What do you guys think of this? — Enrique
If it is accurate that perception is modulated by a higher-dimensional quantum interfacing of electromagnetic fields and biochemical matter, perhaps one facet of a total revision in our picture of the physical world, qualia will be no less ineffable subjectively because language is a separate module from perception, but we can expect models in which a physical process isn't merely correlated with for instance the sight of a particular color, but actually is the sight of that color. — Enrique
But I don't think biochemistry alone is ever going to be more than correlated with for instance a qualitative mental image, its going to require a comprehension of quantum effects in both cells and the natural environment to model perception directly — Enrique
I am not sure what you think the role of quantum effects are going to be in modeling perception "directly." I mean, quantum fields aren't qualitatively different from, say, classical fields, nor is quantum mechanics that much more complex or information-dense than classical mechanics. There is no mystery stuff there, it's the same kind physics.
I agree with your intuition that the Qualia of Subjective Consciousness may be somehow related to the mystery of Quantum Entanglement. Unfortunately, we don't have a good theory for how entanglement works. So, for all practical purposes, it's magical. That's why some scientists and philosophers are offended by appeals to Quantum Magic.I'm conjecturing that the synthetic fluidity of perception can only be explained with quantum entanglement or some kind of quantum mechanism. — Enrique
Our study suggests objective reality doesn't exist
I suspect that the article's title was intentionally provocative. All they did was to come to the same conclusion that Schrodinger did in his Cat-in-the-Box thought experiment. When a particle is in a so-called "state of superposition", it only exists in a statistical sense as a probability. Actually, the "state" may tell us more about the Mind than the Matter.A minor detail, but I'm not a fan of the suggestion that reality is not objective, — Enrique
Like I touched upon, subatomic particles, ions, and small atoms have weird properties under many conditions — Enrique
I'm conjecturing that the synthetic fluidity of perception can only be explained with quantum entanglement or some kind of quantum mechanism. — Enrique
I imagine scientists finding instances of quantum behavior to be so pervasive that atomic theory will be completely transformed — Enrique
I'm conjecturing that the synthetic fluidity of perception can only be explained with quantum entanglement or some kind of quantum mechanism. If chemical reactions are the totality of mental processes, this lack of real integration would be mirrored by experience, but qualia in essence contrast with the time-lagged efficient causality of thermodynamic chemistry distributed in three-dimensional space. — Enrique
Are you aware of any mathematical models of entanglement that would yield geometric structures? It seems to me that the key characteristic of entanglement is lack of internal structure. By that I mean, when particles are in the wave-form state, they are no longer discrete parts, but somehow merge or blend into a whole system. I too, suspect that this transition from grainy particularism to fluid holism is a major factor in the emergence of Consciousness from Matter. But the current models are unable to describe what-is-going-on (mechanism) inside the "black box" of entanglement. :worry:All of this centers on deriving the best structural model of the math, and when it comes to that issue I'm the student. Basically scientists have to hypothesize possible structures as mechanisms by utilizing geometrical forms and then construct experiments that will verify or refute their hypotheses. — Enrique
Off topic. I just happened upon this post on Quora Forum, which claims to show a structural geometrical proof of God. It's an interesting concept, but he offers no argument to make the connection between the pretty torus/mandala pattern of Magnetism and divine design. Based on the poster's name, I'd guess that his god is Allah. :grin:All of this centers on deriving the best structural model of the math, and when it comes to that issue I'm the student. Basically scientists have to hypothesize possible structures as mechanisms by utilizing geometrical forms and then construct experiments that will verify or refute their hypotheses. — Enrique
I'm not exactly making a formal logical argument, I'm stating some weird facts about quantum mechanics and conjecturing that a theoretical accounting of these phenomena might revolutionize atomic theory. — Enrique
I will venture to claim that perceptual patchiness is probably an artifact of laboratory tinkering or lesions. — Enrique
Natural perception is at its core a fully integrated multiplicity, and in the context of biochemistry alone, what exists to be interpolated? All simultaneous synapsing of neurons consists of time-lagged relationships between cells, but perception is not time-lagged. — Enrique
Perception can be inaccurate, variable, and damaged, but it isn't fundamentally an illusion, its real. — Enrique
It probably depends on what human beings are willing to introspectively assert regarding their own minds. Qualitative experiences happen that contradict a thermodynamic interpretation of nature, and some of this has been empirically observed in systematic experiments, like synchronicity in the brainwaves of meditators, but we may find some major perceptual variability, so we have to carefully navigate around our susceptibility to prejudice when we model mental capacities. — Enrique
The mechanisms are mysterious — Enrique
Thinking about the relationship of human vision to qualia, it seems eyesight does involve patchiness from saccading that is partially organized neuronally pre-awareness, but this seems to be distinct structurally from what we would consider our synthetic qualitative experience. Research shows that the vast majority of neuronal activity is directed towards the senses rather than into the brain. The mind is not a passive representation of the environment, it independently generates qualia beyond the influence of a sensing that is in its basics peripheral and subsidiary to the forms of perceptual consciousness. — Enrique
When I said the mechanisms of quantum behavior are mysterious, I meant as they occur in natural environments, not research settings. — Enrique
What's the relationship of entanglement to coherence? — Enrique
What exactly are you referring to when you say "sensory processing" and "naïve interpretations of qualia"? — Enrique
The mechanisms are mysterious... — Enrique
Sophisticat is in complete denial of the reality of human ignorance. 'There's nothing unknown out there, we already know it all.'No, they are not. — SophistiCat
I mean that we cannot introspect much about the way our senses work just from the way they feel to us. They may feel like something immediate and intimately familiar, but in reality there is a lot of brain activity involved in producing that sensation, and that activity is itself is quite opaque to introspection. Being the subjects of perception doesn't give us all that much privileged knowledge about the nature of perception.
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.