Medical researchers work nonstop. Even while the world sleeps.Hopefully, we live in a very modern era, and scientists can overcome this virus quickly. — javi2541997
She is a super granny!My granny is 91 years old, and it seemed that the covid didn't even approximate to her. — javi2541997
The philosophical justification for punishment desert. I did not invent this.That is your pov. — BC
The main purpose of any punishment is desert.Even if the Justice system were to be perfect, I am still against capital punishment. I do not believe it has the power to dissuade someone from committing a capital crime, — BC
There is room for improvement in the justice system and it is constantly being evaluated, reviewed, analyzed. But to say that capital punishment shouldn't be part of the system because the justice system is not perfect is similar to saying we will not give every and each individual what they deserved because we don't have a perfect system. Desert is the main focus of punishment. In a philosophical argument, desert is a way of acknowledging a person as a moral agent.Sadly, "the extent of the law" may include capital punishment. I am against capital punishment for two reasons: #1, in the United States, at least, justice has been perverted in a significant number of convictions, including those of capital cases. The wrongfully convicted are sometimes exonerated by the hard work of a few justice groups. It's bad enough if someone spends 20 years in prison for a wrongful conviction. A wrongful execution is beyond appeal. — BC
Oh really? Execution is an unseemly activity for the state to engage in? Who should deliver the execution then? The federal government? The City government?#2, execution is an unseemly activity for the state to engage in. — BC
This quote is being taken out of context. Hamlet is in conflict with himself/ his thoughts."There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so." - William Shakespeare, Act 2, Scene 2, "Hamlet".
Is right and wrong just a matter of thinking something is right — Truth Seeker
Wisdom tells me that the second hanging is a formality, since the hangees will no longer be 'present'.
On the other hand, I'll own up to a certain amount of vindictiveness toward responsible agents who wrecked the climate and caused billions of deaths. — BC
No!Let them be hanged twice. — BC
Good exegesis!I forget exactly where, I think it's in a few places, Plato describes being educated as primarily "desiring what is truly worthy/good and despising what is truly unworthy/bad." He says that a formally educated, wealthy person might be able to give more sophisticated answers as to why something is desirable or undesirable, but that this is ancillary to being truly "educated." If the more sophisticated person is nonetheless not properly oriented/cultivated such as to desire the good and abhor evil, then they are in an important sense uneducated (unformed); whereas the unsophisticated person is educated, although lacking in sophistication.
Now, Plato's point here sort of goes with what you each have said in different ways. In general, we do not love the good by default. While people might have more or less of a talent/inclination towards specific virtues and vices (e.g., tempers can "run in families"), in general they won't attain to a state of virtue without some cultivation. Indeed, without care and cultivation, at the limit, infants and children will die, so there always needs to be some cultivation (some "education"). — Count Timothy von Icarus
Okay.A bit out of scope for this conversation. — T Clark
Count me in. That's why I'm here in this thread.I've been careless in language. — Tom Storm
This answer is neither here nor there. Fools by definition are people who act unwisely and get unwise results.Because, in most situations, even a fool can see when something is a failure. You don’t even need to know what success is. But as I already said, very few people are 100% foolish. — Tom Storm
“It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.” — Aristotle
“Any fool can know. The point is to understand.”
Okay, then educate me. How do you understand Taoist wisdom.Your understanding of Taoism is different from mine. — T Clark
Wisdom comes from letting go of what you’ve learned, not adding more to it. Wisdom is a surrendering, not the result of an act of will. — T Clark
Okay so you're just supporting what I said earlier. How do you know what mistakes are if not by knowing what success is. By knowing the difference.In fact, I have learned more from watching mistakes and making them than I ever have from success. — Tom Storm
Ah, you are forgetting one principle -- this is parallel to what you're saying "how do you know there's an error in a process?" You know there's an error when you've seen the correct result from that process and now another person using the same process did not arrive at the same result.I wonder if it is possible to become wise by learning from the foolish? After all, with discernment, watching a fool and what happens to them can be very instructive in learning what not to do. — Tom Storm
I still think you’re clearly wrong. — T Clark
Of all the personal qualities that a person can have - intelligence, character, integrity, experience, wisdom, temperament, maturity, personality, virtue - what wisdom and maturity have that set them apart from the others is distance, dispassion. They’ve seen everything before. I was thinking for a minute that maybe wisdom and maturity are the same thing, but that’s not right. I guess it’s more that maturity is a prerequisite for wisdom. Wisdom stands back and sees everything at once, how everything fits together, what’s going to come next. — T Clark
No, I'm seeing education as not just schooling and formal instruction.You’re seeing education as something quite different from traditional book-smart or university-style learning. I imagine it is possible to be wise in some areas and foolish in others. — Tom Storm
That’s ridiculous. I think it shows, perhaps, a lack of wisdom. — T Clark
I think that's right in the sense that a fish doesn't actively experience water. It's too fundamental. On the other hand, water is an essential part of its lived experience, and if you take it out of the water, it definitely knows the difference. — Baden
Good for her. Yes, in a way teen years are a form of 'insanity'. The overriding principles are recalcitrance and insubordination.When my teenage daughter got in trouble with the law, she had to go into counseling and the counselor told her she learned better. She most certainly did. But the teen years are a form insanity. — Athena
I don't agree that we even experience this brokenness just because we cannot go beyond our perception and explore the consciousness not as an object.What follows then is an attempt to explore a form of brokenness in or in our relation to this non-positional awareness, and, by extension, the other. — Baden
No. That said, there are many ways to educate ourselves. I don't mean academically. Reading, listening to other reputable people, and watching the actions of those you respect.Can an uneducated person be wise? — Tom Storm
Wisdom is whole. So, a wise person should have wisdom in all aspect of their life -- practical skills and moral awareness.Does wisdom usually belong to one or two specific domains, or is it a broader category of integrated practice? To what extent does it involve practical skill, moral awareness, or both? — Tom Storm
Very important. I don't mean being a sage. Vervaeke could be right. Anytime someone points to the west, they mean the insatiable appetite to amass great wealth and conquer whatever it is to be conquered. At the expense of wisdom, there is suffering as a result of this behavior.How important do we think wisdom is in our lives, and do we agree with contemporary thinkers like John Vervaeke that we “suffer a wisdom famine in the West”? — Tom Storm
I should say that this is not a good understanding of perception. Also, your conclusion doesn't follow.So I cannot depend on my understanding to know the true state of being in the world.
Therefore, "perceive" in "to be is to be perceived" cannot refer to the understanding but only to the sensibilities. — RussellA
No. But you have to admit that as an adult absorbing all kinds of learning from your environment, that the childhood teachings we learned have been modified. And this is what I meant. It could happen that the values you learned as a child have been beneficial to you as an adult and so that's what you follow.But my point is that your childhood influences don't always wither away. — Hanover
Good. You tried to assert what you truly were, a gay man. But in doing so, you were aware that your values were not necessarily at odds.There is a lot of truth in what you say. I experienced that kind of disjunction as a gay man. I moved from small town/rural life, oriented around heterosexuality and traditional lifestyles, to an urban environment, and was greatly influenced by the norms of the liberationist gay male community of the late '60s and early 70s.
However, as unlike a gay lifestyle was from growing up in Podunk, MN, a lot of the values and behaviors of my parents remained. — BC
But "bored" is not the only perception you might have with Mary. Did you perceive her as standing in front of you, or looking out the window, or talking to someone else. And did it occur to you that your understanding that she is bored might be erroneous?However, I may perceive Mary is bored because she is wearing bright clothes and you may perceive that Mary is not bored precisely because she is wearing bright clothes.
If perception refers to understanding, the situation becomes very unclear. How can anyone know what is in the mind of God if everyone's perceived understanding of the same situation is probably different. How can anyone ever know Mary's true state of being.
Mary's "to be" can never be known if "is to be perceived" means perceived in the understanding. — RussellA
Not a fan of the topic of Narcissus. To me what he had was a disease of the mind, not the lack humility, if this is the diagnosis. Symbolically, when it's already a disease, a procedure is necessary to be performed, not an analysis to be laid out. He was left to die alone. No sage could save him.What is the way out?
The way out must begin with a refusal to search, but it cannot be a purely negative act. Narcissus must rebuild the other into its internal mirror through creative acts that confirm the symbolic social embeddedness of the self and so performatively deny its neurotic / solipsistic denial. It is a return to humility through working not to be the dream of God by creating new dreams for God that may substitute for the sacrifice of the self. Narcissus must become the dreamer, not the dreamed, and must make his dreams real. He must be, in Sartrean terms, a useless passion, but nonetheless a passion and a socially mediated one, that yet creates its own unique, and, ultimately, desirable story of self. — Baden
Though your explanation of the rules of this puzzle.how are you getting those probabilities? — flannel jesus
The claim "esse est percipi", to perceive is defined and explained clearly in many of the philosophers' passages. Berkeley's is no different -- to perceive is to use the 5 senses and of course the understanding of this perception.I am unclear as to the meaning of "perceive" in "esse est percipi", "to be is to be perceived". — RussellA
Yes, in all of those senses. For example, in I perceive she is bored, you can correctly make this claim because you have interacted with this person multiple times and you've seen how this person acted in different ways. We show and hide our emotions.Does it mean perceive through the sense, as in "I perceive a red postbox" or "I perceive a loud noise" or does it mean perceive in the mind, as in "I perceive she is bored" or "I perceive the cause of the smoke was a fire"? — RussellA
There is no violation of perception in this case. I agree.Today, my understanding of reality is described by Physicalism, where particles and forces are fundamental to the reality of the world. — RussellA
I don't know if that's the correct interpretation of Berkeley's understanding of perception. I believe @Wayfarer has covered this multiple times already.Berkeley did not believe in what today we call Physicalism, as he believed that everything in the world, whether fundamental particles, fundamental forces, tables, chairs or trees are bundles of ideas in the mind of God. — RussellA
I also like really like that red and the shape is intriguing. This is a bit more sombre. — Baden
Interesting paint, Baden. As you said, is a bit more sombre and that shades of green, purple, gray, etc... makes me feel a bit of anxiety for being lost there.
A representation of a lonely winter day in a hidden forest. — javi2541997
. It looks very like a painting, but it's actually a photograph. I used a long shutter speed and moved the camera to get the effect (rather than use post-editing / Photoshop etc). This method doesn't always work, but in this case it was meant to express pretty much what you felt. — Baden
From SEP - George Berkeley:
Berkeley defends idealism by attacking the materialist alternative. What exactly is the doctrine that he’s attacking? Readers should first note that “materialism” is here used to mean “the doctrine that material things exist”.
Thus, although there is no material world for Berkeley, there is a physical world, a world of ordinary objects. This world is mind-dependent, for it is composed of ideas, whose existence consists in being perceived. For ideas, and so for the physical world, esse est percipi. — RussellA
By contrast, the word objective, in its modern philosophical usage — “not dependent on the mind for existence” — entered the English lexicon only in the early 17th century, during the formative period of modern science, marked by the shift away from the philosophy of the medievals. This marks a profound shift in the way existence itself was understood. As noted, for medieval and pre-modern philosophy, the real is the intelligible, and to know what is real is to participate in a cosmos imbued with meaning, value, and purpose. But in the new, scientific outlook, to be real increasingly meant to be mind-independent — and knowledge of it was understood to be describable in purely quantitative, mechanical terms, independently of any observer. The implicit result is that reality–as–such is something we are apart from, outside of, separate to.
This conceptual shift took decisive form in the work of Galileo, Descartes, and John Locke (against whom most of Berkeley’s polemics were directed). Galileo proposed that the “book of nature” is written in the language of mathematics, and that only its measurable attributes — shape, number, motion — belonged to nature herself⁴. — Wayfarer
Noise without intention and a look back to build up what's ahead is just...noise.I'm interested if meaning can be constructed in noise. — hypericin
I enjoy the sarcasms of the philosophers. They are always nuggets of truth.As Chomsky noted
It is quite possible — overwhelmingly probable, one might guess — that we will always learn more about human life and human personality from novels than from scientific psychology.”* — Language and Mind (1968) — Wayfarer
No interpretation. It's not a language.The question is this: given enough time and computing power, can humanity eventually "discover" an interpretation that renders the text coherent? While in truth, inventing one out of whole cloth? Or will the text remain indecipherable forever? — hypericin
I've abandoned the word 'complex' a long time ago because I could not make any of my argument stick just by attaching this word. Similarly, I have avoided using percentages of human DNA to strengthen my argument.An adult fruit fly’s brain is much more complex, however—and most importantly, the small insects share 60 percent of human DNA, as well 75 percent of the genes that cause genetic diseases, per a statement. As such, understanding the fly’s brain in such detail could hold implications for connections in human brains—and the neural pathways that lead to certain behaviors. Fruit flies, like humans, can get drunk, sing and be kept awake with coffee, suggesting similarities in our brains." — Philosophim
Either way, I know that everyone with my eye colour knows exactly what I know, and so knows that if every person commits to the rule: "if the n people I see with X eyes don't leave on day n then I will leave on day n+1 and declare that I have X eyes" then everyone will leave the island having correctly declared their eye colour. — Michael