Sooner or later explanations reach a dead end — RussellA
when "gravity" means no more than a rock falls to the ground when released. — RussellA
The OP describes the PSR ... — RussellA
In this way, the PSR is also called “Principle of Parsimony” or “Occam’s Razor”: the simplest explanation that accounts for all the data is the most reasonable one. — A Christian Philosophy
We posit three explanations — A Christian Philosophy
It depends on the meaning of "reason" — RussellA
Thus, if all objects in existence are explained, by 1 of the 3 types of reasons as per the OP section "PSR in Metaphysics", then existence is also explained. — A Christian Philosophy
On the epistemology side, yes, that is, our knowledge of the PSR is defended by that premise. — A Christian Philosophy
This occurs when we lack data. — A Christian Philosophy
Since there are only 3 types of reasons in the OP section "PSR in Metaphysics", the laws of nature would be explained by 1 of the 3 types. — A Christian Philosophy
C1 - The fact that my cat cannot understand The Old Man and the Sea does not mean that the book isn't understandable — RussellA
C2 - The fact that a question is the wrong question doesn't mean that there isn't a right question — RussellA
C3 - The fact that every answer can be questioned doesn't mean that there isn't an answer. — RussellA
C3 - The fact that every answer can be questioned doesn't mean that there isn't an answer. — RussellA
Parmenides pointed out that if the world had come into existence from nothing, there is no answer to the question as to why the world didn't come into existence earlier or later than it did. From this he concluded that the world has always existed (SEP - Principle of Sufficient Reason) — RussellA
Or if you mean "existence" as the general concept, then that's just a concept. Concepts are not concrete existing things that need reasons. — A Christian Philosophy
The reason is given in the OP under the section "Argument in defence of the PSR". In short, it follows from the premise that "Reason finds truth". — A Christian Philosophy
I don't think it dawned on any philosopher, before the advent of modernity, that the Cosmos - a word meaning 'an ordered whole' - could be anything other than rational. — Wayfarer
(fragment 51)Men do not know how what is at variance agrees with itself. It is an attunement of opposite tension, like that of the bow and the lyre.
(fragment 80)We must know that war is common to all and strife is justice, and that all things come into being and pass away through strife.
(97b-d)One day I heard someone reading, as he said, from a book of Anaxagoras, and saying that it is Mind that directs and is the cause of everything. I was delighted with this cause and it seemed to me good, in a way, that Mind should be the cause of all. I thought that if this were so, the directing Mind would direct everything and arrange each thing in the way that was best. If then one wished to know the cause of each thing, why it comes to be or perishes or exists, one had to find what was the best way for it to be, or to be acted upon, or to act. On these premises then it befitted a man to investigate only, about this and other things, what is best.
“For every thing that exists, there is a sufficient reason for it to exist.” — A Christian Philosophy
The ENEMY is the United States government. — ssu
Do I understand you? — Moliere
So all I need, for the purpose of rejecting all my opinions, is to find in each of them at least some reason for doubt.
So today I have set all my worries aside and arranged for myself a clear stretch of free time. I am here quite alone, and at last I will devote myself, sincerely and without holding back, to demolishing my opinions.
Would that happen today, no? — ssu
Do you think his conclusion—a kind of ontological argument for the existence of God—is also feigned? — Janus
Or that his skepticism regarding the authority of the church extended to the 'holy book' itself? — Janus
(11:6)The Lord said, “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.
I know by experience that will is entirely without limits.
and:
My will is so perfect and so great that I can’t conceive of its becoming even greater and more perfect ... — Fooloso4
You can infer ... — Corvus
How could he exist without his body and senses? — Corvus
He briefly doubts his own existence — Corvus
He doubted everything even his own existence. — Corvus
I will set aside anything that admits of the slightest doubt, treating it as though I had found it to be outright false; and I will carry on like that until I find something certain, or – at worst – until I become certain that there is no certainty. Archimedes said that if he had one firm and immovable point he could lift the world ·with a long enough lever·; so I too can hope for great things if I manage to find just one little thing that is solid and certain ...
Now that I have convinced myself that there is nothing in the world – no sky, no earth, no minds, no bodies – does it follow that I don’t exist either? No it does not follow; for if I convinced myself of something then I certainly existed.
My point was existence precedes doubting and thinking — Corvus
Doubting one's own existence negates one's own sanity. — Corvus
Right I agree but surely to be consistent Descartes must have imagined that he had grounds for skepticism regarding the existence of those other thinkers. — Janus
Is it not the case, that he must have existed in order to think? — Corvus
Existence is a precondition for thinking. — Corvus
All thoughts must have its contents or objects. — Corvus
When you say, a thinking being, it doesn't mean much without the knowledge of what the thinking is about. — Corvus
Without the content or object of the thought, Cogito is not saying much more than I dance, or I sing. — Corvus
A person called "whoever" sounds still ambiguous. — Corvus
These are the operations of mind which are only possible under the precondition of the living bodily existence. — Corvus
If the content of thought is empty or unknown, what meaning or relevance does the thought have with one's own existence on claiming cogito? — Corvus
Whoever is a name for nonexistence and unknown, hence meaningless. — Corvus
Isn't it a meaningless utterance? — Corvus
I do exist. But my existence is confirmed by my own sense perception of the world of my own body and the actions I take according to my will. Not by cogito. — Corvus
Well, then, what am I? A thing that thinks. What is that? A thing that doubts, understands, affirms, denies, wants, refuses, and also imagines and senses.
So you are saying thinking is the something that exists that is thinking, doubting and feeling? Saying that the "who" is Descartes really tells me nothing at all. — Janus
The point is even if you said, I think therefore I exist, it doesn't say anything about the content of your thought. — Corvus
Whoever exists, exists is a tautology, therefore meaningless. — Corvus
Who is "whoever"? — Corvus
whoever thinks, must exist, — Fooloso4
If all thoughts are strictly private to the thinkers, then your cogito is just a solipsistic utterance to me. It doesn't give any meaningful knowledge to anyone else. — Corvus
If that is the case, then he would have known the fact that he must have existed before thinking. — Corvus
my whole self insofar as I am a combination of body and mind ...
My sole concern here is with what God has given to me as a combination of mind and body.
All of this makes it clear that, despite God’s immense goodness, the nature of man as a combination of mind and body is such that it is bound to mislead him from time to time. — Fooloso4
I'm guessing this was about religious doctrine, where plain speaking in a Catholic country could get you in trouble. — J
...there are many other things in them; and I tell you, between ourselves, that these
six Meditations contain all the foundations of my physics. But that must not be spread abroad, if you please; for those who follow Aristotle will find it more difficult to approve them. I hope that [my readers] will accustom themselves insensibly to my principles, and will come to recognize their truth, before
perceiving that they destroy those of Aristotle.
Linguistic expressions are not thoughts themselves. — Corvus
"Whoever thinks must exist" is a guess at best. It is not a logical statement. — Corvus
Who is "whoever"? — Corvus
All thoughts are private to the individual who thinks. — Corvus
You sounded as if Descartes had no contemporary scientific knowledge at his life time — Corvus
And my point to that was, that one's bodily existence is precondition to mental operations is not a contemporary science, but a very basic biological fact which could be even classed as a commonsense knowledge. — Corvus
I have a very good reason for offering this book to you, and I am confident that you will have an equally good reason for giving it your protection ...
If he'd wanted freedom from the Church, that was easily available in nearby Protestant territory. — frank
Descartes was clearly not on a quest to undermine the authority of the Church. — frank
but this sounds more like a 19th century way of reading than 17th century. — J
To say in one's unpublished Private Thoughts that one "goes forth wearing a mask" surely speaks to the difference we all experience between our private and public selves, no? — J
Why would you think he was referring to his philosophical writings? — J
Do not propose new opinions as new, but retain all the old terminology for
supporting new reasons; that way no one can find fault with you, and those who
grasp your reasons will by themselves conclude to what they ought to understand.
I suppose it depends on how you evaluate Descartes' status as a philosopher — J
I'll just comment that you do this a lot. You come up with some weird subterfuge related to a famous philosopher and then announce your theories as if they're facts. — frank
For us who are believers,it is enough to accept on faith that the human soul does not die with the body, and that God exists; but in the case of unbelievers, it seems that there is no religion, and practically no moral virtue, that they can be persuaded to adopt until these two truths are proved to them by natural reason.
It is of course quite true that we must believe in the existence of God because it is a doctrine of Holy Scripture, and conversely, that we must believe Holy Scripture because it comes from God; for since faith is the gift of God, he who gives us grace to believe other things can also give us grace to believe that he exists. But this argument cannot be put to unbelievers because they would judge it to be circular.
But in its eighth session the Lateran Council held under Leo X condemned those who take this position, and expressly enjoined Christian philosophers to refute their arguments and use ail their powers to establish the truth; so l have not hesitated to attempt this task as well.
In addition, I know that the only reason why many irreligious people are unwilling to believe that God exists and that the human mind is distinct from the body is the alleged fact that no one has hitherto been able to demonstrate these points. Now I completely disagree with this: I think that when properly understood almost all the arguments that have been put forward on these issues by the great men have the force of demonstrations, and I am convinced that it is scarcely possible to provide
any arguments which have not already been produced by someone else.
Nevertheless, I think there can be no more useful service to be rendered in
philosophy than to conduct a careful search, once and for all, for the best
of these arguments, and to set them out so precisely and clearly as to produce for the future a general agreement that they amount to demonstrative proofs. And finally, I was strongly pressed to undertake
this task by several people who knew that I had developed a method for resolving certain difficulties in the sciences - not a new method (for nothing is older than the truth), but one which they had seen me use with some success in other areas; and I therefore thought it my duty to make some attempt to apply it to the matter in hand.
But although I regard the proofs as quite certain and evident, I cannot therefore persuade myself that they are suitable to be grasped by everyone. In geometry there are many writings left by
Archimedes, Apollonius, Pappus and others which are accepted by everyone as evident and certain because they contain absolutely nothing that is not very easy to understand when considered on its own, and each step fits in precisely with what has gone before; yet because they are
somewhat long, and demand a very attentive reader, it is only comparatively few people who understand them. In the same way, although the proofs I employ here are in my view as certain and evident as the proofs of geometry, if not more so, it will, I fear, be impossible for many people
to achieve an adequate perception of them, both because they are rather long and some depend on others, and also, above all, because they require a mind which is completely free from preconceived opinions and which can easily detach itself from involvement with the senses. Moreover, people who have an aptitude for metaphysical studies are certainly not to be found in the world in any greater numbers than those who have an aptitude for geometry. What is more, there is the difference that in
geometry everyone has been taught to accept that as a rule no proposition is put forward in a book without there being a conclusive demonstration available; so inexperienced students make the mistake of accepting what is false, in their desire to appear to understand it, more often than they make the mistake of rejecting what is true. In philosophy, by contrast, the belief is that everything can be argued either way; so few people pursue the truth, while the great majority build up their reputation for ingenuity by boldly attacking whatever is most sound.
The reputation of your Faculty is so firmly fixed in the minds of all, and the name of the Sorbonne has such authority that, with the exception of the Sacred Councils, no institution carries more weight
than yours in matters of faith; while as regards human philosophy, you are thought of as second to none, both for insight and soundness and also for the integrity and wisdom of your pronouncements.
He wanted the Church to reform, and he thought he could help it do that. — frank
But all thoughts are private to the thinker. — Corvus
Therefore your claim that whoever thinks, must exist, is false? — Corvus
Would you not agree it is a commonsense knowledge rather than a contemporary Science? Even ancient Greeks would have known about it. — Corvus
We see how conflicted Descartes is ... — J
He also clearly has trouble with using "mind" and "soul" interchangeably. — J
If his own nature is a "totality of things bestowed by God," surely this is the soul, rather than a thinking thing. — J
All these represent criticisms of Descartes on his own terms, pointing out contradictions or inconsistencies. — J
Descartes writes to one of his more imprudent disciples:
Do not propose new opinions as new, but retain all the old terminology for
supporting new reasons; that way no one can find fault with you, and those who
grasp your reasons will by themselves conclude to what they ought to understand.
Why is it necessary for you to reject so openly the [Aristotelian doctrine of]
substantial forms? Do you not recall that in the Treatise on Meteors I expressly
denied that I rejected or denied them, but declared only that they were not
necessary for the explication of my reasons?
– René Descartes to Regius, January, 1642, Œuvres de Descartes, 3:491-
92, quoted and translated by Hiram Caton in “The Problem of Descartes’
Sincerity,” 363
From the first paragraph of Descartes’ early, unpublished “Private Thoughts”:
I go forward wearing a mask [larvatus prodeo].
– René Descartes, “Cogitationes Privatae,” in Œuvres de Descartes, 10:213
Descartes took care not to speak so plainly [as Hobbes] but he could not help revealing
his opinions in passing, with such address that he would not be understood save by those
who examine profoundly these kinds of subjects.
– G. W. Leibniz, Sämtliche Schriften und Briefe, 2.1:506, quoted and translated
by Richard Kennington in On Modern Origins, 197
For example, here is Leibniz, reacting to Descartes’ seeming embrace of the view that all
necessary truths, like the principle of non-contradiction, are the product of God’s free and
arbitrary will:
I cannot even imagine that M. Descartes can have been quite seriously of this opinion….
He only made pretence to go [there]. It was apparently one of his tricks, one of his
philosophic feints: he prepared for himself some loophole, as when for instance he
discovered a trick for denying the movement of the earth, while he was a Copernican in
the strictest sense.
– G. W. Leibniz, Theodicy, 244 (2.186)
Whatever he recounts about the distinction between the two substances [mind and body],
it is obvious that it was only a trick, a cunning devise to make the theologians swallow
the poison hidden behind an analogy that strikes everyone and that they alone cannot see.
– Julien Offray de La Mettrie, Machine Man, 35
After corresponding with Descartes concerning the issue of whether animals were mere
machines, Henry More concluded that Descartes was “an abundantly cunning and abstruse
genius” who insinuated that mind as an incorporeal substance is a “useless figment and
chimera.”
– Henry More, Philosophical Writings, 184, 197-98
Thus one is right to accuse Descartes of atheism, seeing that he very energetically
destroyed the weak proofs of the existence of God that he gave.
– Baron d'Holbach, Système de la nature, 2:150, quoted and translated by Hiram
Caton in “The Problem of Descartes’ Sincerity,” 355
Does it entail then,
God thinks (doubts), therefore God exists? — Corvus
But that is not the case from the scientific point of view. — Corvus
Is "I" extendable to other subjects such as he, she, you, it or they? Or is cogito strictly to "I" only? If it does, then could you say, "He thinks therefore he exists", or "It thinks, therefore it exists."?
If it is only for "I", then wouldn't it be just a solipsistic utterance?
— Corvus
Just realised that you have not answered to this question. What's your thought on this point? — Corvus
Whoever thinks, whoever doubts, whoever is subject to deception much exist.
I don't exist is untrue (not from cogito, but from my sensory perception), therefore it implies cogito is untrue as well. Agree? — Corvus
What is that something? — Janus
He wouldn't have needed to displace the authority of the Church if that was his agenda. He could have just left and gone to live in Protestant territory. — frank