security threat to the US, but the way they go after conservative speakers and try to shut down discourse is disconcerting.

One of the things you mentioned, protests, isn't a problem and by law the people have a right to protest. The majority of the protests have indeed been peaceful. This brings me to another point, ANTIFA is an ideology, a statement you and I have both agreed with. So individuals who identify as ANTIFA, are not members of a group but are individuals espousing a belief in an ideology.

Pro-Life is also an Ideology. Do you think every pro-lifer spends their time outside of abortion clinics shouting profanities at employees and scared women seeking abortions? I'm Pro-Life, but I don't do that. I also identify as ANTIFA (Now don't rush to judge or throw the baby out with the bathwater because what I have to say is monumentally important and it would benefit you and everyone on all sides of all ideological debates to hear it) but I am not out Looting or burning or assaulting anyone and even if Trump wins a second term, I still probably won't be doing any of that. I'm human and I've been angry at times and when we get angry we think of doing stupid things, sometimes we do those stupid things to different degrees. I wouldn't judge you in the slightest if you told me that the thought hadn't crossed your mind to go out and assault people you see protesting. We all have those kinds of thoughts from time to time, especially about the things that mean a lot to us.

Why is this? Because the modal quality of my ANTIFA ideology and my Pro-life Ideology are personal and based on my individuality, just like ANTIFA who are out on the streets looting and burning, and the ones PEACEFULLY protesting... Or, like you. In the last few messages to me you have expressed ANTIFA ideology, yet you're not out looting and burning either. Instead you are having a collaborative, open, equal, equitable and honest conversation on the internet with people who disagree with you. On a philosophy forum no less. You might say that the Modal quality of our ANTIFA beliefs are like a super hard Titanium alloy, while the looters and burners are but lithium, a soft metal. — MSC

Yeah the protests are not a problem. I didn't mean it to appear that I thought the protests were a problem.

I believe antifa is both an ideology and a group, but not a centralized group as far as I can tell. It seems to be organized more on a regional/local basis. If we're going strictly by ideology then in the original sense of the word I'd consider myself an antifascist (as any decent person should be) - my issue is that the antifa of, say, the 1930s is not the same as the antifa of 2017-2020.

I think we need to be really careful in regard to whether we refer to it as an ideology or a group. My criticism is really geared towards the group - the (mostly) men who clad themselves in black and assault journalists and burn down stores and harass business owners. There's been many, many incidences where this has been documented.

but I am not out Looting or burning or assaulting anyone and even if Trump wins a second term, I still probably won't be doing any of that. I'm human and I've been angry at times and when we get angry we think of doing stupid things, sometimes we do those stupid things to different degrees. I wouldn't judge you in the slightest if you told me that the thought hadn't crossed your mind to go out and assault people you see protesting. We all have those kinds of thoughts from time to time, especially about the things that mean a lot to us.

Sure, I don't think anyone is to blame for their thoughts. You can certainly be blameworthy if you actually execute on those thoughts/fantasies though. To be perfectly honest, I've never fantasized about hurting the protesters though. I don't see anything wrong with protesting. I'm not mad at the protesters, but if you look at the facts of the destruction I think it's been pretty widespread. I know it's happened all across the country and now parts of my home city of Boston (entire blocks, many, many stores) have been destroyed. I don't even fantasize about hurting the rioters I just wish they would stop or maybe that there would be a stronger police response.

Instead you are having a collaborative, open, equal, equitable and honest conversation on the internet with people who disagree with you. On a philosophy forum no less. You might say that the Modal quality of our ANTIFA beliefs are like a super hard Titanium alloy, while the looters and burners are but lithium, a soft metal. — MSC

Yeah, this has been a surprisingly pleasant discussion. And I agree with you -- from a purely philosophical standpoint, I could very well be considered an anti-fascist. In the original sense of the word I think I am. However, I'd just really advise you to be careful identifying yourself with that movement because they are a group -- literature has been written on the group -- and they're not a democratic movement that supports open, free discussions. They very routinely shout down and try to shut down conservative speakers on college campuses. I honestly don't think the movement believes in free speech. They believe in de-platforming and not allowing conservative speakers to express their ideas because anything outside of their little box is labeled "fascist." I know you might just consider me
paranoid conservative, but I would encourage you to familiarize yourself with the group a little, not just the philosophy.

You really need to work on your reading comprehension.

The answer is multi-variable and complicated. I just can't give a simple, easy answer. I think this is an important discussion to have, but is a slightly different from the subject of police shootings. The two are related, but obviously cutting that crime rate would decrease the number of black bodies at the hands of police.

I hate to say it but probably because they commit a disproportionate amount of the crimes and in turn have a disproportionate amount of contact with the police.

Unarmed. You cited the source, didn't you read it? — Kenosha Kid

The bigger picture here is that there were 14 unarmed black people killed by June of 2019. The article mentioned this was 63% lower than the number in 2015, so presumably in 2015 we're talking like 25 deaths of unarmed blacks.... in the entire year....of a country of over 300 million, of which over 30 million are black.

Yet your point this entire time is that there is an epidemic, that white cops just walk up and shoot black people without consequence because they just hate black people. The numbers we're dealing with are so small here... imagine if there were 4 unarmed white men killed and 3 unarmed black men killed yearly. Sure the number is disproportionate, guess you win....?

I guess statistics weren't that important after all. — Kenosha Kid

No you just need to do a more thorough job and dig into it a little more.

How do you get by being so angry all the time? Must be hard.

Statistics are easy to find. You are twice as likely to be shot dead by police if you are black. Beyond statistics, there's a large number of reported cases, often filmed, showing police brutality against black people. There are remarkably few white George Floyd's. — Kenosha Kid

You realize there's a ton of dead white people you haven't heard of? There's also a ton of dead indigenous people you haven't heard of. Nobody cares unless it's a black man killed by a white police officer. There's actually a bunch of white George Floyds the media just doesn't care about them.

Twice more likely to be shot dead? Are they armed? Are you committing a crime? Are they a suspect for a crime? Why are they being shot? Did they surrender?

Does 14 shooting deaths of unarmed black in late June of 2019 constitute an epidemic? If there were 4 white men and 3 black men shot in the entirety of any given year you could also claim there was an epidemic of racist police officers murdering black people disproportionately. Very good use of statistics!

Blacks are also commit a disproportionate number of assaults and murders so they're unfortunately more likely to be in this type of situation where police are looking for a black suspect. You also only cited national statistics which may not be representative of where the bulk of the shootings are taking place.

The Heather MacDonald article? Where? You realize her thesis is that there's no epidemic of shootings of unarmed black people?

You gotta cite your sources man because that's not what mine are telling me.

Again, recognising no difference between lawful and inevitable killing and utterly unnecessarily murder. My issue is not that police kill. It is that police particularly murder black people. — Kenosha Kid

It's nearly impossible if not outright impossible to find stats on this. You've got some work to do if you're going to make this case.

And that's very telling. — Kenosha Kid

Jesus christ you are hyper-sensitive regarding a normal use of language.

and I can't imagine you have not been privy to much evidence -- that decent, non-racist, non-fascist white people are very much outraged by unjustifiable and particular police violence against black communities. — Kenosha Kid

Again, you need to find the statistics which prove that cops are just randomly murdering black people -- and only black people -- for no apparent reason/no apparent cause -- simply because they are black. And not only does this happen, but that this happens at an extremely high rate.

It is only against black people too - not any other race.

EDIT: The cops shoot around 1k people a year, the vast majority of whom are armed.

According to stats this year regarding unarmed victims:

"As of the June 22 update, the Washington Post’s database of fatal police shootings showed 14 unarmed Black victims and 25 unarmed white victims in 2019. The database does not include those killed by other means, like George Floyd."

No, I found it strange how you only mentioned black people being killed by police on numerous occasions despite more white people being killed by cops and there being no mention of any other race. I couldn't tell if you're just a black person concerned with issues within the black community (understandable) or some random white guy/non-black who's basically just virtue-signaling by only taking notice of one politically salient race. It comes across as very bizarre and in any case you just continue to straw manning my positions so I'm out.

If I recognise my personality influenced me to see as I do and you recognise that your personality influenced you to see as you do and we both recognise that our personalities are partly constructed by factors over which we had no control, how does that change how we should see the subsequent differences in our positions if they were the result of these differences? — Judaka

I don't think there's an easy answer to this one. Even people with a shared, common, lifelong experience can view the issue quite differently. I think it's more accurate to say how we process those experiences/personal circumstances comprises our worldview rather than just experiencing/going through them.

In practice it's difficult if not near impossible to break through to someone and penetrate their psychological starting points through argumentation, so I've come to prefer discussions over argumentative battles in these forums. Discussion is less confrontational and it allows us to express these personal circumstances in a non-confrontational way. With me at least over time I've shifted away from direct confrontation and more towards just listening and understanding when it comes to disagreement. These core views can be changed but it's going to a slow process most likely.

If that is all you're aware of, aren't you making the assumption that they are Antifa? If you don't know either way then mighten they not be a false flag? Hypothetically. — MSC

True, you never know for sure. We've seen protests and lootings and burnings across the country and only some the perpetrators have been identified as ANTIFA. I certainly don't think everyone who is committing crimes here are antifa. It's nearly impossible to get perfect statistics about this, but it's likely a mix of antifa, other left wing radicals, opportunists, criminals, and who knows what else. I'm happy to extend my argument here to left wing radicals in general. If there are right wing radicals in there I'd be quick to condemn them too obviously. I certainly don't buy that the majority of people committing the lootings and riots are really right wing radicals though.

The thing that bothers me is that many are jumping to conclusions prior to police investigations being finished and are conjecturing all sorts. On both sides really. For all you or I know, there are personal disputes or normal crimes being labeled as Antifa or Right wing extremists. — MSC

Absolutely. All we know is that antifa members have been identified behind some of the looting and assaults, but there's certainly a lot of confusion.

Are you of the opinion that neo-nazis don't exist in the USA? Sincerely asking. — MSC

No I belive neo-nazis exist in some measure in the US. It's important to distinguish neo-nazis from just normal racists and neo-confederates though. All racists are not the same. Don't get me wrong, I hate racists - I do believe neo-Nazis exist in some quantity (certainly in the prison system) but all racists are not equal. Actual neo-nazis are the worst of the worst in my book.

Since we are talking about killings, what did you think about the killing of BLM activist Oluwatoyin Salau? — MSC

I would have to look into that one and get back to you later. Yesterday I was looking to Breonna Taylor (horrific what happened) and Jacob Blake, but I'll get to Salau at some point. I have no problem condemning police officers when they commit like an actual crime as is what likely happened with Taylor. It's certainly happened we really just need to wait for all the facts before rushing to judgment.

All I really want to know is whether you support the assault on Andy Ngo.

Of course rolling stones isn't going to like a conservative reporter/journalist. Who would have thought a heavily left wing publication would dislike a conservative reporter/journalist/hack etc.? If I were to reference the National Review how do you think they would view Ngo? How do you think conservative sites view Seth Abramson or Sam Seder? It's a constant thing coming from both sides to try to discredit the other. I'm not going to blindly bandwagon one side here. I don't even care about defending Ngo's journalistic integrity right now. It's irrelevant.

This is why I hate politics and I prefer philosophy. All I want to ask you is whether you condone the assault. It doesn't even matter if he's a legitimate journalist or not. If someone spreads lies and publishes them then you sue them. If you watch the videos he's attacked by many black clad men and the crowd really doesn't stop them. There's also been a number of assaults on other conservative journalists like the youtube channel "the colored conservatives" by men clad in black.

How do you think I would react if, say, the proud boys assaulted a liberal journalist? Do you think I would immediately jump to their defense by trying to discredit the liberal journalist? Shitty behavior is shitty behavior it doesn't matter what side it comes from. This shouldn't be political.

Antifa violence and fear thereof are simply not grounded in reality. — Benkei

I never said antifa started the forest fires. What I am aware of is tons of footage on youtube of black clad men either assualting journalists or looting/burning stores.

So the whole "both as bad as each other" narrative you are trying to push doesn't really make much sense as the very reasons and motivations behind the existence are entirely different. To put it simply, if there were no Fascists, there would be no Antifa. If there were no Antifa, we would still have fascists. — MSC

I don't care as much about an organization's stated, ideological goals as I care about their actual actions. We've seen journalists assaulted, business owners harassed, businesses looted and burned. We have seen murders as well, Aaron Danielson for instance. To document all of these instances would be an awful lot of work, and often when they are documented the journalists who document them are just smeared as frauds or fascists themselves, so it's often not really worth talking about.

I think many of these antifascists operate under the premise that the American system is rotten to it's very core and since it can't be reasonably reformed it needs to be destroyed and rebuilt. So the violence follows from this and there's no discussion to be had. If you're one of the believers in this premise then I don't see our discussion going very far.

Your stated view is that the police who vet, recruit, train and arm the police who enjoy positions of authority over people have no responsibility for the lethal racists they unleash. — Kenosha Kid

I don't know Kenosha, can you look at someone and determine if they're a racist? If someone is actively racist then of course we should get rid of them and if we don't then that's an institutional failure but racism in practice isn't black and white. It's not just a white cop on black victim problem either. Black cops shoot black people at around the same rate.

You're the guy in the theatre standing up shouting 'They shouldn't be allowed!' having sat silently through two hours of violence against blacks. — Kenosha Kid

If someone is committing violence against you you always have the right to stand up for yourself. What you can't do is if one cop commits a horrible offense that he deserves to go to jail for tothen target every cop and start shooting cops indiscriminately. That's not how justice works. Target the actual individuals.

What pisses us off is that, after everything that's happened, after every crime that the right wing has perpetrated, defended, or remained silent on from slavery to George Floyd, you cry 'no fair' when a fascist gets so much as a punch in the teeth — Kenosha Kid

Just curious, are you black? This seems like a larger criticism towards white people. I don't get it. Do you want white people to apologize for slavery? Jim Crowe?

Change 'gay' to 'black' and 'Portland' to 'Tulsa', see if you still feel the same way. — Kenosha Kid

If you're talking about the Tulsa massacre of 1921 of course that was awful. The interesting thing is I'm fine condemning right wing violence, but with you guys I've noticed you're not willing to condemn any left wing violence so I usually just nope out after realizing that.

This is almost what the Antifa manual says. It warns against accepting people who are drawn to it for violence, against allowing violence to be a member's MO, but permits confrontation and self-defence. They seem as aware of opportunistic thugs as anyone. — Kenosha Kid

Great so lets get back to that.

So if Andy Ngo is a fraud and not a journalist do you support initiating mob violence against him? The damage was fairly serious by the way, he did suffer brain damage. You can watch it all on youtube.

Not really a good comparison. The brownshits were assaulting jews, gays, the disabled, Jehovah's witnesses and sympathizer of those demographics, plus others, whom they went on to kill in their millions. 6 million jews and 5 million of those other demographics were killed across nazi controlled Europe. — MSC

Sorry for the brief answer but I'm arguing against 4 other people here... I was referencing the brown shirts in the early 30s, before the wide scale assaults/killings started. My point was that a movement can be violent - as the brownshirts were - before racking up a high body count. This was in response to one of Kenosha's points earlier.

John McWhorter lays out what it is your dealing with in this topic, and why you are wasting your time trying to discuss the issue with them. — DingoJones

It's just a slow sunday morning here. Me and Streelight know we're never going to change each other's minds, it can just be fun to get it out there. With Benkei there is a chance of finding some common ground so who knows.

Would you agree with this statement: Although the stated goals and history of the antifa movement are noble, in recent times there has been some disturbing footage involving seemingly unprovoked assaults on the innocent including business owners and journalists. While fighting fascism is a noble goal, we encourage the antifa movement to show a little more constraint but also to continue to maintain vigilance in regard to fascism.

God, I should just listen to you Streelight because you obviously have all of the facts. In fact, you're so full of facts and knowledge of reality that you don't even need to look into actual details of events or happenings... the reality just follows from your mind, like for instance if we know that anti-fascists can't possibly be bad, then every instance where antifa supposedly assaulted someone is really just fascist propaganda or the fault of the fascist with antifa just defending itself. Thank you the instructive lesson. I feel much better know that I've been cured of my confusion.

If the answer is 'Yes,' a set of what can be called ethical/moral axioms come with it. — Torus34

Not necessarily. Someone could conceive of God in a way outside of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic tradition. Someone could conceive of God as Gaia or some type of universal mind or spirit in which case a systemic of ethics wouldn't automatically follow.

I don't care if their movement has extensive roots dated back to the 1920s and a heroic history of fighting oppression, the moment dozens of them begin assaulting gay minority journalists (see the andy ngo assault) and random business owners as they did in Portland you're just shit. I don't even care if they label themselves the biggest anti-racist and anti-sexist to ever exist, they're still shit. I don't care what they were in the 80s or 90s or even early 2000s. I'm talking about today's crop.

Since when has Antifa been active and what do you know of their history? What do they believe according to you? How often have they instigated violence? How often has that resulted in deaths? — Benkei

I don't know when they started, at least 2017. I'm dealing with them in their modern form. The core belief is that fascism ought to be physically fought and the problem nipped in its bud. It's an entirely reasonable belief on the surface because we all think back to Hitler, but it's when we put this into action and expand our definition of fascism is when things get tricky. There is some association between, say, nationalism and fascism but to treat them as the same is not fair and it's what we're often seeing today. Nobody is going to have exact statistics for frequency of violence instigated but plenty of cases have been caught on camera.

You characterised the entire organisation as violent on the grounds of overbroad definition of fascism — Kenosha Kid

no i characterise them as violent based on their beliefs and also actions. antifa is more of an ideology than an organized group. it's the belief that we ought to be quick to be use violence if "fascists" are active because their very presence is a threat. they are very openly quick to violence. no they don't have a giant death count but neither did hitler's brownshirts in the early 30s. would you even consider the brownshirts a violent group before they killed anyone? or was it fine because they were just assaulting some people and doing some marching and chanting?

Come to think of it, class awareness has kind of fallen by the wayside with identity politics/BLM nowadays. I actually find discussions of class to be much more interesting than discussions of race, personally. At least you can do something about class; no one's changing race anytime soon.

And yet one guy diesis murdered during a BLM protest and every anti-fascist is a criminal. The hypocrisy is incredible. — Kenosha Kid

FTFY. I never said every anti-fascist is a criminal either so you're straw manning me now. Strictly speaking I'm an anti-fascist.

Lets start here: Do you believe the group is violent/promotes violence? Also if they're not violent, why in a crowd of hundreds did basically no one step in to stop the assault on Andy Ngo as he was assaulted by dozens of men dressed in head to toe in black?

This is untrue. — Kenosha Kid

It was captured on cell phone video. It doesn't even matter though the guy admitted to it in a vice interview.

The leftists have their own definition of fascism under which mainstream right wing thinkers qualify as fascists.

I mostly agree with you here, I just think each instance where cops kill someone needs to be taken as an individual case and it's not fair to lump them all in as one so I get annoyed when people take every death-by-cop case under one umbrella. In those cases where cops did kill someone unjustly they should face criminal charges, not just be fired.

Was this based on due process? I'm joking. Fascism doesn't do due process. Allow me to rephrase. Was this based on the testimony of people who murder black people? — Kenosha Kid

That's ridiculous If you're going to arrest someone and they pull a gun on you you can't give them "due process."

There are witness reports which seem to back it up, but we're just not going to ever completely know the truth. His murder of Danielson was captured on video.

The organization is very openly violent, Kenosha. You should listen to people when they tell you who they are. Are you really going to make the case here that they're simply violent and assault-prone and not in fact murderous?

Because he killed Aaron Danielson and then drew a gun on police when they tried to arrest him?

Could be he’s pro-fascist and speaks ill of capital as an excuse so that he can wear all black attire. So vain. — praxis

Pro-fascist, anti-fascist.... both love the color black and silencing opposition. Horseshoe theory at it's finest.

a) Antifa has killed. Does the name Michael Reinoehl ring a bell? Earlier there was a terror attack that was stopped.

b) Most importantly where is the condemnation from antifa for these acts? Answer: There is none. Show me where antifa apologizes. Jesus Christ, look to Streetlight who's probably antifa himself. I don't agree with the man but at least he's honest and he follows his beliefs through to the logic conclusions. Ask any antifa protester whether they feel bad for dead cops. They're not going to feel bad. ACAB. You don't get it. If all antifa is about is "fighting fascism" then all of America - myself and NOS too - should join. Come on.

Again, the police openly commit acts of violence against black people and yet, as we've seen, you'd refrain from condemning them. But someone in the internet age calls someone a fascist and that's an enemy worth having. Am I being unfair? — Kenosha Kid

I condemn the policemen/women who commit egregious murder, but it's important we get the facts first before rushing to judgment every time someone is shot. Each case has its own facts. If the officer has committed an offense then of course we should punish them. Policemen have killed white men as well, you just don't hear about it because nobody cares especially if these white men are poor or mentally disabled.

It would be hilarious if Zn0n and Schop were the same person. In that case Schop would be carrying on long, drawn out dialogues just between himself in order to convince internet people of anti-natalism... a position which if everyone followed there would be no more human race.

The reason I'm more skeptical of antifa is that the far left operates with a different definition of "fascism" than the rest of the country. They'll call Ben Shapiro a fascist. They'll call mainstream right-wing thinkers fascists - and now consider that they openly advocate for violence against the fascists.

Basically anyone whining about people who are anti-fascist but who have nothing to say about right-wing violence is a fuckstick whose opinion is less than worthless. — StreetlightX

This reminds me of people who sidetrack discussions about race or gender with something like "oh but what about unattractive white men? my friend has a big mole on his face etc. etc."

Can anyone tell me how anti-fascists became the bad guys on Cloud Trump? Being an anti-anti-fascist doesn't seem like an obvious recipe for political success. — Kenosha Kid

The name doesn't mean anything. Just because you call yourself something like that doesn't mean you're on the side of justice. Antifa as a movement is militant and they have assaulted journalists, Trump supporters, and burned down and looted businesses. It's a standard leftist tactic that they'll name themselves something nice and then commit atrocious acts in the name of achieving their "utopia."

Amen. I'll respond to the leftists. I won't respond if a response is just total nonsense though, which I have seen here from some users (or maybe just "user" - now that I think about it, I can only think of one that's just been so far our of left field.) There's one left winger who I'm pretty sure is ignoring me though and I'm fine with that.