And you're committing the no true Scotsman fallacy there. — Terrapin Station
Most of the people I'm talking about aren't poorly educated in general. — Terrapin Station
But, all you're saying is that the world doesn't manifest obvious person-hood in its parts. Most of the parts of our bodies do not, merely in themselves, manifest person-hood either. — John
If personality consisted in the body then removal of some of its parts would result in a diminished person — John
How exactly does human behaviour display intentionality? Remember we are looking for something that is not merely an interpretation, but something directly observed. — John
I don't think it makes sense to say the person is diminished, its just their capabilities that are diminished. We still accord them the same degree of human rights that we do to all other persons, don't we? — John
People with intentionality behave like people with intentionality, rather than like people who are brain dead. — Sapientia
I would be nothing like the person I am today if I were to lose an important chunk of my brain. — Sapientia
Great! You've succeeded in saying precisely nothing about what constitutes evidence of intentionality. — John
You would be nothing like as functional as you are today. — John
I just don't see any sense in defining person-hood in terms of function. From your argument it follows that a high-functioning person is more of a person than an ordinary person. Doesn't sound right to me, and unless you can justify such a judgement by cogent argument I see no reason to change my view.
Of course, there comes a point where someone might not be able to function as an autonomous decision-maker at all; but even then you don't know what goes on inside the consciousness of that person. — John
Are you telling me you can't figure out the obvious behavioural differences between someone like you or I and someone who's brain dead? — Sapientia
I don't think it makes sense to say the person is diminished, its just their capabilities that are diminished. We still accord them the same degree of human rights that we do to all other persons, don't we? — John
Peak Experience is an effect of self-actualisation.I wonder if a similar challenge doesn't arise from the psychology of peak experience, of flow, and so on. If you have an experience that you interpret religiously, does it really not matter that someone else has a similar experience when surfing? — Srap Tasmaner
Ask alot of questions.I had a fellow philosophy major tell me once over beers that he was a believer because of a particular experience he had while tripping on acid. He explained that, at the time, he was already an experienced tripper, and so he was able to recognize that this was not the usual experience of using LSD, but something completely different. I took him at his word, but what are you really to do with something like that? — Srap Tasmaner
Belief is an attitude which accepts a proposition as true without evidence. — Galuchat
"God", is this type of higher consciousness that we are able to connect with not through "looking out into the world" but looking "up into the present". God transcends the physical reality and so if you try looking out into the world for it, you won't find it. It could be the case that we have built within our psyche this "God Gene" of sorts, sort of like the Freudian "ID", that motivates us to search for a higher presence, but I actually feel the presence because I'm "in it" and it seems so real that I can't honestly say that something isn't there.
In what way is the experience of these psychological things similar? — Galuchat
I don't understand your point here. Can you elaborate? — Srap Tasmaner
Sure. It's not a point, it's a question; a request for an answer (not an argument).
Given that:
1) Peak Experience is an effect of self-actualisation.
2) Flow is automatic attention.
3) Belief is an attitude which accepts a proposition as true without evidence.
4) Imagination is the faculty of forming a mental image apart from perception.
In what way is the experience of these psychological things similar? — Galuchat
(1) You had been talking about personality, not human rights, and personality is one aspect re whether they're diminished as a person.
(2) If you remove enough or the "right parts" of their brain they're no longer alive, and corpses do not have all of the same rights as living persons. — Terrapin Station
I had a fellow philosophy major tell me once over beers that he was a believer because of a particular experience he had while tripping on acid. He explained that, at the time, he was already an experienced tripper, and so he was able to recognize that this was not the usual experience of using LSD, but something completely different. I took him at his word, but what are you really to do with something like that? — Srap Tasmaner
Okay. I suppose we could think of these as departures from the ordinary, practical, everyday run of things. Imagination seems to insinuate itself all over the place, but is still a stepping aside from direct experience, I guess. — Srap Tasmaner
had a fellow philosophy major tell me once over beers that he was a believer because of a particular experience he had while tripping on acid. — Srap Tasmaner
“William James describes a man who got the experience from laughing-gas; whenever he was under its influence, he knew the secret of the universe, but when he came to, he had forgotten it. At last, with immense effort, he wrote down the secret before the vision had faded. When completely recovered, he rushed to see what he had written. It was: "A smell of petroleum prevails throughout.”
It is something I regarded as apodictic, i.e. impossible to deny. The point which struck me with great force was the inherent perfection of natural objects, like moss-covered rocks and saplings. I had this sudden realisation of the extraordinary beauty and significance of ordinary life, and felt that this feeling was something that we all should have and mainly lack. — Wayfarer
Get involved in philosophical discussions about knowledge, truth, language, consciousness, science, politics, religion, logic and mathematics, art, history, and lots more. No ads, no clutter, and very little agreement — just fascinating conversations.