They were creating their movie and explaining how things happen. By "they", I mean all ancients trying to figure out how we should live together. — Athena
I also know the ancients invented more and more gods — Athena
I am bewildered that we can not achieve "the better" through reasoning. — Athena
Anyway, isn't it helpful to see a modern example of thinking about the gods/aliens and humans? — Athena
The name ‘Celts’ is a modern name which is used to describe many tribes of people who lived during the Iron Age. — universeness
I think it's more interesting to talk about the relations between the Greek city states and the Spartans and of course, the Persians. The Spartans for example, imo, were xenophobic Nazis of the worse kind and the Greeks not much better, especially under that hell spawn, Alexander the butcher. — universeness
I hope you can take further into this awareness. — Athena
Hum, I am noticing there is not much difference between the words "materialistic" and "militaristic" — Athena
I never thought of comparing Spartans to Nazis or vice versa. Knowing that Spartans were very disciplined, tough and people of a warrior city-state, was not enough for such a comparison.The Spartans were more Nazi like, than even the Romans — universeness
they would murder you. — universeness
Guess when overpopulation started to become a problem.Most Stone Age human societies routinely practiced infanticide, and estimates of children killed by infanticide in the Mesolithic and Neolithic eras vary from 15 to 50 percent. Infanticide continued to be common in most societies after the historical era began, including ancient Greece, ancient Rome, the Phoenicians, ancient China, ancient Japan, Aboriginal Australia, Native Americans, and Native Alaskans. Infanticide became forbidden in Europe and the Near East during the 1st millennium.
This one's a disappointment (in my book, a damp squib compromise, but if he died in office, you'd have an insurrection - at best) and the last one was.... I don't know what you think, but it's no secret what I think of the last one.And son of a gun, if we want peace, we need a president who knows better than say stupid things that piss off the leaders of violent countries. Creating ourselves as the enemy of other nations is a really stupid thing to do! and I am very disappointed in our present leader. — Athena
My code of law and ethics did not apply to the Nazis in the 20th century, as far as they were concerned, when they murdered lots of innocent people, just like the Spartans did. That's why I damn their 20th century notions of civilisation, as equally, as I damn the Spartan one, which lasted far longer, from 8th century BCE to about 200 BCE. Crime is crime, it does not reduce in it's potency or injustice due to the passage of time.They would kill or abandon defective children.
Your code of law and ethics do not apply to that culture. — Vera Mont
We talk about our admiration of the Greek civilisation, — universeness
In other words just gangland style BS, trying to pass itself of as 'we are spreading culture! our culture! which is obviously the best culture! and is divinely sanctioned! — universeness
Yes, humanity is still humanity: it still contains all the same elements that stone age, bronze age and medieval populations did, satisfies the same drives with ever more sophisticated tools.They are still with us, — universeness
Never have more truthful words been typed or spoken Vera!!! :clap: :clap: :flower: and repeated by so many.the invention of money and religion the two worst ideas of civilization. — Vera Mont
I damn entire 'systems of governance' and via that, the nation or population that either supports it or does not do enough to change it. I also admire individuals. Even historical leaders like Spartacus or whoever the true leaders were, but more importantly, those every day people who rose up in slave revolts/revolutions etc. I have little interest in nationhood other than as a stepping stone to global unison. One planet, one species.I admire and excoriate individual persons, respect and disdain certain attitudes - not entire nations. — Vera Mont
Yet you have no reticence in retroactively imposing your own legal code on past civilizations, trashing regimes with which you disagree and proclaiming the superiority of 'modern' thinking over other eras and western values over other cultures. — Vera Mont
and at the same time, you accuse me of having a lack of reticence, when I outright damn systems such as the ones employed by the Spartans, Greeks, Romans etc.I don't. In fact, I consider civilization the wrong turn in human evolution — Vera Mont
Yes, humanity is still humanity: it still contains all the same elements that stone age, bronze age and medieval populations did, satisfies the same drives with ever more sophisticated tools. — Vera Mont
Some of us wish it would improve [ie fall in line with our own world-view]; some wish it so sincerely and passionately that we imagine ways such improvement could be brought about, insist that it's already happening and we just need to fight a little harder, believe a little more fervently to achieve the perfection of humankind. — Vera Mont
As for 'doing better' just line up all your own presidents for comparison. — Vera Mont
This one's a disappointment (in my book, a damp squib compromise, but if he died in office, you'd have an insurrection - at best) and the last one was.... I don't know what you think, but it's no secret what I think of the last one.
So? Have you done it yet? Have you lined up all the presidents in chronological order and compared their [actual, factual] characters and achievements to trace the arc of US history?
What if you stopped thinking of what was better in the past and what's better in the present (Spoiler: they don't match) and think of the story unfolding? If US history were a long-running TV series, what would probably happen next? — Vera Mont
So, why not stick for now to comparing the Spartans with the Athenians, the Thesbians and Thebes,
Rhodes, Corinth, Argos etc. The influence of the Greek city states on islands like Crete and Cyprus.
The Trojan War etc, etc. The Romans came much later and the Spartans were more Nazi like, than even the Romans imo. — universeness
"just a housewife". — Athena
Where would you like to go with this discussion of cultural differences? — Athena
Athens adopted democracy from Sparta — Athena
That would apply more to Athens, which was both, than Sparta, which was militaristic, but ... um... more spartan in lifestyle. they outlawed currency and their top virtues were equality (among citizens), military fitness, and austerity.
Meanwhile the Celts were warriors, mercenaries, traders and explorers, farmers and crafters, more given to luxury in personal adornment than in public show.
I wouldn't call any of the cultures more 'spiritual' than any other: they all had their supernatural beliefs, values and loyalties. — Vera Mont
Altruism even exists in the animal world. — universeness
Bad people exist in all cultures, modern and ancient but I DO think that they CAN be more easily identified and held to account today, than in the past. — universeness
That one man is the one the entire nation, according its its acknowledged, sworn-by and much vaunted constitution, by its established electoral process, through the changes of its culture, selected to lead the whole nation and represent it among the world's nations.I am not sure that would have any value because one man does not have that much power compared to the cultures that make up the US or any nation. — Athena
I sure have no idea what you are talking about or think is important. I am thinking culture and human nature. You appear to be thinking politics. — Athena
As do many religious and spiritual people. I don't know what any of them mean by it.You may have being spiritual confused with religion? — Athena
Primitive human societies consciously invented social controls against hubris, vanity, greed and lust for power. Civilized codes of morality and law are intended to do much the same, but are far less effective, or else have the opposite effect in stratified, stupefied organizations. — Vera Mont
Because what gandhi said is not only true, it will eventually become the solution that happens faster and faster and with less and less damage. Eventually tyrants holding significant power, will become as impossible as is possible. In my opinion Ukraine should already have resulted in WW 3, but I remain quite hopeful that it will not.What's the difference, if they're followed anyway - whether in spite of their badness or because of it? — Vera Mont
There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. — universeness
The word democracy means- a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives. — Athena
Athens did not take care of everyone as Sparta did, — Athena
Maybe truth and love will triumph in the end , but they sure haven't yet. — Vera Mont
The Genus Homo never even arrived until 9:25pm on Dec 31st! — universeness
OK You have a minute and a halfGive us a freakin chance Vera!!!!!! — universeness
When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. — universeness
I am not such a fan as gandhi was, in HIS notion of love, as he employs it above, but I fully agree with his use of 'truth' above.this hopeful, wishful, wistful wisp of BS:
When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won.
— universeness — Vera Mont
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