Improper meaning would not be the absence of meaning but a meaning that was not what was meant — Fooloso4
Where did I say any of that? — Sam26
Meaning is in no way predicated on intention in Witty, and this includes when it doesn't conform to intention. — StreetlightX
There either 'is' meaning or there is not: either what is said has some significance that can be cottoned on to, or there is not. 'Improper meaning' is not a thing. — StreetlightX
the overall picture. — Sam26
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drawing_HandsDrawing Hands is a lithograph by the Dutch artist M. C. Escher first printed in January 1948. It depicts a sheet of paper out of which, from wrists that remain flat on the page, two hands rise, facing each other and in the paradoxical act of drawing one another into existence.
If I am the speaker and you take what I said in the wrong way then what you thought what I said meant was an improper meaning, it was not without meaning. — Fooloso4
When I say something I mean something by what I say. Don't you? — Fooloso4
If you are given safety instructions on how to exit the plane and you thought the instructions meant pull in the window rather than push out the window, then that was not the proper meaning, which means, that was not what you were supposed to do. — Fooloso4
If I say" apple" but mean the orange coloured citrus fruit — Isaac
In this second example the failure to escape the plane is irrelevant to the meaning of the instructions. If the flight attendant had been consistently saying "pull", then the meaning of the word "pull" would remain completely unaffected by even the most fervent desire that you push. — Isaac
When I say something I mean something by what I say. Don't you?
— Fooloso4
I could do (depending on how you're using 'mean'), but that would not, cannot, be the 'proper' meaning. The meaning of a word is conferred by its use in the language game. If I say" apple" but mean the orange coloured citrus fruit, unless we are paying some game, the word I have said means the shiny fruit of the Malus sylvestris tree, what I meant by it has no bearing on the matter. It cannot do because otherwise language, as a means of communication, would cease to function. — Isaac
What is at issue is your claim:
Therefore, rules or grammar determine proper and improper meaning. — Fooloso4
The meaning of a word is found in its use. Rules or grammar determine proper and improper use. — Fooloso4
but in some cases it is predicated in part on intention. — Fooloso4
If I am the speaker and you take what I said in the wrong way then what you thought what I said meant was an improper meaning, it was not without meaning. — Fooloso4
If you are given safety instructions on how to exit the plane and you thought the instructions meant pull in the window rather than push out the window, then that was not the proper meaning, which means, that was not what you were supposed to do. — Fooloso4
but in some cases it is predicated in part on intention.
— Fooloso4
Not for Witty, it isn't. — StreetlightX
It throws light on our concept of meaning something. For in those cases things turn out otherwise than we had meant, foreseen. That is just what we say when, for example, a contradiction appears: "I didn't mean it like that." — PI
The mistake is not - never is - with 'meaning'. — StreetlightX
.. your inability to understand a meaning, and nothing about meaning — StreetlightX
When I do not understand you then what is the mistake with? — Fooloso4
How would you explain 125:
It throws light on our concept of meaning something. For in those cases things turn out otherwise than we had meant, foreseen. That is just what we say when, for example, a contradiction appears: "I didn't mean it like that." — PI
without intention? How do we make sense of not meaning it like that if there is no intended meaning? — Fooloso4
A mistake in and of comprehension. An inbility to understand something has to do with one's understanding - education, brain capacity - not 'meaning'. — StreetlightX
One comprehends the meaning mistakenly; not: one comprehends the 'improper meaning'. — StreetlightX
Mistake qualifies comprehension, not meaning. — StreetlightX
The fault is with 'us', not meaning. — StreetlightX
Meaning is not something that exists independent of us. If something means something it means something to us. Without 'us' there is no meaning. — Fooloso4
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