Who demanded this? We haven't discussed this, you and me, so I'll repeat. I don't think it's binary. My example earlier is of someone running through a field, with holes and cow poop and tussocks of grass. That person must be, it seems to me, seeing the world as it is.....to a degree. Or they could not do that over and over. Sure, it's a perspective. We are time bound, localized creatures with limited senses. Senses that see the world, to some degree. And any evidence that we make mistakes or have filters will be based on observations that are trusted by the scientists, for example, as being accurate observations of the world as it is.Ah, but the demanded condition for being able to see the world as it is, is to be able to see it free from all perspectives; — Janus
Ah, but the demanded condition for being able to see the world as it is, is to be able to see it free from all perspectives; — Janus
Rubbish. One does not have to "see the world from all perspectives" to see that the cup is on the table. — Banno
But then it isn't saying much to say that we cannot see the world as it is if there is no world as it is. That would be like saying that we cannot see a colour that does not exist. — Janus
Jeez, you didn't even quote the end of the sentence. I cannot imagine a more openly evasive response.Then we cannot be perceiving it as it is! — Marchesk
Janus and Marchesk are playing at philosophy. It's a word game that they drop as soon a they stand up form their armchair and start doing the things. — Banno
Jeez, you didn't even quote the end of the sentence. I cannot imagine a more openly evasive response. — Coben
I am going to ignore you from here on out. — Coben
Who demanded this? We haven't discussed this, you and me, so I'll repeat. I don't think it's binary. — Coben
Janus and Marchesk are playing at philosophy. It's a word game that they drop as soon a they stand up from their armchair and start doing the things. — Banno
But then it isn't saying much to say that we cannot see the world as it is if there is no world as it is. That would be like saying that we cannot see a colour that does not exist. — Janus
I didn't write " see the world from all perspectives" I wrote " see the world free from all perspectives". — Janus
Janus and Marchesk are playing at philosophy. It's a word game that they drop as soon a they stand up from their armchair and start doing the things. — Banno
That person must be, it seems to me, seeing the world as it is.....to a degree. Or they could not do that over and over. Sure, it's a perspective. We are time bound, localized creatures with limited senses. Senses that see the world, to some degree. — Coben
Why don't you read what I write? — Janus
Irony never works out well on a forum. — Banno
Now I'll point out yet another issue with the idea... it's untenability.
In order to know that we cannot see the world as it is, we must know the world as it is, the world as we see it, and the differences between the two. — creativesoul
I conclude that nobody can see the world as it is.
— Daemon
That's not the interesting question though. The interesting question is, if no-one can see it, is there a world as it is? — Echarmion
Ah, but the demanded condition for being able to see the world as it is, is to be able to see it free from all perspectives; which would mean being able to make absolutely true, that is completely context independent, statements about it. The true statements we are able to make are all relative to various contexts, which just isn't good enough, dammit! :rofl: — Janus
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