Is Evil necessary ?

Rosalina

Apologize for my idiosyncrasies. Sometimes I think evil is attractive. It's necessary in this world or else we won't be able to appreciate good. Can evil be used as an agent to do good things and protect the ones who are weak and innocent. Just a thought that ran through my mind. We try to destroy evil by punishing it. How fair is it for society to play God. Evil ones are generally strong, dominant and aggressive. By gradually weeding them out , are we creating a society of Cu*ks and puss**s(sorry for those words but couldn't find a better alternative ).

I mean even a criminal could be very intelligent and smart. And his potential gets lost when he is put to death. Of course we end up saving many lives in exchange. But rehabilitation can be an alternative solution if found to be effective.

We say bullies are bad. What if you're caught in a situation where you wanna fight against an unjust system but you feel too weak or passive to speak out. And that bully you hated so much comes around, has a change of heart and decides to fight for you and protects you. Your mind then begins to look at the whole thing in a different way. I know it sounds odd but why do we get stuck with the idea that an evil person never changes. They too have some potential that could be put to good use. There are certain qualities /traits that make such persons formidable. These traits are important in war, fights, combat and protection. We're complex creatures and we're a combination of both good and bad. I imagine the devil having a change of heart and going back and protecting the innocent instead of harming especially when the devil is shown some love. Maybe I'm fantasizing strange things. (aka Stockholm syndrome ) But Is it entirely impossible for evil to change. Is evil excessively used as a scapegoat by a society too hellbent on being righteous and sanctimonious. Is evil sensationalized and exaggerated to feed our morally superior egos. Or is our outrage for evil acts justified. Sometimes I even think that our strong vilification and resistance to evil actually causes people to find it even more appealing. It's like you resist fear and fear grows so maybe when we resist evil too much, we allow those forces to grow.

Not sure. Maybe I'm being crazy here. But I felt like good and evil are two sides of the same coin and there could be a possibility that the outrage we experience is a result of deep social conditioning. And if we weren't conditioned that way, evil would have been diluted and never existed the way it does. Reformation would then be easier. But Who knows..... . Food for thought.

Are we losing more through punishment. Is there a way to retain some of the good or transform evil into something protective, strong and formidable but not harmful.

geospiza

↪Rosalina

Is something going on in your life that is making you think this way? People should never have to live with evil being done to them.

Wayfarer

Sometimes I think evil is attractive. — Rosalina

I think you're fibbing about the 'sometimes'. Learn who to listen to.

BC

Sometimes I think evil is attractive. — Rosalina

You are not alone in this. Many people have found evil quite attractive at times.

It's necessary in this world or else we won't be able to appreciate good. — Rosalina

Can you appreciate the goodness of a beautiful flower WITHOUT having to wade through a bed of poison ivy and nettles? I bet you can. Can you enjoy waking up in the morning and feeling great without having to be very sick the day before? I bet you can. We appreciate good things because of their nature, not because bad things provide a contrast.

True enough: Sometimes bad things improve and it is a great relief. It's great when a bad headache is gone. It's very nice when we have finally cleaned up our home and gotten all our chores done. It's good when the car has been fixed and we can drive it again. But headaches, dirty houses, and cars that don't run are not necessary.

We try to destroy evil by punishing it. How fair is it for society to play God. Evil ones are generally strong, dominant and aggressive. By gradually weeding them out , are we creating a society of Cu*ks and puss**s(sorry for those words but couldn't find a better alternative ). — Rosalina

Sometimes we punish evil. It's entirely fair for society to do that. Playing God? If you want to bring God into this, God gave us laws (the Ten Commandments, the various laws in Leviticus and elsewhere) to help us live together. It's our job to see that everyone follows the law. That's one of the things that society is for.

"Evil" doesn't operate as an implacable agent in the world. Evil is something that people do. We try to reduce evil behavior through punishment, education, rewards for good behavior, and so forth.

Sometimes people who are strong, dominant and aggressive perform evil acts, and sometimes they perform good acts. "Strong, dominant and aggressive" aren't traits of evil; they are just personality traits. Some very good people who do very good things are strong, dominant and aggressive. Some very bad people who do very bad things are weak, sneaky, weasels.

"Cu*ks and puss**s"... We're all grown up here, you can spell the words out. Maybe you were looking for "cringing weaklings"? btw, what is a 'cu*ks'?

I mean even a criminal could be very intelligent and smart. And his potential gets lost when he is put to death. — Rosalina

A criminal may well be very intelligent and smart--but usually not so much. I'm against capital punishment, but one reason pro-death people put forward is that criminals' potential for evil needs to be terminated.

Is evil excessively used as a scapegoat by a society too hellbent on being righteous and sanctimonious. Is evil sensationalized and exaggerated to feed our morally superior egos. Or is our outrage for evil acts justified. Sometimes I even think that our strong vilification and resistance to evil actually causes people to find it even more appealing. It's like you resist fear and fear grows so maybe when we resist evil too much, we allow those forces to grow. — Rosalina

Real evil requires all the resistance we can muster. Some examples:

Genocide
Regimes that terrorize their people
Criminal enterprises which cause death and injury
Theft or destruction of public goods
Corruption in business and government
Abuse of persons
Murder, rape, torture...

True, some people crusade for causes because they are sanctimonious hypocrites. And sure, people who got stuck in the juvenile stage of development might find the forbidden attractive merely because it is forbidden.

Are we losing more through punishment. Is there a way to retain some of the good or transform evil into something protective, strong and formidable but not harmful. — Rosalina

What we need to do is guide the footsteps of evil doers back onto the paths of righteous behavior.

Wosret

Satan is identified as the adversary. One of reactive egotistical rebellion. In order to be free, the possibility for rebellion always exist. Pretty much everything from ignorance is forgivable though...

Cavacava

↪Rosalina

Maybe you need to come to terms with what is meant when we say that something is Evil. I think you point at it a couple of times in what you wrote.

Sometimes I think evil is attractive. It's necessary in this world or else we won't be able to appreciate good.

I don't think Evil is attractive (except maybe to Utilitarians), but I do think that Evil is a necessary part of what it means to be human, that we would not be able to appreciate what is Good without what is Evil.

But I felt like good and evil are two sides of the same coin and there could be a possibility that the outrage we experience is a result of deep social conditioning.

I like the coin analogy, since one side of the coin is not possible without the other, yet they never meet.

The problem with what is Good and what is Evil, lies in how we culturally, normativley, think about these terms. What one culture categorizes as Evil another categorizes as Good, this is not conducive to making and absolute determinations that this is Evil and that is Good.

Agustino

"Cu*ks and puss**s"... We're all grown up here, you can spell the words out. Maybe you were looking for "cringing weaklings"? btw, what is a 'cu*ks'? — Bitter Crank

>:O >:O >:O

Cavacava

↪Bitter Crank

"Cu*ks and puss**s"... We're all grown up here, you can spell the words out. Maybe you were looking for "cringing weaklings"? btw, what is a 'cu*ks'?

I think that is pedantic and absurd. A person ought to be able to express themselves as they see fit, not according to any strictures or lack thereof. The deciding factors ought to include meaning, what is generally understood, and their feeling comfortable with what is expressed.

Do you use the "N" word much? Is it because you are not comfortable using it, or maybe you are black and you are comfortable using it.

However, your question about 'cu'ks' seems on point.

TimeLine

And that bully you hated so much comes around, has a change of heart and decides to fight for you and protects you. — Rosalina

I am unsure whether you understand 'evil' and I believe that you may need to clarify this a bit more, as I am under the assumption you are speaking more of a masculine aggression rather than evil, a dominant figure that has the strength to fight and commit immoral acts and yet still has the heart to protect and even love, which is perhaps what you may find attractive. All women find this attractive, it is instinctual. However, a bully that shows remorse is not evil, on the contrary showing remorse itself is the very fibre of moral behaviour or 'good' - mistakes that one becomes aware of is not the same as a sociopath who does not feel empathy or sense any wrongdoing.

From a Kantian perspective, there are several different levels of evil, initially starting from a weakness in motivation or will (p*ssy is how you put it), a cowardly person who would follow (someone who would watch or gang up in groups, insult or attack someone weaker then them, turn a blind eye to something bad even if they have the ability to help). They prioritise moral choices depending on the situation.

The second are those that pretend to be good (the worst kind in my opinion), an appearance where they are able to adequately present themselves as kind and solicitous when in fact there is a deliberate interest in gaining something even if it is merely the favour of others, a type of 'selling' as they market themselves to an audience that buy their deceptively moral behaviour when they have neither the mind nor the genuine heart to be virtuous. And the third is deliberate evil, someone conscious of moral laws and values who deliberately violates and establishes immoral principles of action.

The point is that evil itself is nothing more than our will, a choice and how far we can choose to will evil maxims. This is the same for our will to being moral. It is probably why the following Socratic quote is very real:

There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.

Hanover

We try to destroy evil by punishing it. — Rosalina

The intent of punishment need not be a desire to eliminate it, but simply to offer the natural consequence for the bad act. That is, punishment need serve a deterrent function, but it can be a just dessert.

Sometimes I think evil is attractive. It's necessary in this world or else we won't be able to appreciate good. — Rosalina

This is an attempt to classify evil as good, which overlooks instances where evil is not at all good, where there is no silver lining, and where the net outcome is negative.

Hanover

I am under the assumption you are speaking more of a masculine aggression rather than evil, a dominant figure that has the strength to fight and commit immoral acts and yet still has the heart to protect and even love, which is perhaps what you may find attractive. All women find this attractive, it is instinctual. — TimeLine

Are you a spokesperson for all women or are you just telling us of the sort of bad boy you adore?

Rosalina

↪Bitter Crank

Cu*ks is Cucks and pussies. Those were the words spelled out.
We try to eliminate criminals through punishment. However we rarely try to look at it through the angle of restoration and rehabilitation.

BC

I think that is pedantic and absurd. A person ought to be able to express themselves as they see fit, not according to any strictures or lack thereof — Cavacava

It might be pedantic, but I don't see absurdity. I'll drink to expression as people see fit, but I was mercifully responding to a cry for help:

sorry for those words but couldn't find a better alternative — Rosalina

Rosalina

Do you use the "N" word much? Is it because you are not comfortable using it, or maybe you are black and you are comfortable using it. — Cavacava

No I don't

Rosalina

This is an attempt to classify evil as good, which overlooks instances where evil is not at all good, where there is no silver lining, and where the net outcome is negative. — Hanover

I'm wondering if evil can sometimes be good.

BC

↪Rosalina

OK. I just consulted the Urban Dictionary (which is decidedly NOT authoritative): They said...

Cuck is a man who's a little bitch. Contrary to the beliefs of the liberal leaning crowd trying to explain something popularized by the conservatives, cuck is used by many races for someone who is spineless and IS derived from cuckold.
Her cuck boyfriend watched as a man flirted and felt up his girl in front of him.
She cheated on him and told him it would never happen again, he's such a cuck to believe that.

I'm an old man, and keeping up with the latest slang strains my already full memory.

BC

Do you use the "N" word much? Is it because you are not comfortable using it, or maybe you are black and you are comfortable using it. — Cavacava

N for nigger, you mean? I'm a W.A.S.P. I would use 'nigger' more, but it upsets white people so much. We've gotten to the point where one can't even say niggardly (meaning an ungenerous person) in public. I'd think twice about ordering a negroni cocktail (named after Count Camillo Negroni) in an all white bar. I might be stabbed to death with swizzle sticks.

BC

We try to eliminate criminals through punishment. However we rarely try to look at it through the angle of restoration and rehabilitation. — Rosalina

Yes, that's true, and we should practice restorative justice and rehabilitation.

Rosalina

↪Bitter Crank

Now what is W A S P

BlueBanana

You are not alone in this. Many people have found evil quite attractive at times. — Bitter Crank

I think that's more the social status and role of evil than actual evilness.

BlueBanana

Now what is W A S P — Rosalina

Looks like a bee but is evil. They can sting multiple times and are more aggressive than bees. They're also predators.

I know my classifications of bees, doggos and other animals so if you have an assignment for biology, don't be afraid to ask for help.

Hanover

I'm an old man, and keeping up with the latest slang strains my already full memory. — Bitter Crank

The word is derived from the cuckoo bird, who supposedly invaded other bird's nests, pushed aside its eggs, and laid its own eggs in the nest, causing the other bird to unknowingly care for the egg and eventually raise the cuckoo bird.

A cuckold then would be a man who would unknowingly allow another man to invade his eggs (which are conveniently located in his wife's womb), and eventually raise that other man's child, thinking it his own.

Enough of the history, and on to the perversion. The common use of the term applies to the knowing cuckold, who derives masochistic pleasure in seeing his wife sexually satisfied by another man, while being denied the same access as the invader. It's a humiliation fetish.

As our good poster used the term, she was referencing men who she found less than masculine, like those who were weak and feminine (i.e. pussies) and those who couldn't sexually satisfy their partners (i.e. cuckolds).

Hanover

I'm wondering if evil can sometimes be good. — Rosalina

Then it's not evil.

Hanover

Now what is W A S P — Rosalina

You have a non-waspish name.

Chany

Is evil necessary?

In response, I say: does there exist a possible world in which evil exists?

If yes, then evil is not necessary.

If no, then evil is necessary.

My gut says there is such a possible world, as there appears to be no contradiction in existence, even our own, containing evil. :P

Hanover

Is evil necessary?

In response, I say: does there exist a possible world in which evil exists?

If yes, then evil is not necessary.

If no, then evil is necessary.

My gut says there is such a possible world, as there appears to be no contradiction in existence, even our own, containing evil. — Chany

I don't understand this analysis. There exists an actual world where evil exists, so why ask if there is a possible world where it might exist?

If there exists a possible world where evil does not exist, then evil is obviously not necessary. Is that your question?

The last sentence made no sense to me. Does it make sense to you?

0 thru 9

(For what it is worth, some thoughts on the effects of words... )
The choice of words one uses to describe inner conflicts may be a subtle but critical point. I am referring mostly to connotations and possible associated meanings here, rather than strict dictionary definitions (denotations). The word "evil" (as technically accurate as it may be) may possibly not be the most helpful here, as it is a loaded term.

Speaking for myself, the word evil (or Evil) has associations of being extremely powerful, perhaps nearly irresistible or unbeatable, along with being related and similar to the word "Devil". As powerful more or less as "Good", as though it is some kind of dark Dionysian counterbalance to the Apollonian light. Or that evil is the inevitable Yin to the holy Yang, or something. (Both of which it definitely is NOT. But of course evil and wrong will almost always quickly lead to negative and painful consequences. This is a most important ethical and social issue, by all means.)

Personally though, whenever i have thought this way (that good and evil are somehow equally powerful or necessary) and acted upon it, i have gone astray into confusion. At times, there has been almost an obsession concerning evil/devil. Perhaps this is understandable, given the current world circumstances. (Disclaimer: this is NOT meant as a theological statement, affirmation, or denial). But as someone once said, "where attention goes, energy flows". I find it clearer and more effective to use words like wrong, bad, mistake, error, imbalance. They seem to have less baggage than the word "evil". Just a preference one may or may not find useful.

Breaking down the "wrong" into its component ingredients of ignorance, greed, and hatred, as Buddhism does for example, may shed light on how to recognize and neutralize it within oneself. Since most would agree that we can only control ourselves... and often even that is difficult. This is not meant to downplay the seriousness of the issue at all. It is meant more as a strategy to embrace the good in one's life.

One could compare the difference between right and wrong to two people cooking their dinner. One person is cooking it at an optimal temperature, and it is hardly noticeable except for a pleasant aroma. The other person cranked up the heat way too high, and there is smoke and flames which triggers the alarm. A real panic which naturally grabs the attention. An error in judgment leading to danger, but the basic elements are not essentially different than the first case. (just my two cents worth)

Chany

↪Hanover

Sorry, I completely wasn't thinking and didn't put a sarcasm indicator. It is really just supposed to be stupud and take the thread title literally in a modal logical sense- "necessary" means "is true in all possible worlds".

ArguingWAristotleTiff

I think it is a breath of fresh air and maybe an indicator as to some progress we may have made in decreasing the use of what many would consider derogatory references even if they may be completely accurate.
Example: W.A.S.P., Dago, JAP

BC

↪Rosalina

W.A.S.P. = White Anglo-Saxon Protestant.

BC

Example: W.A.S.P — ArguingWAristotleTiff

Who the hell thought there was anything derogatory about being a White Anglo-Saxon Protestant? We are the apex of creation, the paragon of animals, the Supreme Beings. We used to run America! Alas...

Is Evil necessary ?

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