Personally, I have no particular interest in demonstrating Greek influence on Jesus beyond language, as I believe that different cultures have sufficient elements in common as to not necessitate external influence in all cases. — Apollodorus
So it's an attempt to arianize Jesus. To un-Jew him. — Olivier5
As self-evident as the fact that Jesus the man was of his time and place, an individual not a universal. — Olivier5
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God … And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth … Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever ..." (John 1:1,14; Hebrews 13:8).
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life (John 3:16).
The angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be holy; he will be called Son of God (Luke1:35).
Now the birth of Jesus the Messiah took place in this way. When his mother Mary had been engaged to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found to be with child from the Holy Spirit (Matthew 1:18).
“Nathaniel answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God” (John 1:49).
I believe in God, the father almighty, creator of heaven and earth, and in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.
Jesus had the external appearance of a human, but in reality he was the Son of God manifested by the power of the Holy Spirit. — Apollodorus
There are some here, perhaps most, who prefer historiography to a mythologized history designed to support certain assumptions that have more to do with Christian dogma and Neo-Platonism than historical evidence. As with the Christian apologists, history is distorted or ignored and rational argument buried under misdirection and misrepresentation in favor of some version of transcendental truths they imagine they know something about. — Fooloso4
In any case, it is clear from the NT text that, in Christianity, Jesus had the external appearance of a human, but in reality he was the Son of God manifested by the power of the Holy Spirit. — Apollodorus
So it's an attempt to arianize Jesus. To un-Jew him. — Olivier5
If you believe in it, I suppose. — Olivier5
In any case, it’s good to see that Foolo has opted for possibility (1) — Apollodorus
To my knowledge, most scholars who have studied the subject matter agree that there are three basic theoretical possibilities: — Apollodorus
the view directly challenges Augustine placing the revelation of the 'Israelites' above the fruits of Athens. — Paine
If you affirm (1) then why all the effort to argue influence? If you affirm (2) then why the smokescreen of (1)? — Fooloso4
So Jesus was NOT influenced by Hellenistic thought, the Son of God don't need no human influence! — Fooloso4
Several biblical scholars, my two favorite being John Dominic Crossan and Burton Mack, suggest that Jesus was influenced by Hellenistic thought. They specifically argue that he was a Jewish sage — Dermot Griffin
. It was YOU who affirmed (1): — Apollodorus
I never affirmed absolutely nothing ... I was arguing (2) ... — Apollodorus
... the text is very clear and states the facts in unambiguous terms — Apollodorus
I was arguing (2) i.e., influence, solely on ... — Apollodorus
(3). Jesus never existed, in which case the question of his connection with Platonism does not arise, and all discussion of the subject is rendered superfluous. — Apollodorus
You claim that what you quote are the facts — Fooloso4
The "facts" according to the text, Einstein! — Apollodorus
Paul was the academic mostly responsible for Greek Philosophy influencing Christianity at its very beginning. — Joe Mello
You need to read the texts more closely. Saul was a cop hunting down Christians for committing heresy according to his form of Jewish Law. He changed teams on the way to Damascus to punish Christians there. He didn't get a Master's degree before he assumed the role of Paul the Apostle. — Paine
That is simply not true. Targumin existed for a reason, and they were not sacrilegious. Or not too much, not anymore than the Septuagint... — Olivier5
Jesus read the Tanak in Aramaic. Like everybody at the time. — Olivier5
These texts are almost exclusively in Biblical Hebrew, with a few passages in Biblical Aramaic (in the books of Daniel and Ezra, the verse Jeremiah 10:11,[2] and some single words).
That is radically different from the talk of one cosmic order being replaced by a new one in the immediate future. Plotinus railed against those who said the cosmos needed to be saved from the evil that ruled it. He directed this rebuke toward the Gnostics: Paul could have taken their place in the penalty box. — Paine
For men, deprived of the care of the deity who had possessed and tended us, since most of the beasts who were by nature unfriendly had grown fierce, and they themselves were feeble and unprotected, were ravaged by the beasts [274c] and were in the first ages still without resources or skill; the food which had formerly offered itself freely had failed them, and they did not yet know how to provide for themselves, because no necessity had hitherto compelled them. On all these accounts they were in great straits; and that is the reason why the gifts of the gods that are told of in the old traditions were given us with the needful information and instruction,—fire by Prometheus, the arts by Hephaestus and the goddess who is his fellow-artisan, seeds and plants by other deities.1 [274d] And from these has arisen all that constitutes human life, since, as I said a moment ago, the care of the gods had failed men and they had to direct their own lives and take care of themselves, like the whole universe, which we imitate and follow through all time, being born and living now in our present manner and in that other epoch in the other manner. — Plato, Statesman, 274b, translated by Fowler
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