I am not sure to what extent the problem which I raise fits into the philosophy of time, or as an aspect of how one lives and living wisdom. I have read Eckhart Tolle's, ' The Eternal Now' and see how both past and future collapse into the experience of the 'eternal now'. However, eternity is such a wide frame of possible changes. The awareness of the moment may involve the experience of mindfulness, especially sensory experiences and the flow of thoughts.

But I do see it as a difficult aspect of life experience, although I am aware that it may be dismissed by those who come from the academic pursuit of philosophy. In that respect, I am not sure if the linguistic concept of the 'now is to be regarded or disregarded. Nevertheless, meaning and idea are conceptualized both in time present and past, as well in the momentary aspects of thinking. So, what is the significance of the 'now' in philosophy, especially as a thinker looks back on the history of philosophy, and the future? I am not sure to what extent it is a practical experience, a psychological issue or conceptual issue in understanding. I see it as an area for contemplation but what do you think?

It sounds like putting emphasis on sensory perception rather than on thinking, or on holistic consciousness rather than analytic.

It could be seen that way, but if analytical aspects of philosophy are viewed above experience, including the sensory, philosophy could be seen as obscure and irrelevant to life.

It's just a way of describing life that works for some (possibly many if not most people, judging from it's popularity). If you're not one of them, heh, be grateful. Literally not a single philosopher mentioned on this site in 10 years was "like the rest" or "placated and satiated by the norms and mainstream beliefs of others." Am I wrong?

I don't know you, but I know of many others like you. For most people this "fear of the future" is ultimately the fear of death. Which is natural. Understandable. The hallmark of an intelligent mind well aware of one's self and place in the universe. Or is it? Try skydiving. Or even a trip to the coaster. It might open your eyes.

For many, "the here and now" is simply living an unexamined life guided by impulse and animalistic primal desire. The lowest levels of, not just human, but any living beings, experience or perception. It's important to have a balance. If you have children one day, for example. They are inexperienced and not able to understand quite literally anything but "the here and now." This in some ways makes some people's belief that the "here and now" is "all there is" a trap that they are trapped in and, whether intentionally or unintentional, only exist to trap others in. People who never grow up. People who never realize there's more to reality than what they're able to currently experience. Not unlike a person in a wheelchair, except their handicap is, not just mental, but spiritual even, Almost? Eh, just my take on the matter. Good luck in whatever it is you do.

The importance of living in the 'here and now' is one emphasised by many authors. One author, Ken Keyes, in, 'Handbook of Higher Consciousness: The Science of Happiness', states,
'If you are not enjoying every here and now moment in life, it is because your addictions (otherwise known as desires, attachments, demands, expectations, emotional programming, models of how life should treat you) are making you dwell in the dead past or the imagined future. They are keeping you from being here and now. All there is in life is the eternal now moment- and the experience of the moment is created by the programming in your head'. — Jack Cummins

Being trapped within the ‘dead’ past and imagined future are of a piece with being stuck within the punctual ‘now’. The problems you list don’t come from privileging the past or future over the immediate present, but from splitting these three dimensions of time off from each other. We can never experience a pure in-itself present. That would make all experience vanish. Imagine trying to enjoy a piece of music without thr ability to retain the prior note in mind while listening to the presently appearing note. The meaning of the music as music would disappear. Imagine reading these sentences without anticipating into the next letter and word. What we call the ‘now’ gets its sense and meaning by retaining the just past and anticipating into the future. These three dimensions all belong to the same ‘now’. It is when we treat our past, future or present in a refied and isolating way rather than as belonging to a continuous creative flow that we run the risk of reducing our experience to meaninglessness.

It could be seen that way, but if analytical aspects of philosophy are viewed above experience, including the sensory, philosophy could be seen as obscure and irrelevant to life. — Jack Cummins

I wouldn't say obscure or irrelevant, but one should do also other things in life than analytic philosophy, in order to be healthy and enjoy life.

I wonder to what extent fear of the future is fear of death. Psychoanalytic thinkers have spoken of the idea of the 'nameless dread', which may be so encompassing.It may represent the chaos which is beyond personal or human control.

Being trapped within the ‘dead’ past and imagined future are of a piece with being stuck within the punctual ‘now’. The problems you list don’t come from privileging the past or future over the immediate present, but from splitting these three dimensions of time off from each other. — Joshs

:100:

Good, and dfficult, question. There was a huge cult book published in the late 60's, Be Here Now, by Richard Alpert, who became Ram Dass, a key figure in the counter-culture. The idea was that to drop all attachments to the past and expectations for the future was to live in the 'eternal now'. And that is a theme that surfaces in many works of the perennial philosophy.

Joshs is right in saying that were we to literally abandon all expectation and memory, we would in effect be unconscious, as consciousness is inextricably intertwined with memory and expectation. But I don't think those spiritual admonitions should be interpreted that way. I think they're referring to a state of rapture in which all sense of time drops away, and we see 'eternity in an hour' as William Blake put it. As to 'attaining' such a state of being - I think it's a practical impossibility to consciously engineer such a state, although it can be sought in a variety of ways. I think, maybe, mountaineers and climbers experience such states through total absorption in the moment (and coming to think of it, this is the meaning of flow states, described by the late psychologist Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi (trying to pronounce that name might produce a flow state.)) Eckhart Tolle's book The Power of Now is specfically about it.

"living in the here and now" sounds like just one more cliche from authors making money in the self-help trade. Not that I have anything against "being in the present moment". What exactly is so great about being in the here and now of scrubbing the bathroom? Or of balancing one's checkbook? Or of having a bad headache? Etc. Quite often (in the real world) the here and now sucks!

I spent an evening with Richard Alpert, aka Ram Dass, at St. Catherine's College quite a few years ago @Wayfarer. It was lovely. Listening to something wonderful by Schubert, or biking in Wisconsin in perfect fall weather; or reading a really great book about how the continent of North America was put together have all been splendid. When one is doing something very enjoyable and worthwhile, one wants to "pay attention" or be present in that experience.

As far as the past goes, William Faulkner was right: "The past is never dead. It's not even past". (I haven't read the book where he wrote that. That's OK. It's still true.) That said, perseverating over past events doesn't help the present or the future. "Don't worry about the future" has always struck me as bad advice. True, the troubles of today are sufficient unto themselves, per Jesus, but there is no point in making tomorrow worse by what we are doing in the present moment--per Bitter Crank. So do worry about tomorrow at least a little, please.

NOW is always a juggling act with the past and future. How big is it? The "now" of my brain is a few minutes long, maybe. The "now" of geology lasts for centuries. The "now" of history is slow and spacious, until it suddenly switches to dizzying speeds. The "now" of a pop song on a 45 rpm record used to be about 2 minutes and 15 seconds.

Jack, I spent many years in the unpleasant present you seem to be occupying. Like you are doing, one endures; one questions why; one wishes life would be better. And periodically life does get better, at least for a time. Unfortunately, and it really is unfortunate, life just isn't organized around our being happy.

I’ve noticed many sports people interviewed courtside have really internalized this ‘here and now’ mentality’. This point, this match - don’t think about the championship or the series. Be in the now.

True. The "now" of a basketball game or tennis match is very short. The now of a marathon, not so short. Broadcast baseball games seem to have an interminable now -- God! When is this thing going to be over!!! Cricket I suppose has as speedy a now as molasses in January.

:rofl:

What do you think and how do you manage ruminating on the past or fears about the future? What exactly is the 'now', as it is a slice of time between past and future?

To my view, there is no qualitative emotional difference between the past, future and the present. That is fears of the future could in another's hands, be joyful anticipation. Basically the past is (incompletely) known, the future is unknown (but can be predicted with some accuracy) and the present is experienced in Real Time.

A healthy strategy would be to acknowledge that the past can't be changed, but it can be examined for clues and cues from which to understand current and predict future events. Knowing the future is a Superpower of considerable value and anyone possessing even an imperfect version of it, would likely be on the road to current success and would probably view the future positively.

A healthy strategy would be to acknowledge that the past can't be changed — LuckyR

But what it means can be changed - by what you do next.

It is hard to know how much is about splitting the past and future, or how much is holding on to the consequences of what has happened and likely occurrences in the future. It may be possible to switch this off, but awareness of the past casts a shadow, especially on mood. For example, if I had a bad day it may effect me for some future days. If I had some disagreement with someone it will have to be faced. If I have spent too much money one day I am likely to run short later.

Some consequences which have to be faced are trivial and some serious. If one commits a crime it may have effects which cannot be forgotten for one's entire life.

As for thoughts and worries about the future, some may be futile anxieties and others may be real obstacles to be faced. Distinguishing between them is not always easy. If I think back 10 years some of the things which I feared happening did and some didn't. It involves uncertainty and trying to plan ahead. But so much worry about imagined events can spoil quality of life in the present if the fears are of an intrusive nature. Slicing them out, like the memories of the past is difficult because the slicing of past and future is not as simple as the hour, day and month, as these roll together.

I haven't read the book the book by Ram Dass but maybe the album 'Be Here Now', by Oasis was named after it (the album was released on a critical day, as it was the day Lady Diana died in a car crash).

As for blotting out memories of the past, one way this occurs is as a side-effect of ECT, but such memory loss is not always appreciated by individuals. This is some kind of induced unconsciousness.

Blake's idea of seeing 'eternity in an hour' is important because it is about focusing on the moment, especially in states of rapture. At times I felt able to achieve this, but only temporarily, falling back into rumination on memories and anxieties of what may happen. Similarly, one interpretation of Christ's idea of 'eternal life' involves attunment with a sense of eternity, rather than the idea of eternal life being about living forever. This interpretation would involve focus upon living life as best as one can rather than constant excessive worry.

In some ways, the idea of living in the moment is a best-selling idea because many would like to do so but cannot.

Part of the problem is that the present isn't always great. Even when content, that may have been achieved by a some underlying memories. The difficulty can be shuffling the pleasant from the unpleasant effectively. Also, thoughts of the future involve dreams and ambitions, so a certain amount of thought about the future is often what gives a glimpse of future light.

Yes, I am writing this thread because I am not completely happy on a day to day basis and get anxious about what will happen next. I often wake up with anxieties and it is often that I have been awake in the night worrying too. On the other hand, when there is a bad situation, I often joke and say, 'Let's wait and see what next', with some underlying awareness of everything being transient.

it is true that the past is more fixed than the unknown of the future. I am aware of the idea in neurolinguist programming that the past can be remade in thought through reframing. This doesn't seem possible at times but I am aware that memories which were terrible can alter at some point in thinking about the larger picture. In particular, some memories of life when I was at school seemed atrocious for some time but looking back from my present thinking is so different, especially in the emotional charge of the memories. Also, the cognitive behaviour therapists speak of how it is thoughts about events which affect emotions as opposed to the actual events.

Also, awareness of the past is meant to be a basis for understanding and thinking about the present and choices. The problem is that learning from mistakes doesn't always occur. This is on a personal level and wider scale. In particular, I have always seen the study of history as important about striving to do things differently but humanity doesn't always learn from lessons of the past.

It is hard to know how much is about splitting the past and future, or how much is holding on to the consequences of what has happened and likely occurrences in the future. It may be possible to switch this off, but awareness of the past casts a shadow, especially on mood. For example, if I had a bad day it may effect me for some future days. If I had some disagreement with someone it will have to be faced. If I have spent too much money one day I am likely to run short later — Jack Cummins

When one talks about experiencing the past or the future , one emphasizes a certain style of approach , a certain mood or attitude. I am ‘pre-occupied’ rather than just being occupied with my future. I am ‘dwelling on’ rather than flowing though the past. I suggest what characterizes these experiences as negative dwelling on and pre-occupation isn’t their temporal position as past or future but the way we move through recollection or anticipation. Since I hold to the view that recollection is a constructive activity, I don’t give it lesser status in relation to the supposed freshness of the now. Recollection is essential to imagination and thus creative thought. As far as anticipating into the future , this also depends in part both on recollection and experience of the present. If we stare into a night sky and let our mind drift off into vast futures , it can give us a sense of profundity peace view of breadth of perspective. It can make the problems of the now fade into insignificance.
How can it do this if it is not keeping us within the now?

Because the ‘now’ is the flow of nows, and this flow is always characterized by a style, an attitude, a mood. It doesn’t matter whether this mood is generated from a reflection on a long ago event , an event far off in the future or one occurring right this moment. What matters is how we are understanding the flow of events to unfold one out of the previous. Are they harmoniously intercorrelated one with the next so as to make some kind of referential sense to us, or are they a puzzle to us , a chaos of unpredictability and alienation? This is what determines ether our experience of the ‘now’ is enjoyable or miserable and isolating.

There are times when we feel stuck in our thinking and our feeling, for instance when we are depressed, and typically this stuckneas is inescapable regardless of whether we dwell in memories , focus on the present or imagine into the future. What is often needed to snap us out of this depression is to create a fresh meaningful way forward. Being in the moment isn’t enough. It’s HOW we are being in the moment. This can be accomplished from out of any of the three temporal modes , but will ultimately involve all three. I rethink my past in relation to a changed present(sometimes just rethinking the past will change one’s present) , which anticipates freshly into the future.

Or one could say keeping one’s present from becoming a stale, stuck recycling of habits of thought involves dipping into the future in order to reinvent one’s past.

Fear in the future comes from the bad experience in the past. Bad experience comes from bad people. Forgiving is forgetting. If you manage to forgive the past, then you can live in the present and open your arms to what the future brings to you.

Imagination is an important factor in navigating the processes of flow. One suggestion which I have come across by a few authors is that of living one's day as if it was one's last. I find this fairly helpful, although I don't really do everything exactly as if was my last, but as an imaginary frame. For example, I am able to do that to some extent today by trying to enjoy it as much as possible. That is because I know that I am not going to be able to pursue the issues which I am worried about as it is weekend and the people I need to speak with are not working. I am focusing on the moment by sensory appreciation, especially listening to music. Such moments prepare mindset for coping with whatever happens. There is also a sense of being able to transmute the darkness, or negatively into a transformative way of creativity.

With recollection, I have found generally that thinking of how previous break situations often turned out. There was painful experience to cope with but some kind of way through. I also find that a certain amount of gratefulness for the positives in any situation as important in some faith that a way forward can be found when I am becoming preoccupied with fear about the future.

I am not sure that it as simple as, 'Bad experience comes from bad people'. There is some way in which the way we experience unpleasant behaviour from others is a factor. The first time I went out and got drunk was because someone had really upset me in a conversation. However, I know that in many instances that it is not just others who lead me into difficulties.

I am my own worst enemy sometimes, with an internal saboteur that leads to inner and outer chaos. So, forgiving myself is important too. This can be harder than forgiving others, although forgiveness of oneself and others are interconnected. I often get angry with myself and this doesn't help in the processing of the past and the flow of life into future mental states and action. It involves embracing a spirit of compassion, which begins with self-compassion.

Sub specie aeternitatis — Spinoza

People like us who believe in physics know that the distinction between past, present, and future is only a stubbornly persistent illusion. — Albert Einstein

I.e. Suppose we exist in a Growing Block Universe...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growing_block_universe

"Imagine a film reel. As you watch the movie, you can only experience each frame of the movie as it happens. However, if you go to the projector and pop out the reel, you can see that each frame exists all at once on the reel. The 'past, present, and future' of the movie exists all at once and the way that we watch the movie is the illusion."

But I prefer Freddy Zarathustra's anti-anxiety remedy ...

This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more; and there will be nothing new in it, but every pain and every joy and every thought and sigh and everything unutterably small or great in your life will have to return to you, all in the same succession and sequence - even this spider and this moonlight between the trees, and even this moment and I myself. The eternal hourglass of existence is turned upside down again and again, and you with it, speck of dust! — The Gay Science, s341

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_return

In other words, Jack, fully accepting your past – wishing to relive both your good and bad experiences – can be your future; hope for that more than anything else.

:death: :flower:

The block universe may be true. It does also seem that we relive so much of the past and it does take a lot of processing to reach some acceptance. That's why some people go for therapy. I do find a certain amount of journaling useful. At first, I found that my entries were extremely negative but now I try to incorporate thoughts about the future as well as the past. Being aware of the ups and downs is important. The Hindus invented the game of snakes and ladders based on this.

The importance of living in the 'here and now' is one emphasised by many authors. — Jack Cummins

It is surely only an act* of imagination to suppose one is ever any-when-or-where else.

*act as in 'performance'.

Here and now is where/when we dream of a future as a replay of the past - only better, with hindsight.

*Every performance is live; even the replay of a recording is live, only it is unresponsive to the audience

Being trapped within the ‘dead’ past and imagined future are of a piece with being stuck within the punctual ‘now’. — Joshs

Yeah, that's well said. :up:

the late psychologist Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi (trying to pronounce that name might produce a flow state.) — Wayfarer

:lol:

The problem is that learning from mistakes doesn't always occur. This is on a personal level and wider scale. In particular, I have always seen the study of history as important about striving to do things differently but humanity doesn't always learn from lessons of the past.

Exactly, very few get beyond the emotional component elicited by reviewing their past in order to access the learning points from those past events in order to develop the ability through pattern recognition, to predict (with a certain, imperfect degree of accuracy) how individuals and groups will respond to future situations. Thereby creating opportunities to position oneself to benefit from those events. Ultimately, creating a situation whereby the future attains the status of providing opportunities to exploit in order to further one's goals. A positive outlook.

I understand what you are trying to say. Life could be very difficult when we are facing challenges. The challenges are due to others or ourselves. I had a very difficult period in my life, too, and I fought the best I could. I still feel evil thoughts and intentions even now, which I am sure are not due to me, and I can handle them easily now. So, I think, everything for you is a matter of time. Once you reach a level where you are sure that you can control everything on a personal level, then you can manage your life better.

All your thoughts are your own responsibility, and thus due to you.

This "Science of Happiness" seems like a petty book written by an ignorant author who cannot understand that they simply hate who they are... Like Paul Ree.

1st: All production within the body is product of our desire.

2nd: Happiness is achieved as a byproduct from overcoming that which prevents us from achieving our desires.

3rd: Killing off ones desires causes a low strength of will, as the drives at the summit of ones rank ordering of drives have that many less desires to overcome. Thus they're not very strong desires.

4th: There is no right or wrong action in the gateway of this moment even if it be looking back or looking forward. Not doing either or would be a folly, and only Fortune's fool would benefit from such a life style.

5th: We can always step back and not make it a chronic habit to stagnate and languish in the past or be anxious over our future. And although aiming at a goal is often ineffective, as @Outlander points out in a recent shoutbox comment. One can still aim at the future by DOING in the here and now. Find something you enjoy doing, throw yourself into it, and build a habit into the muscle memory. Whether or not you're recognized in life, posthumously, or never at all, well, so be it. But there's no harm in aspiring to be something you're not currently. Transfigure suffering through sublation into a higher affirmation of life, where the very negation becomes the motor of creation.