I guess he should have played more golf when they were trying to repeal and replace the ACA, build his wall that Mexico was supposed to pay for, and all during the Pandemic crisis. Hopefully, he's on the course right now.

It’s called mockery, Hiphead. I mock the way you simplify the world and make it small enough to feel as though you can grasp it. You cannot grasp it. It’s beyond reach. If you can accept that then your grasping will end and only you will remain. Naked and afraid perhaps, but alive, and alive as though for the first time.

Second paragraph... still with me?

So it would have been better politically for Trump to veto the bill before the election?

Whaddya bet the China virus hoax stops being a hoax after January 20th.

@NOS4A2 He vetoed the bill, however, it has a veto-proof majority.

I wish he weren't just posturing and actually worked for a better deal, but I think he's too busy undermining American democracy.

No other president has been pathetic enough to posture this way, sure.

Oh right, like this package is sooo unusual. :roll:

Either way it likely it would have passed silently had the president not objected. — NOS4A2

Makes no difference unless it's significantly revised, besides the posturing.

I'll throw out another problem in a Zen context for analysing stories. In the West we have a container model of language. The communication contains the truth. In Zen the point of stories is what they ELICIT. And that's why level of listener and setting are so important. It's not what the story means, it's what hearing the story does - which may include the meanings in the tools that elicit.

You get the 'right answer' or 'right interpretation' in words in your head and that may very likely be an obstacle. — Coben

Insight or intuition is highly valued in Zen, if that's what you're essentially referring to, but it's hardly alien to the West. If you're talking about koans, I don't know much about them. I understand them to be a form of contemplation (meditation).

From the mechanical perspective, the required understanding can be reached pretty much immediately through the use of common sense, by anyone who is at least a bit serious.

If eating too much is giving me indigestion, the solution is to eat less.

If thinking too much is making me nutty, the solution is to think less. — Hippyhead

The problem with relying on common sense is that it can be dangerously simplistic.

We are social beings with the capacity of reason, which means that we must necessarily apply reason to social living, and therefore in order to live well we must develop our reasoning. Trained animals do fit in society, but they can cause a lot of trouble if mismanaged or if conditions change.

It appears to me, like modern western culture has led us down a pathway where the individual person's need to develop the philosophical capacity to discern good from bad is completely ignored, or even hidden from us. It's as if we are taught that this moral capacity just comes naturally, through instinct. We can automatically discern good from bad without the need for philosophical training. It is also implied that the authorities are necessarily correct, or else they wouldn't be authorities. — Metaphysician Undercover

I would go a step further and say that individual moral development is suppressed because moral development leads to independence.

The context of the thread is a Zen Story and what it means. In Zen you will not find it recommended, in fact you will find the opposite, that one sit around and discuss in abstract terms what stories mean that likely to not fit where you are in your process. You will find the other activities, the non-meditation practices or dailty activities, to be practical, grounded, and ones to focus one's attention on. Getting and preparting the food, for example, and being present for that. There are suggestions in every branch of Buddhism I've encountered to focus away from abstract thought and also there is this idea that doing so ABOUT the spiritual ideas and stages and meansing can interfere with growth. — Coben

I think you know that this isn't really true because in all the activities that you list you've neglected to mention things dharma talks and the like, which are quite abstract and full of spiritual ideas. There may be some really austere Zen temples in the world but they're rare, and even so, must still be replete with abstract religious thought, because an essential feature of religion is meaning. Religious clergy of any tradition must supply meaning in the form of abstract spiritual ideas.

If it is just drawing from things that already exist? Wouldn't that just be copying things then and not being original or creative? — Darkneos

Creativity is just one aspect of art, but I think exists in any work of art, more or less. The results of dawing an object as realistically as possible, for example, would unquestionably be original to some extent. Even taking a photograph would be original to some extent, unless all the conditions of the photograph were exactly duplicated, which would be very difficult in most situations.

Have you ever observed a group of artists work from the same subject? The results are wildly different even without them trying to be original or creative.

This awareness creates a situation where you see something without discrimination, without conscious input, without us making it something. So you are seeing something in its original form, — Brett

Non-dual originality, :chin: , an original claim if I’ve ever heard one. :clap:

So our wise and courageous leader will veto, right? :razz:

I’m pretty sure that most people understand that there’s a difference between “being in your head” and the various practices of meditation, and that a person can practice meditation for a time without being in their head and at other times think freely without practicing meditation.

I think it’s true that we can develop a habit of introspective thinking or self-conditioning that is not conducive to meditation, or rather, deep meditation, and that a sustained practice of mental austerity may be most conducive deep to meditation (samadhi, satori, realizing emptiness, or whatever). Nevertheless, there’s really no reason that investigating the practice can’t be beneficial, is there? Religious folk make all sorts of claims and warnings, many of which are known to be false.

They threw everything at Trump and he mostly prevailed—impeachment, fake hate crimes, a hostile press, a violent opposition, investigations into him and his family, riots, organized protests, leaks, big tech and media censorship. — NOS4A2

Who is this "they" that controls government agencies, politicians, the judicial system, the press, BLM?, leakers (that he appointed?), big tech, and online media? The riots were not directed at Trump, btw, and if anything the rioters should hate Biden far more than Trump. Biden admits to "mistakes" but only time will tell if he puts real effort into reform.

I could only imagine what his presidency might have been like had cynical, anti-Trump forces given him a chance. — NOS4A2

More favors for capital and fewer favors for labor, essentially, plus a stupid big beautiful border wall and a massive deficit (despite slashing entitlements).

... and if covid didn't burst the bubble there's a good chance something else would have.

One need not know the truth in order to lie. — creativesoul

So if you were to unwittingly spread a lie that you believe was the truth you would be lying?

As example, imagine for a moment that it was somehow proven beyond any doubt that philosophy is a step backward in addressing these issues? What would be our response? If we were to choose to continue to do philosophy anyway, that would suggest it is the methodology of philosophy which is our priority and not the topic itself. There's no crime in that, but to the degree that were true, we shouldn't expect to make much meaningful progress on investigating the topic, as we're not really that interested in it. — Hippyhead

I shouldn't have to point this out but there are various ways of investigating something, and investigation can be understood as something besides that which is investigated. Investigating a murder, for example, isn't necessarily committing murder, or philosophical discussion about ethics isn't necessarily practicing ethical conduct.

It's foolish to think that investigating something can't be beneficial to the practice of what's being investigated.

The point of any real spiritual teaching is simply to allow you to forget about your own self-importance and just learn to be (a) happy and (b) useful. In order to do that, you have to cut through a lot of social conditioning and various kinds of other crap that has encumbered you from childhood onwards.
— Wayfarer

To me, such statements always raise the question of whether the problem which we are addressing arises primarily from thought content, or from the medium of thought itself. One argument for the later theory is that human psychological suffering would seem to be universally present in every time and place, irregardless of the culture and philosophies of that time and place. — Hippyhead

You’re overlooking the obvious fact that some people are more fucked-up than others, regardless of the culture and philosophies of any time and place.

Interesting.

I guess the Texas lawsuit probably went awesome too, in that it may have helped to generate more donation$ and merchandise sales, as well as giving the Trump herd something motivating to focus on.

On my art therapy course, one of my tutors told me that rationality was my dominant mode, and emotions as the inferior one so I try to avoid over analysing to redress the balance. — Jack Cummins

Perhaps you misinterpreted them, analysis is commonly contrasted with intuition, not emotion.

In terms of 'mistakes', I am often quite surprised by the way in which others, including some on this forum, jump in to point out to people that they are mistaken. It can be dismissive and defensive, and perhaps it is a cover up for lack of certainty. — Jack Cummins

It's an odd thought that a member would jump-in to cover-up their uncertainty.

The recent SpaceX landing is similar to the Texas lawsuit challenging election results?

I said nothing about Trump being admirable or desirable. — Hippyhead

You wrote:

Trump is a realist. That is his gift. He's dealing with the world the way it really is. Stupid. The evidence for this is that his strategies are working. — Hippyhead

This appears to mean that you believe taking advantage of ignorance for selfish gain is ‘realistic’ and expresses a ‘gift’.

You also say that he’s contemptible, however.

I think you’re simply not thinking clearly.

Apparently, Ted also has faith in the American voting system.

Poor Trumpsta's don't know who to follow.

Oh what a tangled web grifters weave...

You should be rather happy with the level of tyrannical nanny-statism in the US, given that there were 2,600 coronavirus deaths reported yesterday. China reported only 9 deaths yesterday.

Would you be happier if there were double or triple the number of Americans dead yesterday?

Diamond & Silk tell’n like it is... or at least reading their scripts aloud.

I composed a little ditty on an iPad.

Delirious

Is that Rudy G? — Nils Loc

Yup, though not a good likeness. I was just going for old batshit cray cray white guy and Rudy provided a bountiful muse.

Interesting ball game. :chin:

The main point I was making was how I disregard puritanical views. — Jack Cummins

Puritanical masturbation is hot, you don’t know what you’re missing.

I’m loving Trump’s efforts contesting the results of the election and his refusal to concede, not only because it puts a spotlight on America’s shoddy election process, but also because it renders his opponents silly. — NOS4A2

The hair dye dripp’n, shirt tuck’n, landscaping storefront book’n, conspiracy theory sling’n Giuliani is certainly enjoying the spotlight, and his silly antics are rather amusing.

I would argue that masturbation is about one of the only free ways of sexual expression in a broken and an increasingly coercive world. — Jack Cummins

Perhaps if you worked on your own coercive skills you wouldn’t need to pay so much.

It is about acceptance of one's own body and sexuality. In this way, it can be seen as a spiritual act. — Jack Cummins

Did a priest tell you that? :grimace:

Does the obsession's with the acquisition of material things inhibit enlightenment? Enlightenment, here, meaning the journey of discovery of ones self? — Dymora

I think it might be helpful to elaborate on exactly what is meant by enlightenment. There are roughly two meanings (Western and Eastern), as I see it, both dealing with self and neither necessarily inhibited by the pursuit of material well-being. The eye of a needle is a very small space and may be indicative of a too narrow perspective.

The Western conception is essentially about self-actualization, which could be seen as being liberated from our societal pavlovian conditioning. We can choose for ourselves what to drool over.

The Eastern conception is essentially about realizing our true nature, which is simply experiencing the emptiness of our nature. There are many methods to achieve this state, or it can occur spontaneously. Whatever the case, the primary benefits are mental depatterning and relief from existential anxiety.

Nope, they’re not the icy eyeballs of a tri-visioned alien monstrosity from outer-space. Your fanciful imagination would make even old Rorschach raise a brow. As Nils has aptly recognized, they’re juggling balls. Juggling balls that have sat idly on my work desk for so long that I don’t even remember from whence they came. They were initially positioned there, if memory serves, to act as a physical distraction during work breaks. I don’t think that I ever employed them in that capacity, however.

Each ball has two weird bunny-eared smiley faces on the white areas that I didn’t paint. If included they probably would have made them look less like icy eyeballs to you. Also in my defense, it was done with a new digital painting program that I just started learning called Procreate. The program has a dizzying amount of brush variables to work with and I haven't worked out a configuration that I like yet.

Nice balls. — Baden

No one's ever told me that before, thanks!