It's strange, mr. Universe. I have seen Carl Sagan pop up many times this week. I heard him mentioned in "The Big Bang Theory", in a breakfast show last week, in another program, and just saw him again! Weird!

It's strange, mr. Universe. I have seen Carl Sagan pop up many times this week. I heard him mentioned in "The Big Bang Theory", in a breakfast show last week, in another program, and just saw him again! Weird! — Haglund

:lol: What can I respond with that does not invoke the supernatural?
I can only hope that the coincidences you kindly mention and your own personal knowledge of the great man are coming to the front of your own consciousness.
The reason and rationality you employ in your scientific endeavours are manifesting as little gnaws at your psyche, due to coincidental 'pop up's of Carl Sagan's name.
Imho, your 'reason' is suggesting you pay more attention to Carl's viewpoints on the human condition and your own knowledge of him is encouraging you to realise that you don't need your fictitious gods which you yourself state, do not even exist in the same Universe as you do. You have a good analytical mind and you insult it with woo woo from your Freudian ID.

I apologise for using this 'door of opportunity,' you kindly opened to make this appeal to you.
You can always claim that it is your reason, rationality and analytical skill that results in your god conclusions but if that's true then I would personally consider you one of the lost people.
I am sure you see me in a similar way in that case. The Universe continues regardless. I guess it's up to others to add to the numbers we identify with or choose yet another of the many alternate paths available.

On Saturday, I meet up again with a group of around 9 friends. Four of whom are religious education teachers with different theistic personal beliefs but we have more in common regarding what's important in life than we have differences in our atheist/theist/theosophist positions.
Sometimes our disagreements can be heated but we remain friends and we have given each other food for thought on occasion. I would honestly say I have given them more cause to question their personal theism than they have ever given me cause to question my atheism but I doubt they would agree with me.

Btw, All 9 of them would 'round on you,' if you said you found 16-year-old female children physically desirable. You would not be invited back.

Nice try, but still, without the gods would be meaningless for me. All interesting things in live, like physics (which is nothing but investigating the matter they created), art (painting, photography, the labor with the treetrunks, writing, math, etc.), woman (eventhough I have one big love), sports, every form of culture, etc., yes, life itself, would be without meaning or reason. I know the gods because I know the world we live in, and the creatures in it. Even an anarchist can be religious! I think Sagan being talked about here makes you see more, indeed.

Concerning sweet sixteen, when still in town, I lived next to a girl school. Girls between 13 and 18, maybe. Some real cute ones between them. One of them wrote her name on the front door to make an appointment. It was obvious what she wanted... I invited her up and we had a nice time, without actually doing the deed. I couldn't imagine doing as I was grown up and she wasn't. But I liked her beauty! I know what Krauss would have done... (will he find out I write this, when about 20 people, in the whole world, are logged in on this forum). So why would they throw me out of the group? What's wrong with liking the beauty of a sweet sixteen?

You are digging your own pit.

Because I like beauty? Don't you like female beauty? :starstruck:

Yes, I think that will be possible in the future. If the neural link is generally introduced, people will start to think differently and in the long run they will become smarter. People will be able to know and remember many more things. People will think it a shame to still die. People will put in much more effort to live longer because otherwise that data will always be lost. The easiest way to live longer and thus preserve our memories and data for society is to connect our brains to the internet and thus obtain digital eternal life.

At the moment people can't even imagine that because at the moment we are still a very primitive being compared to when the neural link is built in. One day it will be the most natural thing in the world that people will no longer die and that everything and everyone is connected. I think this will be the case in a decade or two.

I think this will be the case in a decade or two. — Vincent

I agree with you in principle but I think your time frame is off by many thousands of years.
What current 'neural link,' tech are you suggesting will be able to directly connect a human brain and a computer system within the next 10 or 20 years?

Of course I'm not sure. But that certainly won't last for thousands of years. Elon Musk's Neuralink wants to start testing on humans this year. In the first phase, this will neutralize psychological illnesses. But if the starlink internet is expanded and this neurallink is connected to 5G internet, everything we know and think will be stored in the cloud. We will start communicating with each other simply by thinking. These technologies already exist today, but further development is held back by the way of life and the system of many religions. If this is further developed and everyone gets a neural link built in, then digital eternal life will be a fact.

Yeah. I am rarely a fan of important technology pursued and controlled by billionaires.
Musk has made a lot of claims about neuralink that have little evidence to back them up.
The system was rated quite low in an MIT technology review report.
Professor Andrew Jackson, professor of neural interfaces at Newcastle University, commented that he didn't "think there was anything revolutionary in Neuralink's pig implant presentation" but that the wireless features were "nice".

The monkey playing 'pong' demonstration was claimed to have been achieved 20 years ago in 2002.
The only difference was neuralink is a wireless interface.
Musk loves publicity stunts. I think he has sunk about 200 million into neuralink, which is pennies for him if you compare it with the $44 billion he just paid for twitter.
He initially employed 10 neuroscientists on the project and 8 have since left.
Don't get me wrong, I wish and hope I am wrong and the linking of a human brain to an artificial neural net, which allows a 'meaningful, useful and direct,' human computer interface/interaction between the two, is a lot closer in time than I currently think it is. But I see little evidence based on any current system or projected system for the next 20 years. I still think the first human to live thousands of years is technically, thousands of years away.

You might find this site interesting:
https://transhumanity.net/becoming-the-first-transhuman-a-call-for-the-right-stuff/?msclkid=12a4cb63c64e11ec95a8555796f6ce24

I am most impressed by the projections for nanobot tech over the next few decades. I think this may well provide real life extension possibilities and it is why I take seriously a New Scientist article I read a few months ago which stated that current evidence suggests that the first human to live to an age of somewhere between 135 and 180, is alive today.

I will check and study the site tomorrow. I also don't have much faith in elon musk because he has too many connections with the WEF. But the WEF's great reset would be announced worldwide this summer. That is, a new industrial revolution will begin. This industrial revolution will begin to merge humans with technology. So Transhuman will start this or next year. Humanity will of course not agree with that and a world war will therefore result.
The study by Ingo Piepers has proven using mathematical formulas that WW3 and the sixth mass extinction will start at the latest in 2022 and will last 16 years. This is in line with the plans of the WEF. Climate scientists also predict that a climate catastrophe will soon occur.
Why I think eternal life is near is because the third world war and a mass extinction has also been predicted by all religions on earth. They also predict that anyone who survives WW3 will never die or get sick. So when WW3 starts this year, we also know that God exists and that the prophecies in the bible will probably also come true.
That could be true, because most progress is made during a war. And if WW3 and a climate collapse happen at the same time, the advancement of technology will be so immense that eternal life is the only way to survive. Certain nanotechnologies will probably allow us to extend our life expectancy to 180 years. But in those 180 years that we will live, we will start to think differently and we will most likely be able to extend our lives again.
This is of course all just speculation. There is no proof whatsoever that I am right. But if you follow the news a little bit, then you know that WW3 and a climate collapse could happen soon. And if that happens, it means that technology progress will have to take an immense leap to ensure the future of humanity.

Sounds great! I hope we will prevail and enter the era after.

:100: :party: "Pissin' the night away ..."

The study by Ingo Piepers has proven using mathematical formulas that WW3 and the sixth mass extinction will start at the latest in 2022 and will last 16 years — Vincent

Interesting! Do you know Pieper's mathematical approach?

What do you mean with approach? You can find this findings on his account on twitter. I don't understand much of it myself. But since the events of the last two years, that has made me think. If he's right and it will be this year, then he's made the greatest discovery ever

What do you mean with approach? You can find this findings on his account on twitter. I don't understand much of it myself. But since the events of the last two years, that has made me think. If he's right and it will be this year, then he's made the greatest discovery ever

If he's right and it will be this year, then he's made the greatest discovery ever — Vincent

You can say that! Let's hope the nukes are dropped!

He didn't just predict WW3 either. But also a WW4, WW5, etc. But if I'm right, then WW3 will be the last armed conflict. Every world war has the goal and the outcome that there is more unification in the world. I think after WW3 there will only be one country left and it will rule the world. And WW4 everyone will be connected by internet.

Just imagine! To live forever in the network! Peacefully flying into ever greater realms of knowledge...

There is no program to be found in the brain. Neither in nature. — Haglund

And not for the lack of trying. Some things aren't programmable. Dualism got it right The brain you can copy as it is physical. But the mind cannot be captured in a module or whatever medium it is you're thinking of.

nicely said. All progress starts with imagination

There are two components to a, any, mind:

1. The way a mind thinks (thinking style). Reminds me of Kung Fu and the numerous fighting styles in it.

2. What a mind thinks about (mental content).

Thinking style can be learned, passed on from one mind to another. Mental contents too can be.

So, yeah, minds can be uploaded onto other minds and hence onto computers.

nicely said. All progress starts with imagination — Vincent

Thanks! Thanks to the incredible speed of progress in the computing sciences and miniaturization to the atomic level, we shouldn't be surprised that in our lifetime immortality might be finally reached! I envision a salvation army of nano-bots injected in our bloodstream, every single one of them entering our cells, making adjustments to our telomeres, so they won't shorten each time a cell divides, immunizìsing the body against aging. A youth vaccine! Once immortality is reached, we can replace brain structures that are no longer needed, like the emotative areas involved in procreation, male/female distinctive structures, and other distracting functions that undermine the knowledge gathering in our scientific quest. Useless functions like involved in the arts, people judgment and discrimination can be replaced by cognitive implants (or internal atomic memory, though our linkage to the net can provide us with a massive amount of data, which grows daily by the contribution of other immortals, who can simply upload results to the net in the blink of an eye. Eyes that can be modulated, like other sensory equipment, to be able, in combination with the new cognitive implants, access domains of reality currently inaccessible to our limited machinery. We might see new colors, hear unheard things, maybe even experience infinity and omnipresence! The journey only has started!

indeed. I'm glad I found this forum. At least you think about the future. Most people think that we already know everything and can do everything. That is not true. Real life has yet to begin. And that only starts when we start merging with the technologies. The future looks fantastic. But first we are going to face a very difficult time. WW3 will be an apocalyptic war and only those who survive will be able to benefit from eternal life.
I've done a little research on it and I think the great war will start in October. It's going to look like we're going to die out. But that's not true. I think early next year the antichrist will be revealed and he will convince humanity to accept these technologies. I could of course be wrong about the time. But one thing is certain. Very strange things are going to happen in the coming years.
The WEF also wants to build these technologies into the people, but I think their goal is wrong. They want to make humanity their personal slaves.
I wrote a long blog about it. If you like to read, I invite you to study it.

Your poor attempt at mockery of transhumanism is obvious and transparent.
Are you a theist?


Your musings are a bit too esoteric and irrational for me.
Perhaps you are simply a theist who is slightly mad.
I would normally just ignore postings such as yours and Hillary but you are spoiling what was a fairly interesting thread

Your poor attempt at mockery of transhumanism is obvious and transparent.
Are you a theist? — universeness

Where do you read I'm a theist? I didn't mention God once. Don't you agree the future has huge potential? Don't you write about nano-bots? The can be programmed to enter our cells savely and make adjustments! The future looks bright! I don't hope a WW3 happens, but we'll live!

So, yeah, minds can be uploaded onto other minds and hence onto computers — Agent Smith

Do you think that future life extension and more protection against suffering etc will cause humans to become less territorial, less aggressive towards others?

Where do you read I'm a theist? I didn't mention God once — Hillary

Well if you are just here to troll then you would roleplay, wouldn't you.
I think you are doing exactly that, roleplay.

Do you think that future life extension and more protection against suffering etc will cause humans to become less territorial, less aggressive towards others? — universeness

Tough question! I've heard this said more often than I could care to count but don't animals attack only when provoked? In other words, aggression maybe a good thing, part of our wilderness survival toolkit.

What I would suggest however is to channel that aggression into more benign activities (part of the ability model of EQ) like sports, board games like chess, you get the idea!

Serious sport has nothing to do with fair play. It is bound up with hatred, jealousy, boastfulness, disregard of all rules and sadistic pleasure in witnessing violence: in other words it is war minus the shooting. — George Orwell

I just read some of your material based on the link you provide in your profile:
http://paxmundi667.com
I recommend that members read some of this before exchanging with you.

I have always been an atheist and just discovered the existence of god. I thought this forum was a place for free-thinking people to come together and exchange each other's thoughts, but apparently I'm wrong. Apparently you already know it all.
I myself never had the chance to go to school and learn anything from anyone. I had to figure everything out myself. So I'm here to learn something. I grew up with freedom of opinion. If that's not accepted here, then I won't comment anymore. I will leave you alone. I'll live my life the way I want to.