Perhaps not 'bred better' but certainly a lot more of the global population has access to a lot more info than in the past, and we can communicate more, as you and I are demonstrating now, on this thread. — universeness
At what points in history have which 'truths' won what conflicts?I am not such a fan as gandhi was, in HIS notion of love, as he employs it above, but I fully agree with his use of 'truth' above. — universeness
Make up your mind what you're measuring, human evolution or access to satellites? They don't progress in the time-frame or scale. — Vera Mont
That's a very big and somewhat subjective list you are requesting. I can offer you one set of 'points in history' that I would put near the top of my list for being 'truths' that ultimately 'won' a human conflict.At what points in history have which 'truths' won what conflicts? — Vera Mont
Measure everything in every way we know how to and then see if we can find new ways to measure everything again. — universeness
Affectionate bombs, guillotines and spears; honest land-mines, mustard gas and man-traps won those wars? News to me. Slavery, incidentally, is alive and well.These rocked the Roman empire to it's core. Events such as the English civil war, all revolutionary wars, the American civil war, WW I, WW II, all contributed to the eventual human victory against human slavery. — universeness
https://www.ilo.org/global/about-the-ilo/newsroom/news/WCMS_855019/lang--en/index.htmThe number of people in modern slavery has risen significantly in the last five years. 10 million more people were in modern slavery in 2021 compared to 2016 global estimates. Women and children remain disproportionately vulnerable.
https://www.state.gov/what-is-modern-slavery/Child soldiering is a manifestation of human trafficking when it involves the unlawful recruitment or use of children—through force, fraud, or coercion—by armed forces as combatants or other forms of labor. Perpetrators may be government armed forces, paramilitary organizations, or rebel groups. Many children are forcibly abducted to be used as combatants.
One form of coercion used by traffickers in both sex trafficking and forced labor is the imposition of a bond or debt. Some workers inherit debt; for example, in South Asia it is estimated that there are millions of trafficking victims working to pay off their ancestors’ debts.
That one man is the one the entire nation, according its its acknowledged, sworn-by and much vaunted constitution, by its established electoral process, through the changes of its culture, selected to lead the whole nation and represent it among the world's nations. — Vera Mont
How I used them was: materialistic people are concerned with possessions and social status; spiritualistic ones are concerned with the personal 'soul' or 'essence' and its relation to the supernatural. — Vera Mont
What was Aristotle say about matter?
For Aristotle, matter was the undifferentiated primal element; it is that from which things develop rather than a thing in itself. The development of particular things from this germinal matter consists in differentiation, the acquiring of the particular forms of which the knowable universe consists.
Form | philosophy - Encyclopedia Britannica — Encyclopedia Britannica
What is Democritus known for? Democritus was a central figure in the development of the atomic theory of the universe. He theorized that all material bodies are made up of indivisibly small “atoms.” Aristotle famously rejected atomism in On Generation and Corruption.
Democritus | Biography & Facts - Encyclopedia Britannica — Encyclopedia Britannica
Aristotle famously contends that every physical object is a compound of matter and form. This doctrine has been dubbed “hylomorphism”, a portmanteau of the Greek words for matter (hulê) and form (eidos or morphê). Highly influential in the development of Medieval philosophy, Aristotle’s hylomorphism has also enjoyed something of a renaissance in contemporary metaphysics.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/form-matter/ — Stanford
The interruption of the constitution changes as the culture changes. — Athena
I think that is the general understanding of materialism but being materialistic or spiritual has a different meaning beginning with Aristotle. — Athena
That way you can pick out all the cherries from the present and prove to your own satisfaction that they are better cherries than the coconuts of the past were. (and vice versa, as required) — Vera Mont
That's your interpretation of the points I am making to connect the ancient servile wars and the revolutionary wars, civil wars and 2 world wars since? You think my main goal was to impose human emotions such as 'affection' and human traits such as honesty on to weapons that kill people?Affectionate bombs, guillotines and spears; honest land-mines, mustard gas and man-traps won those wars? News to me — Vera Mont
10 million more people were in modern slavery in 2021 compared to 2016 global estimates.
Affectionate bombs, guillotines and spears; honest land-mines, mustard gas and man-traps won those wars? News to me — Vera Mont
That's your interpretation of the points I am making to connect the ancient servile wars and the revolutionary wars, civil wars and 2 world wars since? — universeness
For whom? The 9-year-old soldiers or the girls abducted to serve in brothels?Do you still think 'modern slavery' is anywhere near as bad as slavery in ancient times? — universeness
You have allowed your 'jadism' to blind you to the fantastic improvements that historical altruists, socialists and humanists have achieved. — universeness
The pain/disappointment of your current jaded outlook, is your burden.
Why do you want to export it to others? — universeness
On the contrary, I think truth and love played thee most significant role, from the standpoint of the slaves in revolt. Love of freedom, love of justice. The truth (to them at the time) that death is better than slavery, or the truth that risking their own lives to fight against slavery was the right cause to choose.Victories of the way of love and truth is what I questioned, and your response was a bunch of terribly destructive wars, in which neither love nor truth played any significant role. — Vera Mont
All wars are won and lost through anger, violence, hate and weapons. Whether they get bigger and smaller over time doesn't seem to affect the means employed in fighting them. — Vera Mont
Level or impact of atrocity is sometimes a numbers game Vera, you know that.What difference does it how many slaves Rome had ? — Vera Mont
Ecclesiastes 1:9 "What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun." — Vera Mont
I suppose because I still have a tiny spark of optimism left: I still have some dim flicker of hope that if we acknowledge the truth of our times, we might still be avert the worst outcomes. It is, admittedly, a very, very small spark. — Vera Mont
You can help if you want! — universeness
I prefer the definition of democracy as governance of, for and by the people. — universeness
You have some eccentric views of what might still be labelled as 'democratic' or 'partially democratic.'
I demand undiluted democracy and any intermediate state of affairs means the fight continues.
Promising Athenian men a vote if they role play galley slaves is not 'introducing democracy as a right in law. It's a compromise for nefarious reasons which can be removed without the democratic mandate of the entire population, just like Rode vs Wade was removed in the USA. — universeness
I suppose because I still have a tiny spark of optimism left: I still have some dim flicker of hope that if we acknowledge the truth of our times, we might still be avert the worst outcomes. It is, admittedly, a very, very small spark. — Vera Mont
Indeed. And the US one has improved its provisions for equality of citizens under the law. But it has not guaranteed translating those improvements into a steady improvement law-enforcement, social services or political access to all citizens equally. It has not resulted in a consistent improvement in leadership over time. The arc of that history is all over the place, not upward. — Vera Mont
After having thus taken each individual one by one into its powerful hands, and having molded him as it pleases, the sovereign power extends its arms over the entire society; it covers the surface of society with a network of small, complicated, minute, and uniform rules, which the most original minds and the most vigorous souls cannot break through to go beyond the crowd; it does not break wills, but it softens them, bends them and directs them; it rarely forces action, but it constantly opposes your acting; it does not destroy, it prevents birth; it does not tyrannize, it hinders, it represses, it enervates, it extinguishes, it stupifies, and finally it reduces each nation to being nothing more than a flock of timid and industrious animals, of which the government is the shepherd.
I have always believed that this sort of servitude, regulated, mild and peaceful, of which I have just done the portrait, could be combined better than we imagine with some of the external forms of liberty, and that it would not be impossible for it to be established in the very shadow of the sovereignty of the people.
https://oll.libertyfund.org/quote/tocqueville-on-the-form-of-despotism-the-government-would-assume-in-democratic-america-1840 — Tocqueville
I'm doing the part I feel capable of doing. At this time of life, that doesn't amount to much: feed stray cats, grow tomatoes, reduce my carbon footprint, and write books.
And fcs, stop blowing on me! — Vera Mont
Not could - is doing so.Or global warming could mean the end of reality as we know it. — Athena
As of Tuesday morning, there are 87 active wildfires in the province with 24 out of control
Rising sea levelRivers swollen by days of downpours flooded some towns in northern Italy on Tuesday, forcing some residents to rooftops, while in Venice, authorities prepared to activate a mobile barrier in the lagoon in hopes of sparing the city from a rare May high-tide flooding.
The same forces that sunk the remote islands could put
coastlines around the world at risk, scientists say.
Both tornado reports and tornado environments indicate an increasing trend in portions of Mississippi, Alabama, Arkansas, Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, Tennessee, and Kentucky.
Guess what all these weather upheavals are doing to human populations!As glaciers around the world recede rapidly owing to global warming, some communities are facing a new problem: the sudden disappearance of their rivers.
At this time of life, that doesn't amount to much: feed stray cats, grow tomatoes, reduce my carbon footprint and write books.
And fcs, stop blowing on me! — Vera Mont
That is from Percile's funeral speech during Athens's war with Sparta. Lincoln repeated it during the civil war. But as many love to point out, Athens had slavery and immigrants did not have citizenship rights and women did not have political power, yet Athens was a democracy, as the US was a democracy when it had slavery and women could not vote. So there is an ideal and a less-than-perfect reality?
And we have a problem coming to an agreement on what that ideal is. — Athena
I don't refute your sources or what they say, I am just complaining, that what they called democratic, stretches the valid use of the label a little to far for me.My information came from the book "Pericles Of Athens And The Birth Of Democracy" by Donald Kagan. — Athena
What do you think was the alternative to not defending Athens from the Persian invasions? It is not being a slave to defend against an invasion. The Athens that became the role model for democracy would not have existed if they had not successfully defended against the Persians. Unlike religion, a democracy is always evolving. This is a good thing and it can be a bad thing because change can result in problems. Change makes things unstable. Forgetting what culture has to do with democracy leaves our democracy undefended. — Athena
If you are going to demand something, it should be education and preparing the young to be good citizens. Without that education, they will not be "democracy as governance of, for and by the people".
We should demand education for democracy and replace the autocratic model of Industry with the democratic model. — Athena
You forgot 'and I post on discussion forums.' — universeness
Anyway, I don't think of it as a contribution so much as an excuse to skive off work. — Vera Mont
I think you still want to influence others, — universeness
Of course I want to.... But I don't have those binoculars that let me mistake wishes for horses. — Vera Mont
Too anthropocentric. The universe, my friend, is extremely inimicable to complex organisms outside of their miniscule, watery envelopes of powerful magnetic fields in 'Goldlock's Zones' like Earth. Outer space is for the machines; virtual space is for (our) species. At most, we're tele-explorers (i.e. remote viewers (e.g. space telescopes, Martian rovers, Jovian probes, etc)). AGI—>ASI may be "our guardian" one day ... :nerd:There is a vast universe to explore, but can we earn the privilege to do so? — universeness
:up:What a sweet Pollyanna! — Vera Mont
Our intelligent machine descendants are emerging now from the womb of human reason. They will be either an extinction event or the apotheosis of human civilization – IMO, a profound improvement either way on the global status quo / human condition. :victory:I am bewildered that we can not achieve "the better" through reasoning. I think we are proving those of the Enlighten[ment] right, that with reason we can do better. — Athena
Coping mechanisms? — 180 Proof
This has been, in many situations, an important survival mechanism.
I only ever watched a handful of B5 episodes back in the day, maybe 1-2 each season; all I remember is being bored by the characters, derivative space operatic metaplot and the cheezy CGI. From what I've read in recent yeara I don't feel I'd missed much. — 180 Proof
Staying with space operas, what do you think of the portrayals of "human dilemmas" in Firefly (or Serenity) or The Expanse? — 180 Proof
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