• Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    Reasonable questions but is it apathy and cynicism from supporters? Or do you think many of them accept the Trump narrative as true believers in a war against a corrupt 'business as usual' political process? If this phenomenon operates similarly to a cult, then it's a highly complex situation.Tom Storm
    In 1989 I was living in Washington, DC when I'd found Peter Sloterdijk's ominous Critique of Cynical Reason (with an effing orange cover to boot, which I still have) in an used books store near the WH and read his trenchant diagnosis of the zeitgeist of the post-1918 Anglo-Euro sphere aka "populist cynicism" (i.e. postmodernity) – the return of the repressed "losers" (Nietzschean resentment). :mask:

    A brief summary ...
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critique_of_Cynical_Reason

    re: @NOS4A2 et al MAGAts :point:
    "Trumpistan! Trumpistan über alles!" :shade:
  • Literary writing process
    Now I think I'm forced to learn to write from somewhere else other than my head ...

    You are marvellous. Keep on going on!Amity
    Thanks so much for encouraging me. :flower: :hearts:
  • Literary writing process
    I'm curious what people's writing process is. Mine may be unusual.

    [ ... ]

    How do you write?
    hypericin
    Since my first bout of Covid-19 in early 2021, I have, for all practical purposes, forgotten how to write 'fiction'. I've had to relearn how to enter that headspace and stay there long enough either to put words to paper or rewrite what I've already written. I used to be a fastidious plotter and outliner from first paragraph to the last. I couldn't start without knowing the ending first. Since my second bout in late 2021,"long covid" manifests in me as chronic fatigue and persistent brain fog.

    I no longer read for pleasure or write confidently with ease. I have had to learn how to find (or receive) images which intrigue and then improvise with or around them, either singly or together, until something like a narrative takes shape. Then I have to follow that 'idea' blindly, ignoring cliches and my expections, groping for discoveries and perplexities, the more amusing the better. I don't know what I'm doing anymore with blank page; even less so when it comes to the real craft of rewriting.

    Perserverence has been mentioned – yes, that's all I've got now, mule-stubborness to finish. I rely on perserverence more now than I ever have ... to write less and less it seems. All the stories I've written since 2021, both submitted here and not, are still only first / rough drafts which need to be reworked and extended and polished and, in some instances, followed-up with companion pieces or inserted as chapters in unwritten novel(la)s. Even though I know what needs to be done, I can't do it, not yet at least. For the time being then, I perservere in conjuring up my occasional scribbles in order to have some skin-in-the-game during the round robin of readings and appreciating by TPF's community of writers.
  • A Case for Objective Epistemic Norms
    Can you firstly define what you mean by “rationality” ...Bob Ross
    It's a symbolic practice heuristically (or algorithmically) effective for controlling behavior and / or the environment despite insufficient time and/or information – IIRC, Peirce-Dewey's conception of 'rationality': practice.

    ... and, secondly, explain how and why you ground ethics in it?Bob Ross
    I ground ethics in rationality (i.e. inferential rules/heuristic-making) because I conceive of ethics as the study of 'the how of well-being', that is, how to reduce negations of well-being. (NB: Thus, I analogize well-being (how to reduce its negation) in ethics with e.g. sustainability (how to reduce its negation) in ecology and optimal health-fitness (how to reduce its negation) in medicine.)

    Are you saying that the moral facts obliges us to posit hypothetical imperatives?
    Yes; just as medical facts and ecological facts also oblige us to ask 'how to reduce' their adverse impacts as noted above.

    If so, then what are those facts?
    Species (e.g. h. sapiens) specific functional defects – natural vulnerabilities – which cause dysfunction or worse – increase suffering – in living individuals when such defects are neglected and/or exacerbated (via e.g. deprivation). In other words, whatever harms – is bad for – our kind.

    And how are they facts (as opposed to hypothetical imperatives themselves)?
    At minimum, they (e.g. hunger, bereavement, isolation, injury) are constitutive constraints on – limits to – (our) biological functioning.
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :100: x :100: :clap: (Careful, Wayf, your 'materialist bias' is beginning to show. :smirk:)
  • The Importance of Divine Hiddenness for Human Free Will and Moral Growth
    If God is anything like the ones depicted in the Judeo-Christo-Islamic doctrines, and if your proposition is correct, free will becomes impossible, as does moral growth.

    Personally, I'm picturing a parent of small children who teaches them correct behaviour by watching through a one-way mirror as they kill one another.
    Vera Mont
    :100: :lol:
  • The Current Republican Party Is A Clear and Present Danger To The United States of America
    Some (mild) 'reflections' on the last half century of a White Nationalist-Patriarchy movement – backlash to Minority & Women's Civil Rights and Non-White immigrants – in 'Murica that is manifest in today's MAGA-GOP and its cable/social media propagandists ...
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :100:

    Some people say Trump sucked Giulani's cockBenkei
    :rofl: @NOS4A2
  • A Case for Objective Epistemic Norms
    It seems like, and correct me if I am wrong, you ground rationality purely in ethics and not epistemology (and I do the opposite).Bob Ross
    On the contrary, I "ground" ethics and epistemology and ... "in rationality" (i.e. adaptive inferential-discourse). Maybe this divergence is why we're talking past each other.

    Moral facts are useless.
    To whom? For what? Like ecological or medical facts, the utility of "moral facts" is a function of context, Bob: that is, such facts oblige rational agents to posit hypothetical imperatives – normative practices – which are adaptive with respect to those facts as constraints.
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :clap: :rofl:
    Inmate No. P01135809 - RICO Suave!
  • What are you listening to right now?
    He hears the silence howling
    Catches angels as they fall
    And the all-time winner
    Has got him by the balls
    Oh, he picks up Gideons bible
    Open at page one ...

    "Locomotive Breath" (4:23)
    Aqualung, 1971
    writer Ian Anderson
    Jethro Tull


    "Cross-Eyed Mary" (4:06)
    Aqualung, 1971
    writer Ian Anderson
    Jethro Tull

    *


    "Got My Mojo Working" (2:50)
    A-side single, 1957
    writer P. Foster
    Muddy Waters
  • A Case for Objective Epistemic Norms
    To slightly paraphrase ...
    I think that, in light of this, “rationality”, in the sense of “acting in a manner that agrees with reality”, can be objectively grounded insofar as the hypothetical imperative (of reducing suffering (i.e. species defects)) is a presupposition of ethics (ecology, medicine) and thusly not within it; and so “rationality”, which in the sense defined (above) is deeply rooted in ethical (ecological, medicinal) principles, is grounded in the objective ethical (ecological, medicinal) norms.
    I assume, @Bob Ross, you will take issue with this paraphrase and so I look forward to you making explicit its problems or confusions.
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    Yeah, well, as the link in my previous post indicates, I'd advocated Putin's Bitch's disqualification last June or thereabouts. I'm encouraged that the discussion in legal and political circles is gaining momentum. I think when Arizona, Wisconsin and/or Michigan also bring separate RICO / conspiracy indictments similiar to Georgia's indictment, the floodgates will burst open with lawsuits to bar Seditionist-Traitor-Rapist1 from various state ballots for President (or any federal office), the effect of which killing his "candidacy" in it's gaudy crib.

    update:

    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/08/donald-trump-constitutionally-prohibited-presidency/675048/
  • TPF Quote Cabinet
    I'm a failed poet. Maybe every novelist wants to write poetry first, finds he can't and then tries the short story which is the most demanding form after poetry. And failing at that, only then does he take up novel writing. — William Faulkner

    Only the questions are eternal. — Elie Wiesel
  • What can I know with 100% certainty?
    I am 100% certain that I am conscious but it is not possible for me to know with 100% certainty that my body, other humans, non-human organisms, the Earth and the rest of the Universe actually exist.Truth Seeker
    Except tautologically, how are you "100% certain" of anything at all?
  • What are you listening to right now?

    "True radical freedom is not to make a choice ... It's all of a sudden to experience 'this is my fate' ... True choice is unconscious, you experience it as your fate but you are still fully responsible for it."
  • Atheist Cosmology
    What do you think about the evidential value of these conjectural examples?ucarr
    IMO, your un/mis-informed "4 precepts" are incoherent or false (as I've pointed out), so their "evidential values" are negative (à la e.g. candy cotton mountains, five-sided triangles, disembodied minds, etc). Again, go inform yourself, ucarr, by reading the rigorous (popular) studies on natural selection, etc by Mayr, Dawkins, Gould, Wilson et al.
  • Atheist Cosmology
    Nonsense. :roll:

    1) Intelligence is motion organized;ucarr
    Clouds, waterfalls & digestion, for examples, are not "intelligent".

    2) Motion organized within sentients is adaptation;
    Primate digestion does not adapt and yet viruses do adapt.

    3) Adaptation is sentient control of environment;
    Again, viruses adapt.

    4) Sentient controlled environment selects for mutations that improve adaptation to environment
    This might be breeding but it is not natural selection. Read Ernst Mayr. Read Richard Dawkins. Read Stephen J. Gould. Read E.O. Wilson. Read Daniel Dennett. :shade: wtf
  • Atheist Cosmology
    Evidentially, metabolic self-replication does not entail metacognition, or life –/–> intelligent life (i.e. "intention & purpose").
  • Is Philosophy still Relevant?
    It really doesn't matter if we call it 'philosophy' or 'fundamental ontology' [or] 'big picture synthesizing talk.'plaque flag
    :up:
  • Socialism vs capitalism
    Yes, and that "good in (our) world" is – has always been, IMO – the chrysalis from which butterfly-AGIs might emerge ... before we scarcity-catepillars drive ourselves to extinction. I agree with Samwise that (only) that chrysalis is "worth fighting for". :fire:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :cool: 4 out of 4 in 2023 ...

    The timeline of MAGA Loser #1's legal reckoning for his 2016-2023 crime spree (excluding potentially ruinous civil lawsuits):

    1. NYC felony indictment
    31Mar23 :up:
    "34 counts of Business Documents Fraud Crealing and/or Covering-up Felonies", etc

    https://apnews.com/article/trump-indictment-full-document-640043319549?utm_source=homepage&utm_medium=RelatedStories&utm_campaign=position_02

    2. Miami, Federal indictment
    8Jun23 :up:
    re: 37 counts "Mishandling Documents, Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice, Violating Espionage Act, Making False Statements to Federal Authorities, Witness Tampering" etc

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/08/donald-trump-charged-retention-classified-documents

    9Jun23 Federal indictment unsealed ...
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/09/trump-indictment-unsealed-pdf-text-criminal-charges

    2.1 Miami, Federal Superceding Indictment (1)
    27Jul23 :up:
    +3 felony charges (+1 Espionage (32), +2 Obstruction), etc
    + new exhibit – "Iran war plan" documents (audio, July 2021)

    3. Washington, DC, Federal indictment
    1Aug23 :up:
    re: 4 counts
    • Conspiracy to Defraud the U.S.;
    • Conspiracy to Obstruct an Official Proceeding;
    • Obstruction of and attempt to Obstruct an Official Proceeding;
    • Conspiracy to Deprive Voting Rights


    1Aug23 Federal Indictment unsealed ...
    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/01/trump-indictment-full-text-2020-election-jan-6
    — 180 Proof
    4. Fulton County, GA, felony indictment
    14Aug23 :up:
    re: 41 counts, 19 defendants (+ 30 unindicted co-conspirators*)

    *cooperating witnesses for the state :wink:

    In sum: RICO Defendent-1 is charged with Violation of Georgia RICO Act + 12 other felonies...

    https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/14/politics/read-trump-indictment-georgia-election/index.html

    LOCK HIM UP! :victory: :rofl:
  • Socialism vs capitalism
    I would ask simple questions:
    1. Why does one human wish to be more powerful and have more wealth than any other?
    universeness
    Probably because h. sapiens are about a chromosome and a half away from p. troglodytes (chimpanzees).

    Are such drives/motivations, 100% connected to our 'survival of the fittest, jungle rules, beginnings?'
    The history of h. sapiens' dominance hierarchies (i.e. civilizations, sovereigns / states, cults-communes) certainly suggests such a sociobiological "connection".

    If so, then what does the notion of 'civilisation,' really mean to humans?
    In practice – dynastic-oligarchical dominance hierarchy.

    2. Do you think 8 billion humans, fully co-operating, could achieve more than 8 billion humans competing under the control of an elite global few?
    No. Not under conditions (status quo) of political-economic scarcity.

    3. Can the human species find common cause, when we consider the scale of the universe and the resources available within it?
    We haven't yet in over half a century. It's certainly not in the interest of shareholders who profit from – dominate by – exploiting natural and/or man-made / strategic scarcities.

    4. Consider unfettered capitalism in permanent action, forever unchallenged, what would you predict,
    would be the main result of such a permanent global system, for our species?
    Eventually 'survival of the elitest' (millions, not billions) in scattered networks (sprawls) of AI-automated enclaves. Think: Ayn Randian dystopias à la Judge Dredd or Blade Runner (without Replicants).

    https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/787957

    https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/801029
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    :up:
    @Hanover @Maw

    Any guesses how much bail the judge will set for Seditionist-Traitor-Rapist1 in Fulton County, Georgia?
  • Thing-in-itself, Referent, Kant...Schopenhauer
    I've never read any of Schopenhauer's works, but [ ... ]Gnomon
    :smirk:
  • Southern pride?
    I was born and raised in NYC in 1960s-1970s. My father's family was from the Old South. I lived in Atlanta from 1996-2002 and again from 2016-2022, also spending long visits in the surrounding states and Virginia ("up south") as well. In the main, I suspect "Southern Pride" mostly comes from a regional legacy of feeling "undefeated" despite losing a catastrophic, futile (according even to Shelby Foote) secessionist-insurrectionist "civil war". The South has survived Lee's surrender at Appomattox in 1865; thus goes the mantra "The South will rise again" – fallen but not broken. No doubt an over-inflated sense of pride attempts to compensate for a very deep sense (conscious or not) of either shame or guilt for centuries of chattal slavery, apartheid-segregation and other forms of white-on-black terrorism. IMHO as a one-time "carpetbagger", for historical as well as many cultural reasons, I locate the American "heartland" (almost entirely) below the Mason-Dixon line and east of the muddy Mississippi River.
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    My guess is the "J6 trial" will be set for March '24 – the "Falsified Business Records trial" in Manhattan will be moved from March to ??? – and the defense will just have to suck it up. :sweat:
  • Donald Trump (All General Trump Conversations Here)
    From a year-old post ...
    Btw, DJT will be stricken from some key state ballots due to provisions in US 14th Amendment, Sec. 3 because of the findings of J6 Committee and subsequent state & federal indictments, so the fat old orange fascist fuck won't be able to run again in '24 (though he'll still be a player / spoiler of some sort.)180 Proof
    News flash @NOS4A2 Anti-"Deep State" Federalist Society legal scholars argue that Seditionist-Traitor-Rapist1 is CONSTITUTIONALLY DISQUALIFIED from ever being POTUS again:

    https://www.law.uchicago.edu/news/william-baude-and-colleague-write-about-section-3-disqualification-trump-holding-office



    Thoughts?

    @Ciceronianus @Hanover @Maw
  • If there is a god, is he more evil than not?
    And on and on and hosanna. That is to say apparently gaslighting seems to be the answer.schopenhauer1
    :up:
  • If there is a god, is he more evil than not?

    From an old thread "The Problem of Evil"...
    The only deity consistent with a world (it purportedly created and sustains) ravaged by natural afflictions (e.g. living creatures inexorably devour living creatures; congenital birth defects; etc), man-made catastrophes and self-inflicted interpersonal miseries is either a Sadist or a fiction – neither of which are worthy of worship.180 Proof
  • Rationalism's Flat Ontology
    rationality itself is godplaque flag
    :fire:
  • What are you listening to right now?
    Robbie Robertson - lyrics & guitar, d. 2023
  • Atheist Cosmology
    In this conversation, I want to examine whether or not positing evolution in place of a creator amounts, in the end, to the same thing as ...ucarr
    Evolution explains the development of life and not its origin like (so called) "creationism", so it's no more a substitute for an inexplicable (alleged)"creator" than astronomy is "posited in place of" astrology or modern medicine is "posited in place of" faith-healing. Evidence-based stories and evidence-free (faith-based) stories have incommensurable discursive functions and are not interchangeable, or substituteable one for the other.

    ... positing a creator in place of evolution.
    "A creator" is either "posited in place of" We Don't Know Yet – as a creator-of-the-gaps placeholder – or bullshitted denialism of modern evolutionary biology.
  • Dramaturgical Ontology (The Necessity of Existentialism)
    So there's an existential decision to live in a beautifully impersonal way, which I understand as maximally social.plaque flag
    ... or minimally egoic (e.g. Laozi's wu wei, Epicurus' aponia, Pyrrho's epochē, Spinoza's scientia intuitiva, Nietzsche's amor fati, Zapffe-Camus' absurd, Rosset's cruelty ...)

    I want to be us and not just me.
    How about you – second person plural – such as Buber's Ich-Du (or even Dao)?

    I want to strive heroically against my own petty finitude, toward the relative infinity of Feuerbach's species-essence.
    à la Meillassoux / Brassier! :fire: