The point is that idealism is unnecessary. It adds nothing to understanding — Real Gone Cat
Except that without ideas our attempts to understand will be in vain. — EugeneW
I have to agree with him here. Idealism is saying "things are what they appear to be." — Count Timothy von Icarus
To be sure, our intuition about how things are is often wrong (optical illusions, the discovery of microbes)... — Count Timothy von Icarus
Physicalism is saying, "no, actually what you experience isn't the real deal. You essentially hallucinate a world..." — Count Timothy von Icarus
Physicalism is saying, "no, actually what you experience isn't the real deal. You essentially hallucinate a world. The real stuff is the abstract model of the world we use to understand and predict observations. Yes this abstraction is only accessible as a component of thought, but it is actually ontologically basic." — Count Timothy von Icarus
Physicalism is saying, "no, actually what you experience isn't the real deal. You essentially hallucinate a world..."
— Count Timothy von Icarus
Really? Who says we hallucinate a world? — Real Gone Cat
Donald Hoffman too. It's kind of a mainstream cognitive science view now. — Count Timothy von Icarus
So when you attack the credibility of observation, you're also attacking the credibility of arguments for physicalism and science as a whole. — Count Timothy von Icarus
Umm, your missing the point. Either the transcendent exists or it doesn't. — Real Gone Cat
By definition, the transcendent is unknowable — Real Gone Cat
Andy Clark, for one: — Joshs
Donald Hoffman too. — Count Timothy von Icarus
Both make their bones by positing novel wild claims. — Real Gone Cat
But what is the transcendence? — EugeneW
transcendent
adjective
beyond or above the range of normal or merely physical human experience.
"the search for a transcendent level of knowledge"
surpassing the ordinary; exceptional.
"the conductor was described as a “transcendent genius.”"
(of God) existing apart from and not subject to the limitations of the material universe.
transcendent
1a. exceeding usual limits : surpassing.
b. extending or lying beyond the limits of ordinary experience.
c. in Kantian philosophy : being beyond the limits of all possible experience and knowledge.
What is beyond experience is unknowable — Real Gone Cat
These aren’t wild claims. It’s just good old fashioned neo-Kantianism. — Joshs
If you doubt the transcendent, then all is what's in your mind. — Real Gone Cat
As a physicalist, I do happen to believe that appearances do reveal the approximate nature of things-as-they-are, but that's my peccadillo — Real Gone Cat
Don't be silly. The point is that idealism is unnecessary. It adds nothing to understanding. Does it render science moot? Count Tim doesn't think so. — Real Gone Cat
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