Aristotle and the Eleusinian Mysteries

I like sushi

I have a rather speculative theory about Aristotle either never partaking in the Eleusinian Mysteries, or him being something like Lucius (as portrayed in Apuleisus's Metamophorphoses), where he goes through the motions of the initiation ceremonies, but is essentially blind to there use or meaning.

I wonder about this because I do not believe there is any firsthand account (or secondhand) of him going through this initiation. This may not seem like much of an oddity to us now but in ancient Athens it is believed the vast majority of the population partook of these initiation ceremonies.

From reading Plato, especially with the Analogy of the Cave, there seems to be more correspondence with what occurred in ancient mysteries, so it appears that Plato did partake (I am unsure of any direct historical evidence for this btw?). A great many people do frame Plato as a bit of a mystic, but I have never heard this kind of rhetoric aimed at Aristotle.

Do you have any evidence to suggest that Aristotle went through the Eleusinian Mystery ceremonies?

tim wood

This from Wiki:

"Under Peisistratos of Athens, the Eleusinian Mysteries became pan-Hellenic, and pilgrims flocked from Greece and beyond to participate. Around 300 BC, the state took over control of the mysteries; they were controlled by two families, the Eumolpidae and the Kerykes. This led to a vast increase in the number of initiates. The only requirements for membership were freedom from "blood guilt",[46] meaning never having committed murder, and not being a "barbarian" (being unable to speak Greek). Men, women, and even slaves were allowed initiation."

Can you develop your point a little more? What matter whether Aristotle "went through" the ceremonies?

Gnomon

Do you have any evidence to suggest that Aristotle went through the Eleusinian Mystery ceremonies? — I like sushi

Participants in the rites were supposed to be rewarded with some form of eternal life or reincarnation. Do you think such a mystical worldview is not characteristic of Aristotle's more mundane view? As the note below indicates, Ari had an ambiguous attitude toward such spiritualistic beliefs. For him, the Soul was not a separate thing that could animate several bodies, or walk around as a ghost. As I understand, his "Soul" was more like our modern notion of "Life" : an activity, not a thing. :smile:

Aristotle did not believe in the reincarnation of the soul, but he did believe in the immortality of the soul. Aristotle's theory of the soul was that the soul was a capacity, not a substance, and that it animated the body, allowing a person to be alive and to perform activities. He believed that the soul did not exist independently of the body, and that a person was more closely identified with their body than their soul.
___Google AI overview

I like sushi

Do you think such a mystical worldview is not characteristic of Aristotle's more mundane view? — Gnomon

Possibly. I am curious if anyone knows of any evidence.

Moliere

Do you have any evidence to suggest that Aristotle went through the Eleusinian Mystery ceremonies? — I like sushi

I think this is so far back in history that if you had some clear evidence you could publish a paper on it.

I like sushi

↪Moliere

Well, I am not sure there is any clear evidence that Plato did either, but it is obvious enough to me he did (Cave Analogy).

Any hint at this either way is what I am interested in. It will be speculation either way.

Moliere

↪I like sushi

Heh. Fair.

I'm not sure it's obvious Plato did due to the cave analogy. Would it be that hard for an aristocrat to hear the tales people tell and reforge them to demonstrate a point? He may have even been there, but the analogy -- especially given its literary form -- doesn't give clear evidence about Plato either way.

He could have heard it from someone else enough times to forge a myth that appealed to the people around him without attending.

Wayfarer

Interesting to note that one of the etymologies for 'mystic' and 'mysticism' was precisely 'an initiate into the Mysteries.'

I think scholarly opinion favours the view that Plato was an initiate, although as is well known, speaking about them was forbidden, they're secret rites (like Masonic rites in today's culture.) But many of the themes in the more spiritual of the dialogues - Phaedo, Phaedrus, and Symposium - are at least strongly suggestive of the soteriological beliefs of the that cult.

It is really not difficult to interpret the Analogy of the Cave as an analogy from ignorance (avidya in the Indian texts) to philosophical enlightenment although as always Plato's dialogues contain a strong rationalistic element which was not so pronounced in Eastern wisdom teachings.

I like sushi

↪Moliere

It would be unusual for someone to have NOT partaken in the Eleusinian Mysteries as a citizen of Athens. It was common place. I imagine it would likely have been mentioned if Aristotle had not, so I also speculated that he may have taken part but just that it had no real effect on him.

I like sushi

↪Wayfarer

There were several other mystery cults too. Many mention the Mother of Gods ... am I starting to wonder if this may have been a reference to Mnemosyne in some cases. I am trying to work in my own views of what this was originally all about though.

Just fishing for info really.

Wayfarer

↪I like sushi

Have a look for The Sacred and the Profane: The Nature of Religion, Mircea Eliade. He discusses the Mysteries and also (from memory) their relationship to the ancient proto-Indo-European mystery cults that spread across the ancient world with the original Aryan peoples.

I like sushi

↪Wayfarer

Read it many MANY times already. I am familiar with Eliade's other work too - especially Shamanism.

What I read recently is a recent scholarly summation: Mystery Cults of the Ancient World by Hugh Bowden. It focuses on Greco-Roman cults.

I like sushi

He discusses the Mysteries and also (from memory) their relationship to the ancient proto-Indo-European mystery cults that spread across the ancient world with the original Aryan peoples. — Wayfarer

I do not believe he covers this at all in The Sacred and The Profane. He certainly covers this kind of thing else where. Probably in A History of Religious Ideas?

Wayfarer

↪I like sushi

Yes, that might have been it - been a long time! - but if you're familiar with him already, you probably know that!

Gnomon

Do you think such a mystical worldview is not characteristic of Aristotle's more mundane view? — Gnomon
Possibly. I am curious if anyone knows of any evidence. — I like sushi

I get the impression that you would prefer to find evidence that Aristotle was not a mystic. Is that because you think of him as the original empirical scientist? :smile:

Is Aristotle the father of science?
Aristotle was considered to be the father of modern science because he was the father of the scientific method. He was the pioneer of the development of the scientific method, which is the hallmark of the modern science. Aristotle was the first to conduct empirical studies, which is what modern science is based on.
https://homework.study.com/explanation/why-is-aristotle-considered-the-father-of-modern-science.html

Moliere

↪I like sushi

Well, according to Wikipedia, authority on all knowledge :D --
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristotle

In Athens, he probably experienced the Eleusinian Mysteries as he wrote when describing the sights one viewed at the Mysteries, "to experience is to learn" (παθεĩν μαθεĩν

So seems others' agree with you based on reading his texts.

I was just thinking if you had something definitive like that it would likely be published or publishable. Ancient evidence is always sketchy and requires lots of interpretation from multiple experts. It's really interesting because of that, but it's definitely difficult to ascertain lots of specifics that one might ask.

Gnomon

↪I like sushi

↪I like sushi
Well, according to Wikipedia, authority on all knowledge :D --
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristotle — Moliere

FWIW here's what artificial intelligence says :

"Aristotle was influenced by the Eleusinian Mysteries, a secret religious festival that took place in ancient Greece and was central to the development of much of Western civilization"
___Google AI overview

I like sushi

FWIW here's what artificial intelligence says — Gnomon

It is worth NOTHING.

AmadeusD

The Road To Eleusis

If anyone wants to delve.

I like sushi

↪AmadeusD

Have you?

I like sushi

↪AmadeusD

Ah! It is the Ergot theory one.

I think this is a tad more up to date and not at all speculative:

Mystery Cults in the Ancient World

Review by me here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMXgb2EIi7o&t=2s

AmadeusD

↪I like sushi

As is this:

The Immortality Key

Unfortunately, he gets mystical about it, instead of anthropological. But the synthesis is good. Appreciate you linking your review of your proferring too!

I like sushi

↪AmadeusD

If it says "foreword by Graham Hancock" it is certainly not a stamp of approval!

Aristotle and the Eleusinian Mysteries

Welcome to The Philosophy Forum!

Categories

More Discussions