Why would we need a word for something to do with propositions and they way they link up with other things that targets something we can't even do or "make contact with" so to speak? — Terrapin Station
"this proposition refers to a state of affairs that doesn't actually obtain" — Michael
But you can't say that without it being a judgment on your part, and we already have a word for that. "False."
Again, you're wondering why there isn't a word for something we can't do. — Terrapin Station
...to try to keep things simple via a different question, if person A believes in human caused global warming and person B believes that global warming is a hoax, will the future of this planet be different for the grandchildren of person A and person B … this at the same time? If (objective) reality (as compared to the intersubjective realities of cultures, etc.) is relative to beliefs and feelings, how does this resulting absurdity not obtain? — javra
I'm saying that we can have a term "X" that is defined as "referring to a state of affairs that actually obtains" and a term "Y" that is defined as "referring to a state of affairs that doesn't actually obtain". — Michael
Sure you could have that, but again I'm wondering why anyone would bother with a word for that, especially because it's not anything that anyone can do. — Terrapin Station
they mean to say that the state of affairs referred to by "X" actually obtains, — Michael
Definitely, but what are they doing? They judging that to be the case. Hence why trying to make the distinction is pretty pointless. — Terrapin Station
But when I say "you're fat" I'm not saying "in my opinion, you are overweight". I'm just saying "you are overweight". — Michael
Right, so "You're overweight" isn't a conclusion you've reached from circumstances presented to your mind? — Terrapin Station
I didn't say it wasn't a conclusion. I'm saying that "overweight" doesn't mean "judged to have an unhealthy amount of fat". — Michael
"true" doesn't mean "judged to correctly describe the facts".
But in 150 years' time if, say, New York and London have been flooded and Bangladesh destroyed in the meantime, there will be some people who will say, 'It remains to be proved that anthropogenic climate change did this.' They will host chat shows and have followers. Just you wait and see. — mcdoodle
I invite you to consider the absolute of the present moment (that is, the moments of your life). These moments are temporary with respect to passing time, but the moments themselves are permanent. If a thing is well done, or done as well the moment allows, and you know it, that's really all the epitaph that matters, Comparisons are conjectural, memory unreliable, only the moment is real; self reflecting on itself is the ultimate beauty and monument. — tim wood
I don't hate this formulation, but I think it's a bit cute. It avoids the main issue with verbal sleight of hand. The scope of nihilism, as normally discussed, doesn't deal with things happening billions of years from now. It deals with human lives now and especially human values and institutions. — T Clark
My point is that while some (many) things are grounded via reference to something else, some standard, other things are grounded in reference to themselves. Perhaps I should say may be so grounded, but what I mean is when you get down to the bedrock of the matter, everything is so grounded. — tim wood
The nihilist says nothing matters, while it seems to me that only in traversing nihilism is real value found. — tim wood
Nor is there any narcissism,which, to reclaim some precision, is just a personality disorder. — tim wood
That is, calls into awareness a reality so vast that to mature thinking - and feeling - fear itself must dissolve in its presence. — tim wood
If there's difference in our views in these posts, it appear to me that you're fixed in in the practical and the transient, a tumbleweeds sort of a value system, which understands itself as being no value system at all, but an illusion of one. — tim wood
My point is that while some (many) things are grounded via reference to something else, some standard, other things are grounded in reference to themselves. Perhaps I should say may be so grounded, but what I mean is when you get down to the bedrock of the matter, everything is so grounded. — tim wood
If there's difference in our views in these posts, it appear to me that you're fixed in in the practical and the transient, a tumbleweeds sort of a value system, which understands itself as being no value system at all, but an illusion of one. — tim wood
This comes very close to my personal theology. That "god" refers to, can only refer to, human possibility, broadly considered — tim wood
The reasonable relativist is conscious that basic pre-rational investments close or open the possibility of various intellectual/moral positions. — visit0r
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