you don't have a choice in anything, its determinism 101 — Augustusea
I've considered myself a pessimist now, and I'm 38 years old. To be honest, it leads me to being severely depressed & suicidal; there is not a single day now where I don't think of death, and even suicide personally. — niki wonoto
Although admittedly, my pessimistic outlook were perhaps mostly & originally also caused by what I've considered myself & my life to be a failure. — niki wonoto
Let me formulate this deductively,I chose my own breakfast. If your logic says no then it's not logic but dogma — Asif
do you learn anything new if your determined? Is a boxing match determined? — Asif
When folks get that blinded by their thinking that they cant identify their own will and choice then really I say you have been bewitched by false doctrine. — Asif
The examples you gave and the big bang response are just illogical. Tell me was it determined for you to get up this morning at the exact time you did? — Asif
I notice determinists cannot explain the simplest of everyday experiences. — Asif
point is, you don't choose your own breakfast,
that was pre determined by many factors before it and affecting it, — Augustusea
The choices we have for breakfast are limited to what we have available and is a result of other circumstances. When we went shopping, what we bought, what we can and cannot afford or otherwise can and cannot eat or simply prefer to eat. It's not impossible to have nearly anything for breakfast, after all circumstances can and some even say- when undesirable- are meant to be changed. — Outlander
So where does that leave us as far as determinism? Who knows, a friend can stop by with McDonald's or something on a whim and that ends up being your breakfast. Everything is determined by something. What I think that determinism doesn't properly include is that everything can change. The Earth could lose it's gravity one day. Some things (circumstances or "realities") are simply less likely to change than others. — Outlander
haven't even presented a counter argument or an argument for free will at least — Augustusea
Socratic method! Ah,the appeal to authority. If somebody says the sky is a pink elephant I dont have to refute him. Ditto your assertions are thus. — Asif
And you dont explain how you can choose to respond further or not. Just self refuting pedantic guff.
I suppose you cant raise your hand as a demonstration
or choose to blow out candles at your birthday either.
Ludicrous. — Asif
and you presented no argument for free will or against determinism — Augustusea
My argument is, that you don't make the choices you think you do make, you have an illusion of choice, of free will, but it actually is none existent for life,
you have the illusion of two roads you can take to school, and the illusion of choosing road A for example, but you in reality didn't choose, you were determined to for the reasons I explained above. — Augustusea
If I understand correctly, and agree with much of it, our circumstances in which we make choices or otherwise determine what choices can be made is largely if not entirely outside of our control? — Outlander
I get that. The average person has an average job and isn't a millionaire. He cannot go on crazy vacations more than a few times a year or splurge on things like second homes, boats, Rolex watches, etc. And- even if he does "randomly" win the lottery and all that changes, you'd insist on saying it really was not random and he was simply determined or dare I say "destined" to win the lottery. Right? — Outlander
I guess the question that needs to be asked is what would you say would need to happen/what circumstances would a reality have where there is your definition of free will and how does that compare to the one we live in now? — Outlander
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