Jeremy Corbyn. — ssu
I think the UK should get passed Brexit finally and tackle the present problems. — ssu
I wouldn't see it on such dramatic terms.Unfortunately, there is no getting past Brexit, hence the slogan 'Get Brexit done'. The Irish question cannot be resolved. As long as North and South were in the EU, the border could be open and thus demilitarised, and the EU functioned as an overseer of fair play. But separation entails a border, so the options are the breakup of the UK and reunification of Ireland, or the imposition of a manned border and resumption of civil war. — unenlightened
For the EU the stance that "I don't have anything to do with you now after we broke up" simply doesn't cut it. — ssu
Well, not literally, just as the UK hasn't been referred to the 'ex'.The EU has never said anything like that — Olivier5
Ok.And now there is complaint that because we don't want to cooperate on any these issue, the EU insists on having some checks on the flow of goods into its territory. How very dare they! — unenlightened
In fact it has been extremely patient. — Olivier5
But at least we were together. Sort of. Ever Closer Union and all that. — Cuthbert
Indeed. The EU has so far tolerated a country that has chosen not to be a member of EU not being a member of the EU. — Cuthbert
crass incompetence, dishonesty and political shallowness — Olivier5
some pro-Eu folks do actually agree that the UK never really belonged in the EU, — Olivier5
Doing the metaphor to death, perhaps they thought their love could change us? — Cuthbert
I remember an interview with an academic shortly after the 2016 vote who said that 'The UK is currently in but half out - no single currency, no Schengen, rebates - and after this is all over it will end up out but half in.' I can see that happening. — Cuthbert
The NI protocols for instance the UK trying to have its cake and eat it too: the UK ought to be both a unitary state from a regulatory standpoint, and honor its obligations in the Good Friday agreement for a lack of hard border between NI and the Republic of Ireland, all the while creating a hard border between itself and the EU, of which the Republic of Ireland is a member. — Olivier5
d my goodness, these people are not playing with delays at Dover or with logical curiosities, they are playing with lives and terror. — Cuthbert
allow Irish reunification, repatriate a few orangists ... 'hard border' in the Irish Sea.... bitter pill to swallow — Olivier5
This is not a simple case of an isolationist Britain versus all the rest. — Cuthbert
note that the 'rest' stuck together during the negotiations — Olivier5
But the tensions remain and anti-'ever closer' sentiment is a political theme throughout the union. I was thinking about our conversation today and an old Thurber cartoon came to mind - man to wife - 'Well, who made the magic go out of our marriage - you or me?' — Cuthbert
At a deeper, political philosophy level, I see it as clinching to the past in an overly irrational way, as explained. And sure enough, every country has its traditionalists and blaming Brussels is always convenient. But you guys really lived your isolationist dream.
But history called, and the EU answered something, something they were confortable with: markets. — Olivier5
Maybe slow down the expansion, based on more stringent criteria? — Olivier5
The objective of “ever closer union” was retained in the Preamble to the 1992 Treaty on European Union (Maastricht Treaty):
Resolve to continue the process of creating an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe, in which decisions are taken as closely as possible to the citizen in accordance with the principle of subsidiarity. — https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-7230/
It just phraseology. — Olivier5
The real policy is more something like: "When it's really important, we can come together. Or not." — Olivier5
So Brexit is not so much an aberration as just one side of a tension that runs through the whole project. We have that in common with the USA. I submit my case. — Cuthbert
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