I'm saying that that is what some materialists will claim. See The Mind/Brain Identity Theory. Contrary to your repeated claims, materialism doesn't entail epiphenomenalism. — Michael
This article had epiphenomenalism written all over it — Rich
I'm not sure how you read that into it. — Michael
No, I'm saying MIND. The experience of Life.
As I said earlier, materialists just pretend that such a thing doesn't exist, they (their Minds) are so involved in denying it. — Rich
The identity theorist argues that consciousness is identical to certain brain processes, — Michael
I'm saying that that is what some materialists will claim. See The Mind/Brain Identity Theory. Contrary to your repeated claims, materialism doesn't entail epiphenomenalism. — Michael
As I said, if there is no difference between the mind and matter, if they are identical, then that is that. There are mind-waves directing the actions of our being. Materialism vanishes. — Rich
So you say. But given that there is a rich history of the competing monisms of materialism, idealism and neutral monism, I'm going to need more than just a few sentences to convince me to abandon these traditional distinctions. — Michael
I'm not saying that identity theory doesn't have any problems. I'm saying that materialism doesn't entail epiphenomenalism, and so to attack materialism by attacking epiphenomenalism doesn't make sense. — Michael
Do you agree with the definition of materialism in OP? If yes, there is no room left for consciousness since physical process determine everything. We also know that identity theory is not right therefore consciousness and physical process cannot be same. — bahman
I don't understand why this is so hard to understand. — Michael
You have unilaterally redefined materialism as some sort of Identity Theory — Rich
You have agreed that Mind and Body are identical. That defines your philosophy. — Rich
No I haven't. I've said that materialists can be identity theorists. — Michael
materialist will claim that mind is matter, — Michael
Fine they can be anyone they want. I guess for some people the word is most important. "I am a materialist." quietly .... but I believe that mind and material are identical. — Rich
No, according to you Mind and Brain (matter) are identical. In other words, brain is mind. — Rich
They might believe that the mind is identical to some material thing (e.g. brain activity), — Michael
materialist will claim that mind is matter, — Michael
Well then, you have to come up with a Theory on how some matter is identical to Mind and others aren't and how it persists. — Rich
Some material things are consciousness. — Michael
Why? Does the materialist need to explain how some matter is identical to brain activity and others aren't, and how it persists? Does he need to explain how some matter is identical to a tree and others aren't, and how it persists? — Michael
Or, consciousness and material is identical. That is what you claim. How does that sound with you? That's my belief. — Rich
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