NKBJ
718
All that "believing" nonsense. You just cannot call your blind guesses...blind guesses. You have to call them "believing."
You ought to figure out why you do that.
Anyway...you do make sense...providing, of course, that you logic out the window. — Frank Apisa
Again, thanks for agreeing that I make sense!
You don't really provide an argument or anuthing here except trying to say I'm illogical. But I'll still give you an example of how you can know something doesn't exist:
You know how many hands you have. It's probably two, barring special circumstances. You know you don't have three hands. You can search up and down your body and not find a third hand. You have zero proof of a third hand. But you do have a lot of lack of evidence in favor of a third hand. You're perfectly justified in claiming you KNOW you have two hands and no third.
Anyone who tells you (or me) it's illogical to know you don't have a third hand has very simply lost touch with reality. — NKBJ
Maureen
13
↪Frank Apisa
"I do not know if gods exist or not;
I see no reason to suspect gods CANNOT EXIST...that the existence of gods is impossible;
I see no reason to suspect that gods MUST EXIST...that gods are needed to explain existence;
I do not see enough unambiguous evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess in either direction...
...so I don't."
^Correct me if am wrong... — Maureen
... but it sounds like you are just admitting that you don't know whether or not God exists. So is there a reason why you can't just admit this without an explanation? Keep in mind that if I had written this post and I had simply said "nobody will admit that they don't know if God exists," this would sound like I was just making an assumption that nobody knows if God exists without anything to base it on. Therefore I had to explain that there may be every reason to believe that God does not exist, but that God may still exist even in spite of this, so therefore nobody knows if God does or does not exist. Otherwise it wold sound like I was just saying that nobody knows if God exists just because I wanted to believe this, not because there is an actual legitimate reason why nobody knows this like the reason that I explained.
The fact that you can make a thing work for one thing...does not mean it works universally. — Frank Apisa
S
9k
↪Frank Apisa
Haha. Alright, calm down, bruv. There's no need to shout. I probably got you mixed up with Devans99 because you both have light green avatars and incessantly repeat yourselves. — S
NKBJ
719
The fact that you can make a thing work for one thing...does not mean it works universally. — Frank Apisa
If I can do it for one thing proves it's possible to be done and so there's no reason not to apply it to gods. At least, you haven't supplied one aside from loose and unsubstantiated claims of illogic.
Just saying "this is illogical" doesn't make it so. — NKBJ
I've shown you why your reasoning is defective, but you apparently want to insist — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
720
I've shown you why your reasoning is defective, but you apparently want to insist — Frank Apisa — NKBJ
Egads...you've also shown yourself why your reasoning is defective?
Never woulda thunk it. — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
721
Egads...you've also shown yourself why your reasoning is defective?
Never woulda thunk it. — Frank Apisa
By your own logic you can't "prove" my reasoning is defective. — NKBJ
Really?
And let's hear your case for that.
You may be right...although I doubt it.
If you are, I will acknowledge it. — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
722
Really?
And let's hear your case for that.
You may be right...although I doubt it.
If you are, I will acknowledge it. — Frank Apisa
Ah, but (again, by your logic) you can't know that I'm right. You also can't know that I'm wrong. Absent any way to know either way, you are eternally suspended in an agnostic limbo. — NKBJ
NKBJ
723
↪Frank Apisa
Using your exact logic you would be bound to:
"I do not know if the chance that NKBJ is correct and also Frank Apisa's superior in every way which includes her amazingly good looks and supreme intellect exists or not;
I see no reason to suspect the chance that NKBJ is correct and also Frank Apisa's superior in every way which includes her amazingly good looks and supreme intellect CANNOT EXIST...that the existence of the chance that NKBJ is correct and also Frank Apisa's superior in every way which includes her amazingly good looks and supreme intellect is impossible;
I see no reason to suspect that the chance that NKBJ is correct and also Frank Apisa's superior in every way which includes her amazingly good looks and supreme intellect MUST EXIST...that the chance that NKBJ is correct and also Frank Apisa's superior in every way which includes her amazingly good looks and supreme intellect is needed to explain existence;
I do not see enough unambiguous evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess in either direction...
...so I don't."
So yeah, your logic leads to the conclusion that you can't know and can't meaningfully guess at whether I know that there is no God.
(Yes, I had fun writing that :heart: ) — NKBJ
I'm glad you had fun. Fun is a big part of these Internet fora...and I also am having fun. This seems to be a win/win situation. — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
724
↪Frank Apisa
On what basis do you know that your birthday isn't a mistake? That you weren't switched at birth? We have evidence that people do get switched at birth (in which case your birthday may be August 8th or 7th or even 6th!), whereas we have no evidence that gods exist or even could exist. It's actually far more likely that you're wrong about your birthday than that gods exist.
By your logic, you cannot claim you know your birthday. — NKBJ
NKBJ
725
I'm glad you had fun. Fun is a big part of these Internet fora...and I also am having fun. This seems to be a win/win situation. — Frank Apisa
Good! I'm glad you're not as irritated as you seemed to be earlier in this thread :) — NKBJ
You are going ape.
Didn't mean to rattle you so. I thought you were more in control. — Frank Apisa
In any case, if you want to think that you KNOW that no gods exist, because I cannot "know" my birthday is August 9th...fine with me. — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
726
You are going ape.
Didn't mean to rattle you so. I thought you were more in control. — Frank Apisa
Oh boy... and we were just starting to get along. Too bad you can't stay nice consistently.
In any case, if you want to think that you KNOW that no gods exist, because I cannot "know" my birthday is August 9th...fine with me. — Frank Apisa
Oh boy again... I'm merely explaining why your logic isn't consistent.
Anyway, guess your odd and vague reply just means you can't explain how you can claim to know your birthday but not the non-existence of gods. — NKBJ
So...where does that leave us? — Frank Apisa
NKBJ
727
So...where does that leave us? — Frank Apisa
That leaves us agreeing to disagree I suppose? At least, it seems to me the conversation is not moving forward much at this point.
Truce? Or do you have something heretofore unmentioned to add? — NKBJ
Oh God. But that just sounds very much like you're believing what you want to believe. — S
he belief isn't reasonable, but it serves a purpose. — S
In theory, it could have been belief in anything whatsoever, including things that believers themselves find ridiculous, preposterous, absurd, and unthinkable, but that is undoubtedly a double standard. — S
True. This is called belief...I believe the Lakers will one day win the NBA championship just as I believe the Cowboys will win the NFL. — Anaxagoras
Of course, it gives my brain confidence, but it doesn't make me wrong for the belief. — Anaxagoras
Well my ideas of a spaghetti god are different than my ideas of what and who God is. — Anaxagoras
No, it is an example of belief, but not all belief is like that. — S
That particular kind of belief is belief based on wishful thinking. — S
and should therefore be rejected and avoided, if you share the same values as me in this regard. — S
Ok, fine your point? — Anaxagoras
According to you. — Anaxagoras
Religious belief or otherwise is personal and whether you perceive it as wishful is up to you, but nonetheless it is, my belief. — Anaxagoras
But you're nobody to me. You're an opinion on the internet and not an authority and even if you were an authority you're still a nobody online. Regardless how you formulate your arguments philosophically to where an atheist would jerk off to it and splooge all over the place, it would not change how I would believe spiritually.
I would stop if I were you because this road is actually closed. The "proving that God doesn't exist" stops here. — Anaxagoras
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