I provided one example after you concluded it was a resentment-filled fantasy absent any example or reason altogether. — NOS4A2
I didn’t make the conclusion from one example. — NOS4A2
You will be able to give a more reasoned response if you change my words, but I said nothing about your fantasy being "absent any example".
The absence of reason is evident in the assumption that what holds true for one state holds true for all.
So what is it that led to your conclusion about "the state" and "all states"? One example is not sufficient. Examples are not sufficient unless you include the example includes all states.
That was my poor writing. I was trying to say your conclusion about my conclusion was absent any example or reason, implying you were guilty of that which you accused me of. — NOS4A2
More examples ... — NOS4A2
Any counter examples? — NOS4A2
Sure. The United States.
In short, your answer seems to be "Yes, they are simply collateral damage". — Tzeentch
The system that facilites and promotes the birthing of individuals, then promptly attempts to claim them for its own purposes, like a failed parent, has no other answer than "If you don't like it here, you can leave".
Of course, this isn't even a realistic option for the vast majority of individuals. To emancipate oneself from the mental clutches of the state is a lengthy process, by the end of which one finds themselves rooted in the system. To emancipate oneself from the physical clutches of the state, a near-impossibility.
Luckily, the individual has other options. Namely, to dispose any of the state's mental and intellectual impositions in the trash bin where they belong, leaving the state with only its most primitive tool, the cement of "society"; coercion, which the average individual is insignificant enough to evade. — Tzeentch
This implies that I'm for the project of the development of the state, regardless of the incalculable suffering that it may cause. As though I wish that any hunter-gatherer societies that exist today were developed into states, or worse, annexed by a state. — praxis
It's curious that the individualism that you appear to value so much is a consequence of the development of the state, and now you and NOS pooh-poohing the thing that gave rise to your moral framework. Shouldn't you guys be grateful? — praxis
What is the thing that gave rise to this moral framework? In my own case, it was writers such as Humboldt, Mill, Smith, Locke, Hume, Popper, Orwell, AJ Nock, de Cleyre. — NOS4A2
Your obedience is apparent. But appeals to law and authority mean nothing when that authority is questionable, abused and leads to injustice. — NOS4A2
I don’t want my governments to be efficient and effective—welding people in their apartments is efficient and effective. I just want them to leave me alone. — NOS4A2
Should I meddle in your life because what you do affects others? — NOS4A2
Honestly. I just find within that moral framework the seeds of it's own destruction. — James Riley
That sounds rather theoretical, whereas the destruction caused by states and collectives is tangible, real and overwhelming. — Tzeentch
Critics have been promising the failure of individualism since revolutionary France. Any day now, I guess. — NOS4A2
"For the many to thrive, some must suffer," seems to be the reigning sentiment on the opponents of individualism "You will have to suffer, but it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make". That there is no valid reason why the individual would have to accept such a bad deal seems obvious to me. — Tzeentch
Were those who forced non-state societies into the drudgery and disease of developed agriculture working with them cooperatively or exploitively? — praxis
I think there are two basic strategies for social living, which are living cooperatively for mutual benefit or competing for resources. In competition there is always winners and losers, so in that strategy some are guaranteed to suffer. That's not the case in a society that cooperates for mutual benefit. — praxis
I was merely explaining theory of state formation — NOS4A2
... formed by conquest and confiscation — NOS4A2
... tacitly threatening me if I was to act on it. — NOS4A2
you submit what I wrote to contextomy — NOS4A2
... while avoiding any and all arguments I present. — NOS4A2
I never suggested disobedience to the state. — NOS4A2
Your obedience is apparent. But appeals to law and authority mean nothing when that authority is questionable, abused and leads to injustice. — NOS4A2
I never suggested all conquest and confiscation in history was the result of the state. — NOS4A2
So I no longer care about your analysis of what I wrote. — NOS4A2
I guess there is nothing for the individualist to whine, worry, or ring their hands about in consternation. Time to get back to individualizing while sucking the tit of civilization.
P.S. Revolutionary France is, like, two seconds ago in the scheme of things.
One can see, even from this thread alone, that individualism is held in fear or contempt. — NOS4A2
Yet there have been zero refutations of actual individualist argument. — NOS4A2
One can see, even from this thread alone, that individualism is held in fear or contempt. — NOS4A2
Yet there have been zero refutations of actual individualist argument. — NOS4A2
So I have to wonder how much of it is premised on the typical misrepresentation, and further, how much ignorance surmounts because of it. This to me is worthy of whining about. — NOS4A2
Yet there have been zero refutations of actual individualist argument. — NOS4A2
I imagine there could be if you were to present one.
– praxis
Is a critic still a critic if he is unfamiliar with the literature? — NOS4A2
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