What are you trying to prove or establish? — tim wood
Nothing. I posted a comment expressing my personal view after which I was attacked for doing so as seems to be standard procedure here. — Apollodorus
I believe that's a big element in atheism. Atheists are afraid of the thought of there being anything higher than themselves hence they hope there isn't. — Apollodorus
A little care in your language, then, will smooth your travels on TPF, and likely everywhere else. — tim wood
Actually, that's an interesting statement. I tend to believe that fear can work in both directions. Some people believe in God as a result of fear while others may deny God's existence out of fear that he might actually exist. — Apollodorus
Maybe some such disbelievers can be found? An odd kind of wishful thinking?
Doesn't seem all that likely, though, or at least uncommon. — jorndoe
it's ultimately a waste of everyone's time and effort. — tim wood
Maybe some such disbelievers can be found? An odd kind of wishful thinking?
Doesn't seem all that likely, though, or at least uncommon. — jorndoe
Most atheists I know wish there was a god, thinking he'd come down here and spank the shit out of all his dumb-ass followers who violate his tenants on a daily basis. — James Riley
Sure. And let's not forget all those atheist saints like Lenin, Stalin, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot and their millions of followers. — Apollodorus
Atheists are more likely to wish they were wrong than to hope they are right. — James Riley
I suspect most atheists just don't know. — Apollodorus
They certainly can't prove that there is no God . . — Apollodorus
I doubt many of them have even tried. — Apollodorus
Most people are really lazy when it comes to these matters. — Apollodorus
I thought that was an agnostic? — James Riley
Most atheists I know tried damn hard but logic and reason just wouldn't let them do it. Hell, many of them were raised deep in it, and were believers. — James Riley
No. The agnostic is an atheist who admits that he doesn't know. — Apollodorus
I suspect most atheists just don't know. — Apollodorus
I don't think Marx ever thought about it. Most likely he never believed. If you start from the unexamined premise that religion is "the opium of the people", then you don't think about it. It is like a religious belief that you accept on faith. — Apollodorus
In my experience, honest and thoughtful atheists tend to admit that, ultimately, they don't know. — Apollodorus
I'm beginning to see where Tim Wood is coming from. If we are to tie the specific to the general, then you end up conflating the disparate. Please don't be so fundamentally stupid as to run to Marx when discussing atheism generally. That's like me running to Hitler when discussing Christianity generally. — James Riley
And I'm beginning to see that you're getting angry for your own inability to convince anyone, perhaps not even yourself. — Apollodorus
I simply gave Marx as a well-known example of unthinking atheist. — Apollodorus
Hitler and Christianity is a totally different story. — Apollodorus
And yes, most atheists are agnostics who refuse to admit that they don't know. — Apollodorus
I don't believe you. I think you gave Marx because he's your boogey man and easy to paint. It's lazy. And to say he's "unthinking" demonstrates your dishonesty; either that or your ignorance. I'm no fan of Marx, but I'd never say he was unthinking. That would make me stupid. — James Riley
I never said "Marx was unthinking". I said "unthinking atheist", i.e. a person who was an atheist from the start, not as a result of thinking about it. — Apollodorus
That was precisely why I chose him as an example. — Apollodorus
You are confusing yourself. Or maybe you're just a bit tired. — Apollodorus
Do I hope that your terrible magic sky daddy doesn't exist? Obviously, but not actively or often, I so very rarely to never think about it. If you've actually read the bible, in its entirety, in as short a period of time as you can manage, you would be insane to wish for such an entity to have any basis in reality, unless of course, you were some sort of immoral masochistic sociopath. — Seditious
he was baptized, and grew up in a secular environment of philosophy which, I'm pretty sure, did not make him an unthinking atheist. I'd say the burden would be upon you to show that he was. But you've got nothing. — James Riley
It's the opinion of historians and scholars. — Apollodorus
He was born Jewish, the family changed to Christianity, he was baptized, and grew up in a secular environment of philosophy which, I'm pretty sure, did not make him an unthinking atheist. — James Riley
No logic there at all. You're constructing a narrative there from unrelated bits of information.
Young Germans at the time were often atheists because that was the new fashion in that period, not because they had analyzed religion and found it to be unscientific or whatever. — Apollodorus
didn't create a narrative. I just cited some Wiki crap about Marx's early years, showing you that he wasn't in some secular, unthinking vacuum — James Riley
You cited it from Wikipedia and in so doing you made it your narrative. What's the point in saying "he was born Jewish"? His father had already converted to Christianity before he was born. So, what? — Apollodorus
You have no idea what my religion is. You're making it all up. — Apollodorus
And why are you defending Marx? You must be either some sort of neo-Marxist or something along those lines. — Apollodorus
And anyway, Seditious has already admitted that he is an atheist who hopes that God doesn't exist. So, that already answers the question. — Apollodorus
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