Oh, I was not meaning to invalidate your knowledge, universeness! I'm very sorry about that! Really. :sad:
I most probably pushed it to far. I do that sometimes. It has nothing to do with the other person. It has to do with myself, who has read and heard --and I still do-- so much crap about AI, that it makes me puke. And this, because I am a AI programmer and I always try do make people aware and know what AI is actually about. But the wall of ignorance is too thick for me to break and it becomes strongher and higher with time. So, maybe it's time for me to stop doing that. In fact, stop caring about that and let people live in their ignorance. Besides, this situation is so old as the dawn of Man.
I'm sorry again, @universeness. — Alkis Piskas
I think the 'posthuman future' will be intrastellar-intraplanetary — 180 Proof
Yes, I remember well Hassabis, introduded to me by you, and that in my thanking-for-that-introduction answer to you (https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/comment/718045), I said "Yet, I got almost nothing from there," referring to consciousness. Otherwise, of course I accept what he had to say. (About the other guy I know absolutely nothing and I will have to read about what he has to say on the subject of consciousness.)But if you watch the material coming out from current AI experts, such as Nick Bostrom, Demis Hassabis, et al. You should accept that what they are reporting, is not like listening to a preacher talking BS from a pulpit. What they are saying, has a credence level, backed by scientific projections, that we should all pay attention to. — universeness
No, it has no meaning in or by itself. The meaning of the data is created by us.Data has no meaning! — universeness
Exactly. "Data with associated meaning." It has no meaning in or by itself, unless we associate one to it.A book contains contextualised data, labelled data, data with associated meaning — universeness
Right. You have correctly drawn a line between the two, somthing which people in general don't. Even dictionaries don't! They usually use the terms interchangeably.That sentence is NOT DATA, it is INFORMATION (data with meaning) — universeness
Sure. But who will be the judge? :grin:AI can never become self-aware or even just aware. Awareness is an attribute of life (living organisms).
— Alkis Piskas
Wanna bet?? :grin: — universeness
Well, I admit I have to examine this closely --if not study it-- before I can judge.My quote above was referring to what science knows about the exact 'tipping point' ... — universeness
This is what I call great aspirations! ... Or should I say, Great Expectations? :grin:Developing AGI and ASI may fill in many of those gaps and by doing so, silence any theistic and theosophistic residuals, that are still holding back, human growth and progress. — universeness
Why am I not afraid of that? I have dozens of other things in my mind that might lead us to extinction, but not that. Well, who knows were you and I would be --if we are still alive-- when such a thing would actually happen? :grin:I find it fascinating that ASI might mean our extinction, — universeness
Glad to hear that, @universeness!I enjoy exchanging views with you also. — universeness
Sure. But who will be the judge? — Alkis Piskas
This is what I call great aspirations! ... Or should I say, Great Expectations? — Alkis Piskas
Why am I not afraid of that? I have dozens of other things in my mind that might lead us to extinction, but not that. Well, who knows were you and I would be --if we are still alive-- when such a thing would actually happen? — Alkis Piskas
Glad to hear that, universeness! — Alkis Piskas
https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/13868/emergent/p26#:~:text=the%20human%20brain.-,AI%20can%20never%20become%20self%2Daware%20or%20even%20just%20aware.%20Awareness,%3Agrin%3A,-Science%20knows%20veryAI can never become self-aware or even just aware. Awareness is an attribute of life (living organisms). — Alkis Piskas
Did you read my note to ucarr about his 'number of posts' variable seemingly stuck on 561? — universeness
I believe this fits me and you got it right! :smile:You are more like a WYSIWYG. What You See Is What You Get. — universeness
As you well know, AI is a huuuge field, so I'm gettting in and out of it, programming-wise, since I'm involved in all sort of programming fields. And work mainly for my own pleasure and personal development.I would be interested in more details regarding what AI system you used to — universeness
NLP only by itself is a huuuge subject and --you got that right too!-- it's maybe the most fascinating for me. Most probably because of my rich linguistic background ...Is it AI NLP systems you worked with — universeness
Yes. If after a week it’s still keeping me awake at night, I’ll look into it. — Jamal
A future ASI maybe as comparable with the intellect of Anne Sullivan as you or I are comparable with the intellect of a chimpanzee. — universeness
You are attempting to compare human intellect with current AI. Current AI is advancing in functionality and capability. Systems like chatGPT are very advanced compared to an early system such as ELIZA.
ELIZA was considered a significant advance on historical AI.
How close are we to creating AGI? — universeness
AGI would have a learning capacity, which would grow much faster than the human ability to become enlightened. — universeness
Programming was my first profession (1986~1997) and back then I was mainly a system programmer but also an analyst. — Alkis Piskas
:rofl: I imagine you will sleep like an innocent child tonight, it's ok, you don't have to thank me. :blush:ucarr is now at 562 posts, indicating that your imagination cooked up the whole thing. — Jamal
I doubt it. Sending self-replicating AGI (an)droids imwould be far more energy and resources efficient. — 180 Proof
Of what use will ASI be? It has nothing that will ever qualify it for good human judgment. No human experience and no feelings. To have feelings, there must be a body that can feel. Chimpanzees would not exist if they did not care for each other. They are social animals and regulated by hormones that give the body feelings that determine behaviors. Social animals can teach us more about being humans, than ASI will ever know. ASI can have information but without experience, information is not knowledge. — Athena
However, by "judge" I meant who will judge who won the bet? — Alkis Piskas
I'm rather a "realist" (whatever this word rings to peoples' ears)Perhaps yer just a tough dude Alkis — universeness
I know this. I do it when I mention someone other than the person I am replying/commenting to and I believe that my message will be of interest to them. Otherwise, the person I am addressing the message to will be notified anyway.By the way, when you type universness, don't use the @ on your keyboard. Choose it from the tool list at the top of your blank response box. I then get informed that I have been mentioned — universeness
I know this. I do it when I mention someone other than the person I am replying/commenting to and I believe that my message will be of interest to them. — Alkis Piskas
MS DOS (PC machines), of course! I could only transfer a part of my system programming expertise to Windows. Too much to do and my programming career had began to set.Interesting, What op systems did you work on? — universeness
Yes, all that were a strange and uninviting environment for me. :smile:Prode assembly, Motorola, ... — universeness
Again, my expertise as an analyst was limited to PCs, i.e. mainly MS DOS and later Windows and it was restricted to LANs and small groups and a few clients. For a year I also worked with WANs.As an Analyst at that time, did you find yourself more and more pressured to comply or develop more rigorous 'technical support' systems for client groups? — universeness
Sounds good. I always enjoyed teaching the network topologies of LAN's and WAN's. We used to use some old BBC Micro's and we built a small client/server system in a star, bus, ring or even a fully connected mesh LAN topology or sometimes, a hybrid. With our 6th year students we even engaged some of our feeder primary schools to set up a small WAN, using a couple of old routers and a stripped down stand alone and networked Op system. It was good to be restricted to a textual user interface, no GUI involved.Again, my expertise as an analyst was limited to PCs, i.e. mainly MS DOS and later Windows and it was restricted to LANs and small groups and a few clients. For a year I also worked with WANs. — Alkis Piskas
Then, you have lost already! :grin:You can be the judge! — universeness
Nah, you forget, @Jamal would hold the dosh!Then, you have lost already! :grin: — Alkis Piskas
Sounds fair to me!Anyway, in short: I have to do nothing. The burden of proof lies to the person who claims that something is true or exists or occurs or has happened. This is you! :smile: Come to me with valuable finding and I will acjnowldge it to you even if it isn't the final solution, but is relatively close to to the goal of creating an aware AI. — Alkis Piskas
No, I will not offer a candidate AGI/ASI system that I am not convinced is self-aware.Then we will have to move to the next step: a self-aware AI, which is an attribute of humans only. — Alkis Piskas
Which reminds of what I read once, that chess supercomputers --like once was IBM's Deep Blue; I don't know how that has been evolved-- can lose when the oponent makes a move that has no sense or something like that. — Alkis Piskas
I am on the list to be connected, the list is full at present.Have you tried OpenAI's ChatGPT? (I think I have brought that up some time ago in this thread but it didn't get any attention ...) — Alkis Piskas
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