Adults know certain things instinctively. Philosophy is about debating higher opaque questions that people have long pondered about

i dont identify as a human

im god

call me god from now on — MikeListeral

This is a false equivalence. One cannot identify as God, because God is a defined term that does not exist on a spectrum. God is the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being. You are neither of these things, and it can be proven that you are neither of these things, because it is a fixed, set definition, Gender is know to exist on a spectrum, or even a plane, this means that there are many different gender stances and identities that could be taken.

What if I sleep with a 14 year old and tell the police "my ID says I'm 35 but I identity as a 14 year old so I did nothing wrong". People need to contemplate where their ideas lead to — Gregory

Again this is a false equivalence, age is deterministic, and is based solely on your date of birth. Age is not a social construct, it is factual and provable. Gender is a social construct.

Just because there are different ways the male and female form can be does not mean that there is not truly two forms and it certainly doesn't there are more then two gender identities

Adults know certain things instinctively. Philosophy is about debating higher opaque questions that people have long pondered about — Gregory

This is fundamentally not true. Adults do not know certain things instinctively, and age does not define how much someone knows.

For example, in 5 months time i shall turn 18 and become an adult. Does this mean that when I turn 18 I shall suddenly rejected everything that I've said in this thread? No!

Finally, I have to stress this again, age does not mean that someone can't hold an opinion, belief, or opinion that is correct. Adulthood does not imply an all-knowing understanding of the world, or philosophy wouldn't exist.

How do you know what adults know?

Just because there are different ways the male and female form can be does not mean that there is not truly two forms and it certainly doesn't there are more then two gender identities — Gregory

Where is your argument for this conclusion. This is circular reasoning.

• I believe there are only two genders
• This is because I believe there are only two genders
  
  
  Your argument doesn't prove anything, and isn't actually relevant to the original questions.

If they draft you will you go with the men or women battalions?

Where does personal identity end and imposition on others begin?

How do you know what adults know? — Gregory

I do not. But I do know that Adults are not all knowing (unless this entire website is a sham meant to deceive me until I reach adulthood), And I do know that no one possesses intelligence simply due to reaching a certain age- Ideas should be debated on due to their merit as an idea, not as the age of their creators.

If I was a 70 year old person, would you still say that my arguments are flawed due to my age? What if I was 40? 18? I'm 18 in 5 months, do my views suddenly become reasonable?

Where does personal identity end and imposition on others begin? — Lil

I believe that using the correct pronouns is not an imposition but a social norm, or at least when referring to all other members of society.

Usually there's a reason someone says one pronoun or another. Usually that's based on certain aesthetics.

It's usually fairly automatic for a person to decide what pronoun to use.
Is it an imposition to correct someone who would rather not comply?

What about with an identity like Orthodoxy, asking women to cover themselves, sometimes head to toe?

Some people think one is a more fair ask than the other. Usually for moral reasons.
If they're operating under entirely different moral frameworks, are they even perceiving the same reality? Do the aesthetics of gender overlap? Or do they contradict reality?

Is it an imposition to correct someone who would rather not comply? — Lil

I think in an instance when someone chooses not to comply it's more likely that any reasonable discourse between the two figures would break down. This argument could also be extended to someone who is racist, or sexist though.

Usually there's a reason someone says one pronoun or another. Usually that's based on certain aesthetics. — Lil

I would say that the willingness to use a certain term after being corrected would then make this fine. It's easy to make a mistake of fact. as long as the mistake is corrected when informed of their incorrect usage.

or how about i call you whatever the heck i want to call you

because its a free country

if you dont like it you can go cry in the corner — MikeListeral

Yeah, you can go around offending people if you want. In my experience the gender variant crowd isn't usually the most physically intimidating. Maybe, run by the old folks home afterward and slap pudding out of the hands of the elderly. Or upon learning of a deep seated character flaw it would be advisable not to act on it. It makes it harder for your primate brain to reverse course in the future. But, I imagine corrective action in this case is like pouring perfume in a sewer grate. Make my day and tell me you aren't from the US.

Misgendering is cruel — K Turner

Sorry, late boomer here. Why is it such a big offence to call a he a she, or a them a he? Like, you guys think she are bad?

Sorry, late boomer here. Why is it such a big offence to call a he a she, or a them a he? Like, you guys think she are bad? — Olivier5

For someone with gender dysphoria the mismatch between their biological sex and their gender identity is a cause of distress for them, which coupled with the discrimination they often face makes for the way others think and talk about their gender a matter of significance for them.

For many people, gender labels form the basis of their artificial identity.

Rejecting those labels can be like opening Pandora's box, where the individual is confronted with the fact they have not (yet) developed a real identity.

Inner turmoil and insecurity predictably ensue, and the subsequent obsession with new genders and gender labels is the confused individual trying to claw their way back into the comfort of the land of masks and artificial identities.

To put the genie back into the bottle, the individual must reinstate a new artificial identity; an act of self-deceit for which they require all of society's affirmation (just like the artificial identities of traditional gender labels).

So how is it done? They wear a T-shirt saying "I Am They"?

They tell you, just like they tell you their name. The post you were responding to was responding to the OP saying "the issue comes from when Person B is consistently informed of the correct pronouns and continues making the same error."

If you keep telling me that your name is Olivier and I keep calling you Oliver or Amy then it won't surprise me if you get annoyed by it.

If you keep telling me that your name is Olivier and I keep calling you Oliver or Amy then it won't surprise me if you get annoyed by it. — Michael

Story of my life.

What I think is a problem with some of this thread is that it is ignoring the position of the person who created the thread discussion speaking about their own dysphoria. Also, in the 'about' section the person is saying that they are 17 years old, and if this is true, then it may be an extremely difficult time. Of course, this is a philosophy forum and not a psychology self-help resource, but at the same time, I think that some sensitivity is important here and I am just hoping that Bradaction has not set him/herself up to receive a garbage can of opinions about transgender issues.

In late-boomer-speak, it's bad manners. I'm called Cuthbert. You can call me Georgie-porgie if you like but it's not respectful.

Thanks @Cuthbert and @Michael for the good manner update.

Georgie-porgie — Cuthbert

Trying to resist the urge of using this one...

They tell you, just like they tell you their name. The post you were responding to was responding to the OP saying "the issue comes from when Person B is consistently informed of the correct pronouns and continues making the same error."

If you keep telling me that your name is Olivier and I keep calling you Oliver or Amy then it won't surprise me if you get annoyed by it. — Michael

Again, comparing this to proper names is comparing apples to oranges. Its more like you're white but tell people you're black and you get annoyed that they keep calling you white.

As someone who identifies as non-binary, and understands that Gender is separate to Sex, — Bradaction

If gender and sex are different things then how do you know if others are referring to your sex or gender when using pronouns?

Maybe, run by the old folks home afterward and slap pudding out of the hands of the elderly. — Cheshire

Upvote for the image.

For someone with gender dysphoria the mismatch between their biological sex and their gender identity is a cause of distress for them, which coupled with the discrimination they often face makes for the way others think and talk about their gender a matter of significance for them. — Michael

I mean this as a serious question. Would a genderqueer person be diagnosed with gender dysphoria? It seems to me they wouldn't.

Actually it's closer to proper names considering they often carry an implied gender. You might be right , but not for this reason.

If gender and sex are different things then how do you know if others are referring to your sex or gender when using pronouns? — Harry Hindu

Context. If you are trying to stack people neatly then it's sex.

Thanks, I figured if I was going to tease an ad hominem; it better be funny.