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  • Ukraine Crisis
    The "quiet invasion" ...

    Denial of Georgia's EU membership bid would be "a big victory for Russia," President Zourabichvili says
    — Sharyn Alfonsi, Ashley Velie, Jennifer Dozor, Erin DuCharme, Peter M Berman · CBS · Oct 29, 2023

    ↪boethius
    , let me just check that I understand your theory, the military-industrial complex decides what is and isn't sent to Ukraine, and they're in business.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    At 11:54 he again forgets that the US isn't handling satellite states like Stalin did with NATO members and Ukraine or Georgia [...] — ssu

    Never mind. We'll do it our own way later. — Stalin

    Maybe Mearsheimer forgot post-Yalta. At least that Stalin-world ended.

    And Western Europe would create it's defense towards Russia without the US — ssu

    I suppose one could hope anyway (all of Europe preferably). Expensive, though. The (present somewhat Stalin'esque) Kremlin looms large on the horizon.
  • People are starving, dying, and we eat, drink and are making merry
    Sudan has been a long disaster, humanitarian and otherwise. I'm not particularly optimistic.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Domitilla Sagramoso interview:

    'Momentum is on side of Russia' despite minor Ukrainian victories, 'increasing opposition' to Putin
    — François Picard · France 24 · 9m:44s · Oct 26, 2023
    Slovakia's new populist Prime Minister Robert Fico said Thursday that his government was stopping military aid to Ukraine. Fico told MPs that the country would "no longer supply weapons to Ukraine", repeating promises made during his election campaign, but would still supply humanitarian aid to its war-torn neighbour. For in-depth analysis and a deeper perspective on Russia's brutal war on Ukraine and Slovakia's decision to end military aid to Kyiv, FRANCE 24's François Picard is joined by Dr. Domitilla Sagramoso, Senior Lecturer in Security and Development and expert on Russian foreign and security policy at King's College London.

    By the way,
    ↪boethius
    , Hawley's comments, "I also wish our European allies to do their part", echoes what Obama and others have aired prior. So easily post-Yalta is forgotten (also set out in some detail by Anne Applebaum (2012)).

    Opinion | Josh Hawley Is Wrong About Israel and Ukraine
    — Rich Lowry · POLITICO · Oct 11, 2023

    Russia-Ukraine are warring, Hamas-Israel are warring, though not China. Hawley's "I don't see where this is going" oddly forgets the active and violent proliferation of authoritarianism regression oppression contra democracy transparency freedom. I suppose Kara-Murza likely agrees.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    why not just ask the US to supply the longer range — boethius

    Not just the US, but you're right. They should just have been given the tools/resources from the get-go.


    On Russian Nuclear Threat, Putin Lets Others Rattle the Saber
    — Paul Sonne, David E Sanger · New York Times · Oct 7, 2023

    Oct 20, 2023

    Ukraine holds peace formula talks in Malta, Russia absent
    — Christopher Scicluna, Elaine Monaghan, Andrew Gray, Olena Harmash, David Evans, Mike Harrison · Reuters · Oct 28, 2023

    The world has told the Kremlin όχι.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    ↪RogueAI
    , sure seems conflicting.

    A bit like when Saudi Arabia chaired UN's Human Rights thing, or Russia led UN's Security thing.

    I suppose, having the theocrats take some responsibility for all to see, being inclusive, could have some positive effects. One could hope anyway, though admittedly I haven't (personally) been impressed so far.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    One day the president of Israel will be a Muslim and all the old people will be like, I thought this would never happen! — frank

    Better yet, one day a secular Buddhist will be president of the whole area, and it'll be a genuine democracy with separation of religion and politics.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    Doesn't warring itself breach human rights and all that? In a way, if that's where you start reasoning, haven't you already lost...?

    Explainer: What war crimes laws apply to the Israel-Palestinian conflict?
    — Stephanie van den Berg, Anthony Deutsch, Giles Elgood · Reuters · Oct 26, 2023

    What constitutes a war crime? (NBC · 4m:46s · Oct 26, 2023)

    all is fair in love and war — @user-bx6we4od7d

    If someone has the means and opportunity, then the decision is theirs, others can't decide not to. Anyone may argue about motive, which often enough ends up shrouded in rhetoric.

    cier51fqszku6urm.jpg
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Migrants Reportedly Being Forced To Sign Contracts With Defense Ministry To Obtain Russian Citizenship
    — Angelica Evans, Nicole Wolkov, Karolina Hird, Frederick W Kagan · RFE/RL · Aug 28, 2023

    Russian Offensive Campaign Assessment, October 24, 2023
    — Angelica Evans, Nicole Wolkov, Karolina Hird, Frederick W Kagan · ISW · Oct 24, 2023

    Russian authorities are intensifying mobilization efforts targeting Central Asian migrant communities in Russia. Russian Internal Affairs (MVD) Minister Vladimir Kolokoltsev met with the MVD board to discuss “migration problems” and “ethnic crime” and insinuated that migrants commit crimes at a higher rate than natural born Russian citizens.(7) Kolokoltsev defended recent Russian law enforcement mobilization raids on migrant communities and claimed that Russian law enforcement is enforcing standard legal norms.(8) A Russian insider source claimed that the Russian Investigative Committee is conducting investigations into naturalized migrants with Russian citizenship and is reopening previously terminated and canceled criminal cases in order to mobilize migrants to fight in Ukraine.(9) The insider source also claimed that the Russian Investigative Committee will now investigate migrants for committing any offense, even minor ones, and will expand that individual’s investigation to include their friends and family. The insider source claimed that unspecified actors, possibly the MVD or MVD Head Alexander Bastrykin, ordered Russian state media to increase reporting about ethnic crime in Russia, likely to set informational conditions for further mobilization raids on migrant communities.(10) Bastrykin has continually advocated for the targeted mobilization of migrants with Russian citizenship, in line with Russian law enforcement’s recent expansion of its efforts to detain and forcibly register migrants with Russian citizenship for military service.(11)

    (7) https://t.me/NeoficialniyBeZsonoV/30299 ; https://t.me/vysokygovorit/13239 ; https://t.me/MedvedevVesti/15640 ; https://mvdmedia.ru/news/official/vladimir-kolokoltsev-provel-zasedanie-kollegii-mvd-rossii-posvyashchennoe-protivodeystviyu-nelegalno/
    (8) https://t.me/NeoficialniyBeZsonoV/30299 ; https://t.me/vysokygovorit/13239 ; https://t.me/MedvedevVesti/15640 ; https://mvdmedia.ru/news/official/vladimir-kolokoltsev-provel-zasedanie-kollegii-mvd-rossii-posvyashchennoe-protivodeystviyu-nelegalno/
    (9) https://t.me/vchkogpu/43131
    (10) https://t.me/vchkogpu/43131
    (11) https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-october-22-2023 ; https://understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-october-20-2023 ; https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-august-29-2023 ; https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-april-12-2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Putin sends message in German to Schröder's critics
    — t-online · Oct 24, 2023
    I would like to say, the further one gets from Schröder, the closer one comes to Anthony Rota, the Speaker of the Canadian Parliament, who sympathizes with the Nazis. There are many decent people in Germany, and I am sure many will hear this. — Pukin

    Plainly, Rota isn't Nazi or a sympathizer. Neither is the Canadian government, nor the Canadian populace at large. That then makes Putin a liar, caught in the act. Don't know if any of his home peers called him out; if any have or will, hopefully, they won't get "sent away" as "extremists".

    But, hey, yes, there are many good Germans.

    ‘So Russians don’t fear them’ Putin administration tells pro-government media not to report on crimes committed by returning soldiers
    — Andrey Pertsev · Meduza · Oct 24, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Uh-oh Azerbaijan → Armenia :fire:

    Is one of Russia’s oldest allies slipping from the Kremlin’s orbit?
    — Christian Edwards, Caolán Magee · CNN · Sep 17, 2023
    France sends weapons to Armenia amid fears of new conflict with Azerbaijan
    — Laura Kayali, Gabriel Gavin · POLITICO · Oct 23, 2023
    Azerbaijan Could Invade Armenia. The U.S. Must Intervene
    — Simon Maghakyan · TIME · Oct 24, 2023

    Perhaps a "world order" ought to be one by which attacks/takeovers are less feasible, more disincentivized? Ethics-driven culture seems to have partially failed.

    US says China has significantly expanded its nuclear arsenal
    — Al Jazeera · Oct 20, 2023
    Russia unconcerned by China increasing nuclear arsenal capabilities, says Kremlin
    — Alexander Marrow, Gareth Jones · Reuters · Oct 25, 2023
    This does not cause us concern, our relations are an advanced strategic partnership, we have the most advanced stage of political dialogue, economic interaction. And in this case, China, which faces very serious challenges for its own security in the region, is taking steps that it considers appropriate. This is the absolute sovereign right of this country. — Pesky

    What threats have been exerted prompting China's (supposed) need for a fresh nuclear arms race? Oddly perhaps, the Kremlin comes up first in that respect.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Ukraine’s race to build its own arms industry
    — Alec Russell, Christopher Miller, Roman Olearchyk · Financial Times · Oct 23, 2023
    We have a huge deficit of ammunition not just in Ukraine but all over the world. We understand we should produce this here in Ukraine because all around the world it’s finished, it’s depleted. All the warehouses are empty. — Denys Shmyhal

    Back to sticks'n'stones? :) (if only everyone would run out at the same time :cool:)

    Concerning if Ukraine becomes a military-industrial powerhouse? At the moment they have good reasons. Later?

    ↪Benkei
    , the Kremlin blamed the Navalny poisoning thing on the CIA of all things. It became ridiculous some time ago. Meanwhile, they proliferate authoritarianism regression oppression contra democracy transparency freedom, which they continue to divert/misdirect from when blaming everyone else (with some success I might add).

    Unexpected:

    Anchor of Chinese container vessel caused damage to Balticconnector gas pipeline, Finnish police say
    — Jari Tanner · AP · Oct 24, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Anyone up for watching a crime drama about poisoning and trying to hide it, detective work, political activism, courage, might check Navalny (2022).

    I was a bit taken aback by the strength of evidence implicating the Kremlin circle, a real-life conspiracy if you will.

    For his flaws, Navalny's story is also a story of Putin's authoritarian regime. I doubt Navalny would be a worse president than Putin is (regressive opaque oppressive sinister).

    A Discussion of “Navalny": the Documentary
    — Wilson Center · 58m · Apr 18, 2022

    Bits and pieces of Putin's televised response in 2020 (or related) can be found out there ... RFE/RL, CBC, CNN, DW, Daily Mail, BBC, ... "Yeah, sorry Pukin. Won't fly."

    Column: Is the documentary ‘Navalny’ a life insurance policy for the imprisoned Russian opposition leader?
    — Robin Abcarian · Los Angeles Times · Dec 14, 2022

    Unless something changes, it seems unlikely Navalny will ever see the light of day again (or his lawyers), but whatever happened to Kudryavtsev...?

    If I were in Kyiv, I'd be looking elsewhere.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Kremlin says U.S. can't build 'new world order' that Biden spoke of
    — Gareth Jones · Reuters · Oct 23, 2023

    Allow me to rephrase Pesky's statement :D

    In this part we disagree because the United States... no matter what world order they talk about, they mean an American-centric world order of democracies, that is, a world that revolves around the United States democracy transparency freedom. It won't be that way any more.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    ↪Hanover
    , unfortunately, it goes further than the Jews, and has for some time. :/
  • Absolute nothingness is only impossible from the perspective of something
    ↪Ø implies everything
    , hmm, what other perspective is there than "from something"...? In absence of anything/everything, speaking of perspectives doesn't make much sense...
  • Fascista-Nazista creep?


    ... what else,
    ↪Vera Mont
    ? ;)
  • Ukraine Crisis
    I doubt those among Russian top brass who are against the war can/will do much:

    Carnegie · Apr 7, 2023
    Bloomberg · Jun 8, 2023

    If within Putin's reach, it's safer for them to play along in any case (for now at least). :death:

    UN · Jul 28, 2023
    POLITICO · Aug 4, 2023

    Marcus Keupp seems too optimistic (to me):

    watson · Oct 20, 2023 (en)

    Mentioned Russian losses alone won't do it, at least not in the near future, though at some point...

    Besides, with friends like Kim Jong Un, what can go wrong? :)

    Al Jazeera · Sep 13, 2023
    ABC · Oct 8, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Nuclear posturing of late has been Russian and North Korean. The Kremlin appears to be going for a Cold War II. Incidentally, the kind of environment Putin was trained in, grew up in, knows, where he made some buddies.

    To what end, though?

    If Putin is willing to hit the red button over Ukraine, then the world (in general) already has a markedly larger problem (sort of masked/hidden in rhetoric). For that matter, certainly not in the best interest of Russians. On the other hand, as a promised response to a nuclear attack, it seems to work well enough. Maybe. (I'd be more worried about Kim Jong Un at the moment.)

    The Putinistas have had a decade or two to think Ukraine over, when they had spare time. There are some suggestions that parts of the (current) Kremlin's moves have been prepared/strategized for a long while, despite setbacks/bumps.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Mariupol is becoming a military installation. A resort city not so much, at the moment.

    a direct railway connection with Mariupol, Volnovakha and Donetsk — Petro Andriushchenko · Sep 27, 2023

    Russians build rail links to Mariupol, Volnovakha and Donetsk
    — Alona Mazurenko · Ukrainska Pravda · Sep 27, 2023

    Russians so worried about Ukrainian breakthrough on Donetsk front that they have begun to fortify occupied Mariupol
    — The New Voice of Ukraine · Oct 12, 2023

    Ukraine’s Next Target: Russian Supply Lines
    — Daniel Michaels · Wall Street Journal · Oct 12, 2023
    The new rail link that Russia is building to Mariupol—a Black Sea port on the land bridge—would, if successful, relieve pressure on supplies coming from Crimea, said an assistant to Mariupol’s exiled mayor, and so poses a threat to Ukrainian troops. — Daniel Michaels

    I don't think the Russian Mariupol efforts are new, though. Strategic importance for them. Meanwhile, Avdiivka is keeping both parties busy.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    Some nervousness in New York

    Intel bulletin says terror groups are calling on supporters to target U.S., Israeli interests amid Israel-Hamas conflict
    — Catherine Herridge, Nicole Sganga · CBS · Oct 18, 2023

    Protesters clashing was reported earlier
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Putin Outlines What Makes a 'True World Leader'
    — Brendan Cole · Newsweek · Oct 17, 2023

    This is what distinguishes a true world leader from the people we call temporary caretakers, who come for five minutes to show off on the international platform, and then disappear just as quietly. — Putin

    Apart from Gerashchenko's comments, is this ↑ also a sneaky way of justifying "extending" his (and Xi's) presidency...? :)
  • Ukraine Crisis
    The Russian losses at Avdiivka are grim. And yet another "deadline" has been set to secure the Donbas. I don't see how Russia's ability for offensive operations can recover, and yet clearly the calculus is that "more must be taken to make it worth it." — Count Timothy von Icarus

    Unverified as far as I know:

    From Kyiv in 3 days to a "deficit in body bags in Donetsk": Russian volunteer urgently needs help with purchasing corpse bags for soldiers currently assaulting in Avdiivka. They also need food, but this must only come in closed packages, because "you don't know if someone's going to add something to it". (@wartranslated · Oct 13, 2023 · 1m)

    :o
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Echarmion
    , there's plenty of blame to go around.
    (By the way, the thread established a while back that "Everyone bad". :grin:)
    Sometimes the road to hell is paved with good intentions; not trying at all is worse.

    So, anyway, to what end?

    There isn't an international conspiracy out to delete Russia(n culture), unlike the Kremlin trying to ditch Ukrainian culture (has also come up in the thread before).
    In this context, I'd be less concerned with McDonald's spreading all over sort of like a "capitalist virus" or "fυkɘrs stealing our women", and more concerned with democracy transparency freedom versus regression authoritarianism oppression.
    Opposing a "No" to the latter facilitates the latter.

    North and South Korea, East and West Germany, Russia and Finland, ... Also China and the Uyghurs, theocracy and ceremonial constitutional monarchy, ...

    3 lawyers arrested, 2 fled the country:

    Navalny lawyer flees Russia, leaving opposition leader alone in court
    — Robyn Dixon · Washington Post · Oct 17, 2023

    Not looking good for that guy.
  • Absolute nothingness is only impossible from the perspective of something
    The phrase "absolute nothingness" can't refer to anything (including constraints), right?
    A contradiction could be ontologizing/reifying "absolute nothingness"?
  • Climate change denial
    New map visualizes entire 2023 wildfire season in Canada, the worst on record
    — The Weather Network · Oct 15, 2023 · 1m:3s
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪javi2541997
    , double down on "not be accepted in any possible way" and "didn't do anything", eh? :snicker: But, hey, we'll see, can't predict the future.

    ↪Mikie
    , oddly enough perhaps, the argument Stephen Cohen put forth (presumably on behalf of the Russian population) is more or less what you hear from nationalists (and some conservatives) regarding refugees and immigrants in many countries. Conversely, it's not so much what you hear from the population in Eastern European NATO member countries.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪javi2541997


    [...] into the EU if [...]

    2014 EU-Ukraine Association Agreement signed
    2017 EU-Ukraine Association Agreement in effect
    2022 EU Accession of Ukraine application
    2022 EU Accession of Ukraine candidacy accepted

    Progress on 7 required reforms 2022 Feb 28 - 2023 Jun 22 (wartime)
    1. Constitutional Court   Good progress
    2. Judicial governance    Completed
    3. Anti-corruption        Some progress
    4. Anti-money laundering  Some progress
    5. De-oligarchisation     Some progress
    6. Media legislation      Completed
    7. National minorities    Some progress
    
  • Ukraine Crisis
    Also check "demilitarization" (and "deNazification") demands. It's not about NATO specifically, it's about the Kremlin having control (or ownership). NATO is the most visible and (perhaps) likely to get in the way of that, though others could have.
    Additionally, Ukraine wouldn't be accepted into the EU if there was a genocide going on. They've gotten their share of attention/spotlight lately, historical and otherwise.
    These coincide:
    • Euromaidan + the Revolution of Dignity;
    • Russian military operations in Donbas, preceded by Russian "preparations" and other operations ⁽²⁰¹⁴ ²⁰¹⁵ ²⁰¹⁶ ²⁰¹⁸ ²⁰¹⁹ ²⁰²² ²⁰²² ²⁰²²⁾;
    • Russian accusations of genocide in Donbas;
    • "green men" in Crimea.
    Contours of (planned) moves of the largest country around, by Kremlin decree, more so than of Russian "defense" against NATO specifically.
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    I don't think one can uniquely declare one party good and the other evil in this conflict that's been going on for ages.

    George Bush: 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq'
    — Ewen MacAskill · The Guardian · Oct 7, 2005
    :D
    By the way
    Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian prime minister, who was also part of the delegation at Sharm el-Sheikh, told the BBC programme that Mr Bush had said: "I have a moral and religious obligation. I must get you a Palestinian state. And I will." — Ewen MacAskill · The Guardian · Oct 7, 2005

    So this is what things look like in Gaza at the moment (google can translate Spanish as needed)...

    The complete siege complicates the lives of Gazans in the Strip dodging the bombs
    — Euronews · Oct 12, 2023
    What have we done to them? Look at the destroyed houses. Nobody has warned us. We are civilians. What have we done to them? — Hassan Zidane (Store Owner, Gaza)

    I'm guessing a few feel like Zidane among both parties.

    Rubble and debris. No electricity, fuel (e.g. backup generators). Too little running water. Increasingly long food lines. Humanitarian disaster. How many affected? 300,000?

    We reject the practices of killing civilians or abusing them on both sides because they contravene morals, religion and international law. — Mahmoud Abbas · Ali Sawafta, James Mackenzie, Mark Heinrich, Jonathan Oatis · Wafa via Reuters · Oct 12, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    At least 51 civilians killed in Russian missile strike on village in eastern Ukraine, officials say
    — Yulia Drozd, Natalya Kushnir, Oleksiy Pshemyskiy, Tatiana Rymarenko, Tatiana Rymarenko · ABC · Oct 5, 2023
    Vladimir Putin says civilian toll from Israeli ground attack in Gaza would be ‘unacceptable’
    — Reuters via South China Morning Post · Oct 13, 2023

    Paraphrasing Biden to Trump ... Shut up already Pukin.

    Why Russia is engaged in a delicate balancing act in the Israel-Hamas war
    — AP · Oct 12, 2023
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    Map of the initial attacks:

    Hamas practiced in plain sight, posting video of mock attack weeks before border breach
    — Michael Biesecker, Sarah El Deeb, Jon Gambrell, Lori Hinnant, Beatrice Dupuy, Aaron Kessler, Fu Ting · AP · Oct 13, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪javi2541997
    , whatever they can use against the invaders. The Kremlin, on the other hand, has grander plans (against "The West" and whatever it all may be).

    (FYI, Oct 10, 2023 comment on the Middle East crisis)

    BBC did not report that Ukraine is sending arms to Hamas, a video was fabricated
    — Philip Marcelo, Hanna Arhirova · AP · Oct 11, 2023
  • Ukraine Crisis
    According to Ukrainian intelligence...

    [...] we clearly know that captured weapons from Ukraine were still transferred by the Russians to the Hamas group. It is mostly infantry weapons.
    There is some information that something was going to Hezbollah, but we don't know for sure at this point.
    Everyone could see the video on social networks - a completely, let's say, natural for our region and completely unnatural for the Middle East tactic, when FPV drones were used against armored vehicles.
    This is the know-how of our war after all. No one other than people who passed through our theater of war could do such a thing. Since we were not there, it means that it was the Russians.
    Two more interesting facts. First: a little more than a week before the start of these actions, the Russian station "Sputnik" began to officially speak in Arabic on the territory of Lebanon. This is broadcast in an absolutely propagandist style with clear Russian narratives.
    Second: on September 24, a Russian spacecraft capable of conducting radio-electronic reconnaissance and intercepting satellite signals was moved to Israel's geostationary orbit.
    Let me remind you that in the period from September 22 to 24, there was an official visit of the Russian military delegation to Iran. We know that there were several, shall we say, wishes from the Iranian side. One of them concerned the expansion of intelligence capabilities.
    It is now clear what intelligence information the Russians began to provide to all interested parties. I emphasize that it is not Iran alone, but all interested parties.
    — Kyrylo Budanov · Roman Kravets, Nazariy Mazilyuk · Ukrainian Pravda · Oct 12, 2023

    Well, it doesn't seem likely that Ukraine would send weapons away.


    The Sky Shield move is a (by)product of, or reaction to, the Russia → Ukraine warring...

    Germany, nine other nations push ahead with joint air defence procurement
    — Sabine Siebold, Bart Meijer, Rod Nickel · Reuters · Oct 11, 2023
    After the Cold War, many NATO allies scaled down the number of air defence units to reflect their assessment that they faced only a limited missile threat, from countries such as Iran.

    19 European countries are in on it at the moment. Defence-oriented only. Concerned with Russia. The Kremlin likely doesn't care much. It does look like the Kremlin is taking or forcing a path to a Cold War II, with some Hot spots, except they've learned from how the last one ended. With a powerful authoritarian Cold War expert at the helm ... appeasement and encouragement (+ proliferation of the authoritarianism) then go hand-in-hand, (re)armament (like Sky Shield) and division and the requisite flaming rhetoric/propaganda/threats go hand-in-hand ...
  • Do science and religion contradict
    ↪Isaiasb
    , sure, well, sort of.
    The scientific methodologies model cumulating evidence.
    Because we don't start out knowing it all.
    Hence electricity in your home, near-realtime worldwide communication over the Internet using complex electronic devices, GPS helping us navigate, cholera control, clean water, exploring Mars with rovers, fair treatments of schizophrenia, diabetes no longer a death sentence, helping paralyzed talk and move, ...
    The most successful epistemic endeavor in human history.
    As to Christianity, I guess, say, the 10 commandments have never changed?
    Ethics and science work differently, though.
    Apparently, Sunnism and Shaivism (among others) are competitors, if you will; can't all be right, but could all be wrong.
    Science moves on regardless.
  • Ukraine Crisis
    ↪Mikie
    , just a minor clarification that's come up before in the thread (2023Mar23, 2023Mar3, 2023Feb16, 2022Dec31): ↑ that's what Putin wants others to hear. Hence two additional considerations...

    Similar to what's come up before (2022Mar13, 2022Jul21, 2022Oct8, 2022Nov9), suppose that Ukraine had ... ▸ declared neutrality with respect to international military alliance memberships, formally on paper / constitutionally (2022Mar8, 2022Mar9, 2022Mar11); ▸ retained right to self-defense, e.g. from invaders (shouldn't be controversial), including foreign training and/or weaponry as the case may be; ▸ explicitly stated that others respect sovereignty, self-determination, freedom to seek own path (shouldn't be controversial); ▸ actively pursued EU membership, and perhaps sought other such cooperation ... Something along those lines. — Sep 26, 2023
    As to the former, now suppose that Ukraine had entered a defense agreement with, say, France, the UK, Luxembourg, Australia, South Korea, Japan, whoever, so that Ukraine had a multinational force (+ gear) present, and those countries had Ukrainian forces present. What might we then have expected from the Kremlin? (Say, anything significantly different from what we're seeing today?) — Oct 6, 2023

    Prior on those particular considerations, by the way...

    The way that you phrased your hypothetical, those other countries would be forming a bloc that would function essentially the same as NATO.
    So in that sense it doesn't matter which military bloc or hegemon takes the role of NATO and US respectively, assuming of course there's a credible threat of Russia being kicked out of Ukraine permanently.
    — Oct 7, 2023
    Except it wouldn't. There'd be no NATO expansion involved for example (as linked), but rather a "defense agreement" involving "whoever" (perhaps including China). Okie, so, in this case, we wouldn't expect much difference from the Kremlin from what we're seeing today. (?) — Oct 7, 2023

    Anyway, there's been lots of repetition in the thread (including on the (supposed) NATO-phobia). Maybe that's why we're on page 519 or so. Think we can hit 1K? :) (ok, that's a bit cynical)
  • Do science and religion contradict
    Yes, slap yourself in the face. You will quickly see cause and effect. Seriously, you are questioning logic itself. — ButyDude

    I don't think that's logic, more like metaphysics. I guess causation must have a cause? Notice how neatly ampliative such arguments become. Composition fallacy.
  • Do science and religion contradict
    In/compatibility depends entirely on the religion in question. Science rolls on just the same. Religions can sort of say whatever, science can't. So, uni-directional dependency of in/compatibility.

    -Einstein — Isaiasb
    Albert Einstein's religious views have been widely studied and often misunderstood. Albert Einstein stated "I believe in Spinoza's God". He did not believe in a personal God who concerns himself with fates and actions of human beings, a view which he described as naïve. He clarified however that, "I am not an atheist", preferring to call himself an agnostic, or a "religious nonbeliever." In other interviews, he has stated that he thinks there is a "lawgiver" who sets the laws of the universe. Einstein also stated he did not believe in life after death, adding "one life is enough for me." He was closely involved in his lifetime with several humanist groups. — Religious and philosophical views of Albert Einstein

    tsjrmbldxw19l9ai.jpg

    ↑ Scientists and Belief · Pew Research Center · Nov 5, 2009

    io78xrefgp5acre9.jpg

    ↑ Preliminary Survey results | What do philosophers believe? (2009)

    lihl3q9nvmconuhq.jpg

    ↑ Survey Results | Philosophers on Philosophy: The 2020 PhilPapers Survey
  • Israel killing civilians in Gaza and the West Bank
    If Israel wanted to fully annihilated Palestine, they could, but they don't. On the other hand, if Palestine could annihilate Israel, they would, but they can't. — Hanover

    That could be the Israelis' main fear/driver. The Palestinians want the Israelis gone, the Israelis don't want the Palestinians gone (to put it in simplistic terms). By and large, the Israelis are surrounded by hostile neighbors (except Saudi Arabia perhaps).

    On the other hand, the WW2-goodwill has roughly been spent by now, with what they've been doing. There are plenty of credible reports — gross and disgusting. Sort of a "victims has become victimizers" type story I guess.

    I'll just suggest a multinational UN force (again), serving multiple purposes, less warring, more transparency, less apartheid, more safety for everyone, ... It's been going on long enough already, over a generation. With a dampened situation, civilians have a chance to get on with life, send kids to school, talks can be accommodated, etc. And any criminals can be summoned to court for all to see in due time. It's just that both parties seem to plainly reject (even considering) that. "Swallow your dumb pride, you've had long enough now."
  • All things Cannabis
    Could be of interest here:

    Cannabis in Canada: Debunking myths about the real impacts of legalization
    — Michael J Armstrong · The Conversation · Oct 9, 2023

    Public "don't drink and drive" ads have been supplemented with "don't smoke and drive" ads. The report doesn't really have anything drastic, though kids might need attention (that's my main takeaway).

    On the other hand ...

    New Zealand passes world-first tobacco law to ban smoking for next generation
    — Tess McClure · The Guardian · Dec 13, 2022

    Oddly enough perhaps, both legislative efforts make some sense.
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jorndoe

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