But we are talking about the movement of baseball here. Not Earth. You seem to think the Earth is the baseball. They are not the same objects. — Corvus

I am not saying that they are the same things!

I am not saying that they are the same things! — MoK

Why talk about the Earth when we are talking about the baseball movement in time? It appears obvious confusion.

I said that baseball is on Earth, Earth is moving, therefore baseball is moving!

I said that baseball is on Earth, Earth is moving, therefore baseball is moving! — MoK

But the baseball is sitting on the desk at the precise point which can be observed. The earth moving is not relevant to the baseball movement.

But the baseball is sitting on the desk at the precise point which can be observed. The earth moving is not relevant to the baseball movement. — Corvus

You cannot observe any motion because you are an observer that exists on Earth. Anyway, we were discussing a baseball that moves relative to Earth.

You cannot observe any motion because you are an observer that exists on Earth. Anyway, we were discussing a baseball that moves relative to Earth. — MoK

According to your saying, everything on Earth moves. That is nonsense. There are definitely objects which are standing still.

According to your saying, everything on Earth moves. That is nonsense. There are definitely objects which are standing still. — Corvus

Doesn't Earth constantly move?

Doesn't Earth constantly move? — MoK

Maybe it does. But again movement we are talking about is not the Earth movement here. The object we are talking about is the baseball.

Maybe it does. — Corvus

What do you mean by maybe here?

What do you mean by maybe here? — MoK

Because I don't see it moving.

Because I don't see it moving. — Corvus

Do you think that the Sun is moving around Earth or it is Earth that is rotating?

Do you think that the Sun is moving around Earth or it is Earth that is rotating? — MoK

Did I say that? You seem to be saying it.

I asked a question. Could you answer that?

I asked a question. Could you answer that? — MoK

I never said that. All I said was that the movement of Earth was not what we were talking about. You are not able to tell the difference between the Earth and the ball. This is what I said.

No, you said that Earth maybe moves.

No, you said that Earth maybe moves. — MoK

I said it to indicate that the movement of the Earth is not directly perceptible. It was not an implication of anything else as you are imagining.

To say, outright the Earth moves, means that your knowledge is coming from the books, medias and the popular science and words of mouths from the vulgars. Not from your perception or observation.

I said it to indicate that the movement of the Earth is not directly perceptible. It was not an implication of anything else as you are imagining.

To say, outright the Earth moves, means that your knowledge is coming from the books, medias and the popular science and words of mouths from the vulgars. Not from your perception or observation. — Corvus

Sure, I cannot be an expert in all fields. That is why I trust experts' reports. I think that is a healthy practice, don't you think?

Sure, I cannot be an expert in all fields. That is why I trust experts' reports. I think that is a healthy practice, don't you think? — MoK

Yes and no. They are important, but philosophical mind takes nothing for granted. We try to see what is beyond the established beliefs.

Yes and no. They are important, but philosophical mind takes nothing for granted. — Corvus

So, are you critical of what people say, such as Hume as well, or do you think he was absolutely right?

We try to see what is beyond the established beliefs. — Corvus

I am not talking about the established beliefs here but scientific facts.

Anyhow, to you, does Earth rotate around its axis and move around the sun?

So, are you critical of what people say, such as Hume as well, or do you think he was absolutely right? — MoK

I don't blindly judge anything or anyone. Some I agree, and some I don't agree. It depends on the points.

I am not talking about the established beliefs here but scientific facts. — MoK

All scientific facts are to be falsified. If not, they are not scientific facts. They are the religious doctrines.

Anyhow, to you, does Earth rotate around its axis and move around the sun? — MoK

Anyhow to me, the baseball does not move or change in time. To say it moves, is an illusion.

All scientific facts are to be falsified. If not, they are not scientific facts. They are the religious doctrines. — Corvus

I am not talking about scientific theories here, but scientific facts that everybody agrees on, like the Earth's being a moving object. Do you deny that?

Anyhow to me, the baseball does not move or change in time. To say it moves, is an illusion. — Corvus

Doesn't baseball which to you is not moving is on Earth by which Earth is moving all the time?

I am not talking about scientific theories here, but scientific facts that everybody agrees on, like the Earth's being a moving object. Do you deny that? — MoK

Scientific facts are derived from the theories. They are not given to you by God.

Doesn't baseball which to you is not moving is on Earth by which Earth is moving all the time? — MoK

Movement is only a movement when perceived by mind. Linking the baseball movement to the Earth movement sounds not correct thinking, or trying to make things confused, rather than trying to see the real problem.

Scientific facts derived from the theories. They are not given to you by God. — Corvus

Are you denying that Earth is a moving object because you cannot see its motion?

Movement is only a movement when perceived by mind. — Corvus

That is a very wrong statement. Where did you take that from?

Linking the baseball movement to the Earth movement sounds not correct thinking, or trying to make things confused, rather than trying to see the real problem. — Corvus

I can show you have an understanding is wrong if you accept that you and baseball are on Earth and Earth is a moving object.

Are you denying that Earth is a moving object because you cannot see its motion? — MoK

You are confusing between denying and telling that earth rotation cannot be directly perceived.

That is a very wrong statement. Where did you take that from? — MoK

How can you tell a movement without perceiving and observing the movement? Are you guessing? or meditating?

I can show you have an understanding is wrong if you accept that you and baseball are on Earth and Earth is a moving object. — MoK

We are not talking about the ball on the earth. We are talking about the ball on the desk.

You are confusing between denying and telling that earth rotation cannot be directly perceived. — Corvus

So, you cannot tell that the Earth is moving because you cannot see it moving. Is it a correct statement? How do you explain the motion of the Sun in the sky then?

How can you tell a movement without perceiving and observing the movement? Are you guessing? or meditating? — Corvus

I am arguing against what you said: "Movement is only a movement when perceived by mind.". There was a period when there was no life on Earth but Earth was moving. Are you denying that?

We are not talking about the ball in the earth. We are talking about the ball on the desk. — Corvus

But the table on Earth. Adding an extra object does not help you.

So, you cannot tell that the Earth is moving because you cannot see it moving. Is it a correct statement? How do you explain the motion of the Sun in the sky then? — MoK

I am just saying my statement is based on observation, but your argument is based on your imagination and the words of mouths from the vulgars.

I am arguing against what you said: "Movement is only a movement when perceived by mind.". There was a period when there was no life on Earth but Earth was moving. Are you denying that? — MoK

That is also imagination from the words of mouths of the vulgars. There is no observational evidence in that statements.

But the table on Earth. Adding an extra object does not help you. — MoK

When talking about movements, the rational folks talk about the movement from A to B on the earth. Think about your movement from your house to your school. When you are in your house, you are at the starting point. You have not moved from your house on the journey to the school when you are in the house. The movement starts from the house, when you go out the house making journey towards the school.

No one would drag the earth into the arguments, and claim that you have been always moving without moving. It is a hideous contradiction to say that the earth moves, so everything moves.

Are you willing to learn anything new except what your perceptions tell you!?

Are you willing to learn anything except what your perceptions tell you!? — MoK

The point is not just about perception. It is about rationality and logic in the argument.

The point is not just about perception. It is about rationality and logic in the argument. — Corvus

But your perception is limited so your arguments could not be rational or logical if you depend on them.