There is a subtext here, viz. the utilitarian assumption that there is an optimal course of action -- one that results in the greatest happiness, is impelled by the most libido, or has the maximal value of some other utility function. However, if you look at the lead up to decisions, what Aristotle calls proairesis, that is not how we choose. I have never assigned a value to each motivating factor and then calculated which option maximizes the resulting utility. In fact, such a calculation cannot be done, implicitly or explicitly. The reason is simple: motivating factors are not commensurate. No amount of sex will satisfy our need for nutrition, and neither will satisfy our need for understanding. Thus, no trade-off is possible.
H. A. Simmon has written about this at length. Human decisions are made using satisficing rather than maximization. We choose courses of action that satisfy as many of our needs as possible, rather than finding one that maximizes some utility function. As there are many courses of action that can satisfy our needs, satisficing, unlike optimizing, does not constrain us to a single line of action. — Dfpolis
I think supervenience is an irrational distraction -- one invented to avoid discussions of causal ontology. — Dfpolis
There can be no historical events without variations in the positions of the moon and planets, but that does not mean that we should all be studying astrology. — Dfpolis
Survival is of prime importance and we survive better in groups, — Jamesk
it is not a choice made of freewill. — Jamesk
Sounds like an outright attack on morality to me. — Jamesk
Supervenience does not do away with cause and effect. The lower level physical realization is subject to cause and effect as is the higher level mental exercise. It's just that the two levels line up 1:1. — Noah Te Stroete
A set of properties A supervenes upon another set B just in case no two things can differ with respect to A-properties without also differing with respect to their B-properties. — Supervenience by Brian McLaughlin & Karen Bennett in SEP
Whatever happens to occur to the alcoholic is predetermined based on his memories, beliefs, experience, mood, and whatever need he feels he needs to satisfy. There is no optimization calculus. — Noah Te Stroete
Supervenience does not do away with cause and effect. — Noah Te Stroete
The physical determination of the planets does not supervene on human behavior. — Noah Te Stroete
I wasn't saying that we should do anything like astrology. — Noah Te Stroete
The physical determination of the planets does not supervene on human behavior. — Noah Te Stroete
But, it does! Read the definition of supervenience: — Dfpolis
Is this adult child responsible, or is the parent who failed to teach the child discipline and responsibility? — Relativist
I'll bet you agree with me that the adult child is responsible. — Relativist
Both will be exhibiting behavior that can plausibly considered to have been determined by their beliefs, dispositions, and impulses. — Relativist
The drunk driver may have been compelled, but punishment is still necessary to keep dangerous people off the streets and for deterrence. — Noah Te Stroete
People engage in a behavior we call "choosing", this is indisputable. Even if a different choice could not have been made, it is still the case that the choice has been made and it is is a direct result of the choosers deliberation. The choice is in the causal chain. — Relativist
You seem to be arguing that since responsibility can be distributed, it is entirely subjective — Dfpolis
The particular factors are always necessary and sufficient causes of the particular “choice”. Always. Across the board. — Noah Te Stroete
We may not technically responsible in the sense you are seeking, however our position in the group 'holds' us (and all of the groups members) responsible for their acts. So you are responsible without being responsible and that is fine because we are all the same in this respect. All of us are egalitarian victims of determinism so freedom doesn't really come into it. — Jamesk
Supervenience claims do not merely say that it just so happens that there is no A-difference without a B-difference; they say that there cannot be one. — Terrapin Station
Supervenience is a central notion in analytic philosophy. It has been invoked in almost every corner of the field. For example, it has been claimed that aesthetic, moral, and mental properties supervene upon physical properties. — Supervenience by Brian McLaughlin & Karen Bennett in SEP
if and only if exact similarity with respect to B-properties guarantees exact similarity with respect to A-properties. — Terrapin Station
A good deal of philosophical work has gone into distinguishing these forms of supervenience, and into examining their pairwise logical relations. — Terrapin Station
There are A differences if and only if there are B differences. It goes both ways. Just Google “supervenience”. “If and only if” doesn’t just mean “if”. — Noah Te Stroete
X is said to supervene on Y if and only if some difference in Y is necessary for any difference in X to be possible. — Supervenience - Wikipedia
Yes, I see the modal "can." Our biological existence depends on living in the kind of universe that we do. If the laws of nature, the physical constants and the initial state of the universe were different (so that the planets were not as they are) we would not be here to act as we do. Thus, there is a necessary link between human behavioral changes and the planetary movements, but not a causal relation — Dfpolis
The implication would seem to be that since these non-physical properties supervene on physical properties, — Dfpolis
Furthermore, I’m not the one who espouses proairesis. You do. I believe memory, beliefs, mood, and need, etc., are necessary And sufficient causes of our decisions. You keep setting up Straw Men instead of addressing my premises. — Noah Te Stroete
We are only morally responsible as a matter of convention. Metaphysically we are not responsible. — Noah Te Stroete
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