Why are you making it about Biden in general — Saphsin

I'm not concentrating properly because I'm working at the moment and I just want to besmirch the CCP online

Apologies for leading the thread on a tangent, I’ve become enraged due to the recent anti-Asian shootings.

Like the other comments, I generally encourage Epictetus’ maxim quoted to temper your emotions regarding what you can’t control and focus what you can control. Stoicism takes learning and training however so I’m not sure it is helpful to quote these lines to your step-son, that would be insensitive. It’s better to break it down into a plausible message.

The Stoic teaching for instance does not imply you can’t have righteous indignation against injustice. The Stoic teaching is about shifting attention towards productive thoughts, it isn’t about deadening your emotions. One has to acknowledge that they were hurt by racism, and the best way to respond to it is to channel that into something else rather than remaining in continuous agony. It’s similar to what’s taught to alleviate anxiety in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. One can’t control the immediate fact others in the community have racist thoughts and are acting in a discriminatory way, but you can join in solidarity with anti-racist activists who are bringing the issue to public attention. I personally found out that sharing my pain among those who feel similarly prevents me from going insane. There's something about the nature of social interaction and empathy that helps lift the emotional burden a bit. And that this is a collective problem to be solved rather than individual circumstance to be endured.

Apologies for leading the thread on a tangent, I’ve become enraged due to the recent anti-Asian shootings. — Saphsin

I understand. :pray:

One can’t control the immediate fact others in the community have racist thoughts and are acting in a discriminatory way, but you can join in solidarity with anti-racist activists who are bringing the issue to public attention. — Saphsin

Yes! As most of us know, much racism and stupidity we hear comes to us in ways that we cannot directly respond to or fight - in media reporting, drive by abuse, ignorant slogans written against the wall, whatever. Hence the importance of finding ways to build resilience to hate and unpleasant discourse.

Apologies for leading the thread on a tangent, I’ve become enraged due to the recent anti-Asian shootings. — Saphsin

No problem. Racism is a super-charged issue and I used it only to give an example of how attached people can become to issues that arise in their lives. But whether it is racism, divorce, death, violence, or any significant loss, this is what we all must face in our lives. Understanding how to best confront these kinds of issues would be a better conversation for our nation to share than much of the divisiveness that is heard pretty much everywhere anymore.

I appreciate your comments, and others, as well.

Think about how much time we have all spent replaying the tragic scenes of our lives. And of course, the not so tragic ones, as well. Perhaps my favorite quote of all-time is Mark Twain's, "Some of the worst things in my life never happened." Do these ten words not say a great deal concerning the peril of living one's life in fear?

Being able to rapidly move-on in life is a precious gift and should be taught by those who are aware everywhere. Imagine the anguish that could be saved if most people could develop this capacity.

I think so too. Take care.

Being able to rapidly move-on in life is a precious gift and should be taught by those who are aware everywhere. Imagine the anguish that could be saved if most people could develop this capacity. — synthesis

Yes I think so too. As you said this practice should be taught to everyone because there are some persons who is difficult to them avoid painful situations they experience along their lives.

The Stoic teaching for instance does not imply you can’t have righteous indignation against injustice. The Stoic teaching is about shifting attention towards productive thoughts, it isn’t about deadening your emotions. — Saphsin

Quite right. Also, Stoicism encourages active participation in social/political matters--Roman Stoicism, in any case. That's why some Roman emperors, like Domitian, banished or executed Stoic philosophers and Senators who were Stoics and opposed imperial conduct.

A Soviet commissar entered the home of a geography teacher and said to him: "Starting today, your house belongs to me and you will serve me. Do you agree?" The teacher said nothing, but from that day on he prepared and served the food, washed the clothes, went shopping and did not say a single word. The years passed and the geography teacher still didn't speak. One day, the commissioner suffered a heart attack. The teacher wrapped it up, buried it, responded and said, "No."

I would like you to explicate those assumptions. Like I said:

"There are several assumptions in "putting things aside" and "moving on". If these assumptions aren't elucidated and if they aren't the right ones, "putting things aside" and "moving on" can do more harm.

For example, the assumption can be "I should just move on, let it go, because I am worthless". If this is one's assumption for "putting things aside" and "moving on", how is "putting things aside" and "moving on" helping one??"


It is my assumption that there is no need to specifically "put things aside" and "move on", but that "putting things aside" and "moving on" occur naturally as a side-effect of holding certain assumptions about oneself. Such as "Doing my work is my highest priority" or "Doing X is beneath my dignity".

Merely focusing on "putting things aside" and "moving on" can move one away from some problem, but not automatically toward a valued direction in life. While moving toward a valued direction in life takes care of everything else.
(It's similar to the difference between running from danger and running to safety.)

The user shall determine the suitability of the product for its intended use and assumes all risk and liability whatsoever in connection therewith.

So if it doesn’t suit your purpose, don’t use it.

*sigh*
Talk about consumer philosophy ... life as a matter of consumption ...

Merely focusing on "putting things aside" and "moving on" can move one away from some problem, but not automatically toward a valued direction in life. While moving toward a valued direction in life takes care of everything else.
(It's similar to the difference between running from danger and running to safety.) — baker

I think this is a good caveat. It reminds me of the book The subtle art of not giving a F. I think it says something about finding something worth giving an F about, and lesser things you will care about less.
Sounds true. I think the more unhappy people are, the more trivial things have the potential to bring them down.
If you know who you are and your worth, then what could an insult do. You have to be insecure or ignorant about yourself to be offended in the first place.
As Man's Search For Meaning says, when we have meaning we can tolerate suffering. I think it says one way to have meaning is find a goal or role that is meaningful to you.

Maybe one could say the most useful skill in life is the ability to discern the valuable and unvaluable. Or what would you say is the most useful skill?

I live in the Netherlands and have had to deal with a lot of racism and xenophobia from a young age one. One time it got so bad I got really scared and anxious. I learned to talk about it and looked up a video by Desmond Tutu on forgiveness. Also, my parents have helped me out a lot. We have to respect the natives and the natives have to respect us. It's a give and take.

Thank you for your response. One of the most important things about forgiveness is that when you forgive others, you forgive yourself, as well.

The other factor that I found helpful was the realization that 99.999...% of what people do is about themselves. Once you come to this understanding, you can assume responsibility for your own life and lose the victim mentality that has stunted the development of so many young people over the past couple of decades.

One of the most important things about forgiveness is that when you forgive others, you forgive yourself, as well. — synthesis

But is it really forgiveness, or is it superiority and contempt?

I find that often, when people say they have forgiven, what they actually did is that they found a way to feel superior to the other person or to despise them and feel good about it.

One of the most important things about forgiveness is that when you forgive others, you forgive yourself, as well. — synthesis

Yes, of course, ...

Forgive but do not forget, or you will be hurt again. Forgiving changes the perspectives. Forgetting loses the lesson. — Paulo Coelho

A mantra for survivors (instead of victims), though I've occasionally succumbed to Otto von Bismarck's barbed maxim: forget, but do not forgive! which is an indulgence I'm confident I've outgrown.

You're welcome. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to share

I guess that one way of looking at it.

Forgive but do not forget, or you will be hurt again. Forgiving changes the perspectives. Forgetting loses the lesson.
— Paulo Coelho
A mantra for survivors (instead of victims), though I've occasionally succumbed to Otto von Bismarck's barbed maxim: forget, but do not forgive! which is an indulgence I'm confident I've outgrown. — 180 Proof

I've always tried to keep in mind that you can never understand what motivates others, so forgiving them is about not carrying around anger and hated that will only create negativity with your own life. This is why forgiving others is actually forgiving yourself.

:up: