On the one hand how we would treat a Christian who believes literally in the claim that God eternally punishes with torture and worships the figure and on the other how we would treat just as sincere a believer in a mundane tormenter. — fdrake
But you hold to humanism with your gut feeling, don't you?
Or do you feel an overwhelming certainty that humanism is the right doctrine, for which you are willing to live, die, and kill? — baker
Early Christian church fathers didn't take the Bible literally. Fundamentalism came later. — frank
In that day true and full happiness shall be the lot of none but the good, while deserved and supreme misery shall be the portion of the wicked, and of them only. — The City of God by Augustine (354-430)
Wherefore in order that the happiness of the saints may be more delightful to them and that they may render more copious thanks to God for it, they are allowed to see perfectly the sufferings of the damned. — Summa Theologica by Aquinas (1225-1274)
Wherefore as the saints will rejoice in all goods, so will the damned grieve for all goods. — Summa Theologica by Aquinas (1225-1274)
To know a person's moral character, we look at that person's ACTIONS. — frank
doxastic involuntarist — Srap Tasmaner
Decision-making is involved. If someone expresses assent to neverending damnation, then we may express repugnance. — jorndoe
Why do you say that? — jorndoe
Anyway, it's fairly clear that people have believed (and some do believe) neverending damnation. — jorndoe
I cordially invite the thread to up its game. — fdrake
It seems more than a little like special pleading to say that Christians have some incommensurable world-view which makes sense of these contradictions when, in everyday life, we know full well that we personally juggle a half dozen contradictory feelings and urges every day. Why would we assume the Christians have somehow got it all beautifully stitched together when we can't even make a consistent choice between the ease of driving to the shop and the harm of additional greenhouse emissions? — Isaac
There could be dissonance involved. — jorndoe
Amongst Fritz's actions is his expressed admiration of Hitler's evil deeds. He runs a regular podcast in which he sets Hitler's evil out in admiring detail, relishing the consequences.
What do you think of Fritz? — Banno
Sure. So we agree that like Nazis, Christians must be judged by their actions. :up: — frank
Judging people by their beliefs alone is dubious. Their actions tell you what they believe. — frank
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