How do I know if something is true? I'm looking at, it's right there. How do we know the sun is really there? Because it is self-evidently emergent in the universe. — Garrett Travers
Is it rational to have compassion for mass murderers? — Garrett Travers
Okay. So there's more room for compassion in your view than I originally thought.
Mental illness rates among the impoverished are about twice that of the rest of us. — ZzzoneiroCosm
This is the same as the Hitler example.
If the mass murderer has a mental illness, it's rational to feel compassion for him.
Seeing the wild, deranged, shell-shocked eyes in the courtroom of that nutso Joker dude who shot up the Batman crowd in Colorado - my emotional systems responded with profound compassion.
Obviously, we have to hold mass murderers accountable for their evil deeds. But provision of inpatient mental health services seems far more rational to me than locking them up and throwing away the key. — ZzzoneiroCosm
The only problem I have with this is that I have no way of knowing if I’m really looking at something that actually exists because I could be hallucinating or dreaming etc. I know we already discussed this and I don’t want to beat a dead horse. Plus this is a discussion devoted to an entirely different purpose and I don’t want to ignore that. — Average
You have no reason to suggest you aren't seeing it. What would constitute evidence of you having hallucinated something? — Garrett Travers
Good question. I need to think about it. — Average
Let's not be silly. — Garrett Travers
your question makes me remember a logical fallacy. I think it might be a form of argumentum ad ignorantiam. Keep in mind that I’m not saying I am hallucinating just that I don’t know if I am or not. — Average
Not sure what's ringing silly to you but I'm certain nothing silly has been said. — ZzzoneiroCosm
It also does not allow for the possibility that the answer is unknowable, only knowable in the future, or neither completely true nor completely false. — Garrett Travers
all I know is that you said “ You have no reason to suggest you aren't seeing it.” which seemed fishy but now you’ve got me curious. What is the element to the fallacy that makes this not an argument from ignorance? — Average
It's not a an argument from ignorance, because I have no burden of proof. I simply suggested to ask yourself what the evidence suggests, and to test the quality between the different types of evidence. — Garrett Travers
I agree that you don’t have any burden of proof but what kind of test do you have in mind? I can’t think of anyway to test for this kind of phenomenon. — Average
If they are the source of morality, then they are inviolable. — Garrett Travers
If a person is a mass murder, then it is irrational to have compassion for him/her. — Garrett Travers
If a person is a mass murderer [and is not a person with mental illness] then it is irrational to have compassion for him/her.
You've already conceded that it's rational to have compassion for a person with mental illness. — ZzzoneiroCosm
I'm not a logician but it looks valid to me. — ZzzoneiroCosm
So, I can literally use one or the other to negate one or the other. Make sense? — Garrett Travers
Seems to make sense. Have to see how it plays out. — ZzzoneiroCosm
If murder and mental illness are both factors in applying compassion... — Garrett Travers
if consistent, then relativism is relative; if inconsistent, then relativism refutes itself) — 180 Proof
All that makes sense logically. But I don't agree that murder is a factor when applying compassion. To my view, all human beings, even all creatures, are deserving of compassion. — ZzzoneiroCosm
A person with moral guilt would be just as deserving of compassion as a person without moral guilt if there were such a creature. Happily, no person without moral guilt exists so Rand's argument is easy to reject. Rand's view above strikes me as cold-hearted. — ZzzoneiroCosm
For a taste of the obverse view, I'd suggest Viktor Frankl's Man's Search for Meaning. Frankl was a neurologist and psychiatrist who spent time in the Nazi camps. His book is considered a masterpiece of psychology, translated into 24 languages. — ZzzoneiroCosm
Right, which as we established, is irrational. — Garrett Travers
I don't remember establishing that. Where was it established? — ZzzoneiroCosm
If multiple factors for applying compassion exist, then a selective application of compassion is required.
Multiple factors for applying compassion exist.
Therefore, a selective application of compassion is required. — Garrett Travers
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