Left is to just simply deny any affiliation with the former Soviet Union whatsoever. — thewonder
Anyways, as it concerns ideals and utopia, I think that there's a great difference between sanctimony and whatever you want to call virtue or righteousness and attempting to create as ideal of a world as you can while you're here and believing that you have established the final project for all of humanity. — thewonder
Of course social democracy movements have not been historically any friends to the communists, yet otherwise you are right. But as social democrats have been a lot in power in the West, being a communist has it merits in academic and intellectual circles and they do use this denial.One thing I've noticed on the part of the Left is to just simply deny any affiliation with the former Soviet Union whatsoever — thewonder
Nordic countries? How?I, too, like the Nordic Model, but the Social Democrats just have to cope with the political legacy of a different totalitarian regime, being the Third Reich. — thewonder
And after the collapse there these people continued with their careers as if nothing happened. Now many of them can indeed criticize the past quite well. T — ssu
What I am suggesting is that there needs to be a "third camp". — thewonder
Nordic countries? How? — ssu
the German Social Democratic party betrayed the Communist Party of Germany during the Spartacist Uprising — thewonder
The leftists I have known in academia and publishing mainly renounced their support of Marxism and the Soviet project in 1956, when the Soviet tanks invaded Hungary. The rest of them were well and truly out of it by 1974, Solzhenitsyn's book taking out the last of the naive or (look the other way) apologists. Some of these former radicals of course became neocons, a whole different problem for the world. — Tom Storm
It was a spontaneous revolt that was crushed by the German military at the bequest of the SPD — thewonder
Personally, I may have even supported the Spartacists. — thewonder
Well, it's said that being communist was hip in the 20's while in the 30's it had already passed as the informed noticed what Stalin was doing in the Workers Paradise.The leftists I have known in academia and publishing mainly renounced their support of Marxism and the Soviet project in 1956, when the Soviet tanks invaded Hungary. The rest of them were well and truly out of it by 1974, Solzhenitsyn's book taking out the last of the naive or (look the other way) apologists. Some of these former radicals of course became neocons, a whole different problem for the world. — Tom Storm
So instead of having later just the Soviet Union and Red China we would have earlier a Soviet Germany and Soviet Russia? That likely would have just made WW2 happen far more earlier. Or for WW1 to continue well into the 1920's.Personally, I may have even supported the Spartacists. Surely council communism would've been preferable to the collapse of the Weimar Republic. — thewonder
Yet doesn't that fit perfectly post-modernism? Truth doesn't exist and it's all a power play!Agree. In life the interesting question regarding beliefs is who really believes what they say they believe and who is holding the belief for other reasons (posturing, peer group, fashion, controversy). — Tom Storm
If, however, you go to any left-wing forum, be it Anarchist, Socialist, or Communist, and ask, "I, myself am sympathetic to Social Democracy, but, in passing conversation, I was told that the SPD betrayed the KPD during the Spartacist Uprising and set in motion the course of events that would lead to the collapse of the Weimar Republic. Is this true?", — thewonder
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