You tell me. I'm not arguing about the physiology. — Banno
I assume babies can't see color because "Things in the word, and the people around us, also have a say in what colours we see." Since babies don't know words and words determine what we see, babies can't see, color or otherwise. — Hanover
It does not follow from this that babies do not see. — Leontiskos
The factual explanation is that the colours we see are determined by what the brain is doing.
— Michael
The bolded word is where Michael oversteps... — Banno
You made an argument, I pointed out why it was a bad argument, and then instead of responding you asked a question. Was your argument a good argument or a bad argument? Does your conclusion follow? — Leontiskos
You indicated language was a necessary element in the formulation of a perception — Hanover
so I asked why my example was inapplicable — Hanover
Isn't one of the issues here now "What is to count as seeing?"
Kinda where we came in. — Banno
But, with this thread, evidently not.I thought that that 'issue' had been long since resolved. — creativesoul
This past 30 minutes of conversation arose from this comment of Banno's:
'Things in the word, and the people around us, also have a say in what colours we see." — Hanover
This seems like the same equivocation between determination and influence that Banno pointed out to begin the exchange.
The claim seems to be that things in the world influence what we see, and our linguistic community influences the names of what we see and the aspects we pay attention to. It does not follow from this that babies do not see. — Leontiskos
Fair interpretation — Hanover
Why would I demand that language not be a factor in how we interpret the world? — Hanover
I thought that that 'issue' had been long since resolved. — creativesoul
Okay, well I have no idea how (2) is supposed to follow from (1). — Leontiskos
At this point it seems like you are trying to continue agreeing with Michael despite not agreeing with him on much of anything. — Leontiskos
When a shadow falls over a ball we do not say that the color of the ball has changed, because we differentiate our visual perception of the ball from the ball's color. — Leontiskos
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