Nice try at saying everything will be ok after all. — Punshhh
I would think that conditions not to dissimilar to what we have now would be the closest we could come to ok (or are you saying that this is also not ok?). Once large, or rapid global changes start to happen ( I'm not saying they will necessarily), we will, I expect, discover that the climactic conditions we have been used to for the last few thousand years were remarkably stable and settled and that they would rapidly become unstable and extreme, relatively.That's not what I was trying to say. I was saying something more along the lines of "for many of us there is no such thing as ok".
I would think that conditions not to dissimilar to what we have now would be the closest we could come to ok (or are you saying that this is also not ok?). — Punshhh
Once large, or rapid global changes start to happen ( I'm not saying they will necessarily), we will, I expect, discover that the climactic conditions we have been used to for the last few thousand years were remarkably stable and settled and that they would rapidly become unstable and extreme, relatively. — Punshhh
I was referring to general world climate as we have had for the last few hundred years. Anyway I was asking in the same paragraph what you meant by "for many of us there is no such thing as ok"?The climatic conditions change from day to day, season to season, year to year. What would you mean by "not too dissimilar to what we have now"?
You missed the word "relatively" ( at the end of my sentence) I think. My point was that the climate can become far more unstable and severe than what we experience now. I did say that I think, I don't think you have accepted it. Even the mini ice age was small beer.The last ice age ended about 10,000 years ago, and there was a "Little Ice Age" in medieval times, so I don't know where you get the idea that the climatic conditions have been "remarkably stable" for the last few thousand years.
How and when do we demand complete overhaul of entire corporations and infrastructures such as oil production, plastic production, and other unnecessary wasteful pollutants? — Lif3r
People aren't convinced and aren't educated to the data, and furthermore many who might be simply do not care. People mistrust decades of research because humans are shady and greedy bastards. And as a result well... here we are. — Lif3r
However, you do know, since much has been said of it, that a theory to count as scientific there must be a way to disprove it. — TheMadFool
There are 4 reasons why I think we will fail to avoid the worst consequences of global warming: — Bitter Crank
How: Through the overthrow of the existing economic structure by revolution, not necessarily violent, but certainly uncomfortable for those who own the means of production. — Bitter Crank
Whether they manage to take any knowledge with them, is the worry. Otherwise we may go back to square one again, and start all over again, as we have done before. — Punshhh
The problem is transportation. You can have electric cars, but aviation represents a problem.Beware, however: Abandoning fossil fuels will NOT be easy. There is no substitute for oil, in terms of molecules that are energy-rich and the basis of a vast amount of chemistry that composes the feedstock of many types of production. The world economy is organized dependence on fossil fuels. — Bitter Crank
There is evidence that capital has seen the light. Mark Carney the out going head of the Bank of England, soon to become the UN special envoy for climate change, spoke on the BBC a few days ago. That, in no uncertain terms, that investments and infrastructure developed for the exploitation of fossil fuels will become worthless in a few years and that capital should look to invest in investments and infrastructure designed to replace them with renewable sources of energy and the emerging green economy (my wording, but this is the jist of what he was saying). — Punshhh
I presume the planet experienced a hot house state before, which was liveable . Presumably it is the rapid transition to this state which you are suggesting is unliveable? In which case I agree, however I do expect a small colony of humanity to survive and rebuild. Whether they manage to take any knowledge with them, is the worry. Otherwise we may go back to square one again, and start all over again, as we have done before. — Punshhh
I agree that governance is going to be key, as things starts to get worse and government becomes less stable, many countries could fall into chaos as constitutions fail, resulting in no coordinated infrastructure change and civil unreast leading to mass starvation etc. — Punshhh
So reticence is going to be a big stumbling block and will surely result in a few years of dither and delay, even when it all becomes a no brainer. — Punshhh
I hadn't really been considering an unliveable hot house scenario, can you give any idea of how likely that would be, or what tipping point would precipitate it? — Punshhh
The difficulty seems to be that governments are dominated by capitalists — iolo
Is the euphemism 'processed' for 'burned' intentional? :) Because eventually all non-reusable and non-recyclable waste (such as small and soft plastics) will need to be burned since they cannot be reabsorbed by the ecosystem in any other form. Here in Denmark this residual waste is therefore also labelled as 'burnable' waste'. So that everyone is clear when they enter a supermarket, all the nice packaging they get is actually (carbon-based) fuel which will cause emissions at some later point. Which apparently didn't stop the trend that now if i want to buy 5 slices of cheese or 5 slices of ham, i get them in plastic packaging, which was not the case at the grocers 40 years ago. On another thought, I also think that landfills for 11 bn people x 150+ years will get really crowded at some point, whereas burning has the economic benefit of generating heat or electricity (of course with emissions).I think plastics can be stored in landfill and processed later, — Punshhh
I agree, this why it is important that we in the UK root out the endemic anti socialist ideology in the media and the people who take it as read that socialism is a disaster.The difficulty seems to be that governments are dominated by capitalists, and capitalism demands short-term profits NOW, at what ever cost.
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