Yes, but you have to spend a really long time to milk cause they produce a very minute amount.Is milking a male goat possible? — EugeneW
Okay, I meant poverty income -- those just above or below poverty level set forth by the government, depending on inflation and per capita income of a country. If there's basic income for everybody, no one has to do stupid jobs.If income varies even a bit, there will be low and high income. — ssu
Jesus you're wrong! If in the land of 1,000 solipsists, one of them died, 1,000 didn't care.Once upon a time, in the land of 1000 solipsists, one of them died. But the 999 left, didn't care. — EugeneW
You broke someone's heart? Were you in a position to do that?I think I broke someone's :sad: — Agent Smith
What's this broken heart? Did someone break your heart?:broken: — Agent Smith
No it isn't natural that there are low income (and we agree that low income are those who couldn't afford a lot of things that moderate and above average earners enjoy).It's naturally permanent, because naturally there always will be those low income. — ssu
This is correct. Remember Sophia? It was presented in public as an AI that could "think" and interact with you. It can't. The handlers feed it information -- like a song, or answers to questions before the actual encounter. It's very limited. But people think it's the closest we get to an android. But it's really isn't. It's a cringe worthy creation of people.I've noticed that people who talk about "an AI" in this kind of context overestimate the capabilities of computer programs. Calling it "an AI" makes it sound like it's an entity, like a person, a mind. It isn't any of those things. — Daemon
Neither do I see your point. So, are we good?Yes. I just don't see the point you're making. — EugeneW
Yes, one could argue like this as well. That's why I've been saying all along, why require proof of existence of god from believers? Why is there a special standard for this kind of belief that we don't see in others. And again, I've already mentioned the big bang, which no one here has countered. There's no proof of the big bang. Just some "testable evidence".I don't know if it helps your case but belief isn't knowledge, it's just one of three conditions for knowledge (JTB theory) and that being so, proof isn't necessary. You can believe anything you want; fairies, Tinker Bell, Rocs, anything's game when it comes to just belief. — Agent Smith
Okay, so now we're back to the pesky question of difference. In a logical argument, do you agree that god exists and claims that dreams exist are two different logical argument. One does not need it.We agree! Proving god or proving dreams are two different things though. — EugeneW
To me this is a stupid question, no offense. Why would you ask someone a proof if he's alive?And they can't proof that they're alive either? — EugeneW
The belief in god. Those who say god does not exist because there's no proof of god's existence.Why it requires proof? — EugeneW
lol. So what? So, why does belief in god require proof of god then?So we can't proof to others we dream, perceive and are alive. So what? — EugeneW
WTF is this? What are you responding to? To my claim that we accept certain things without proof? Then we're in agreement. Thank you very much.Exactly! Get my point? — EugeneW
Then I could say the same thing with you -- all the things you post here are just your illusion and I'm under no obligation to respond to an illusion or delusion.That's no proof your perception exists. For all I know you don't have a perception of reality. How can you proof to me you see the world? — EugeneW
Okay, then that tells me you don't subscribe to an objective reality. Fair enough.Snow is white to humans. It is a fact about human perception and language use. I have no issue with modest claims like cats being on mats, etc. But for me this does not tell us much about an objective world, just how a fragment of that world seems to us, based on the constructions of language and perception. — Tom Storm
You can search for explanation of objective reality. Then decide for yourself if your understanding leans towards the subjective. I just gave you what is an objective reality is. For example, if you think that snow is white and blood is red, then there's your objective reality. Facts come in statements. So, think about that. "Snow is white" is a fact -- is it in the outside world? If you agree, then you agree there's meaning out there --that snow is white. And it is intelligible to us. We picked it out from the external world.The thing is, I am not sure. — Tom Storm
Okay then, that means you don't subscribe to objective reality. Which is fine. I was merely saying that you clearly express it.Reality? Not sure what is in scope here. In general, it seems to me that communities determine what is true through a collaborative exercise in creating agreement. You could say that truth is created not found. Examples of such truths might include - 'democracy as the best government'; 'the value of education'; 'god/s care about humans', 'the imperative of progress'... — Tom Storm
Let's agree that objective reality is one that has facts and truths. So, facts, as we know, are actual/correct statements about the world.I am not certain what the term objective reality refers to. — Tom Storm
Good. We're getting somewhere.I disagree that the 'outside world' is intelligible to us, but we may do better with our inside world - our thoughts. — Tom Storm
This is the objective reality implication we often neglect when claiming we believe in objective reality. The corollary to claiming we believe in objective reality is, that the meaning lies in that reality, not in us, and we just found it out there. Because it is intelligible to us, it must be that the outside world has some form of meaning already prepared for us to discover.We're desperately trying to find something that doesn't exist, because we simply cannot comprehend the confrontation with the fact, that the universe doesn't care whether or not we exist. — Carlikoff
Science/Medicine has limits, it's fair to say. Dreams could run as long as an hour. If one could make a film of the dream while the subject is sleeping, then that's the proof of dreams. And we can't do that.That's it! There is no scientific evidence of what goes on inside of matter. Science can describe the outside but not the inside. — EugeneW
Good to bring this up. As with any definition of perception, which you've already handled well, how do we know perception exists? Because to argue against it, or to even doubt it, is perception itself. In other words, we can't talk our way out of our own mind and say it doesn't exist. That's the logical double bind for ya. Cartesian.It might seem odd to ask but how do we know perception exists? — Carlikoff
That we can test every choice, simulate their effects for analysis, even the ones you don't like, must mean something, oui? If we come with preinstalled preference packages (no free will), your choice will be determined by them, obviously, but the point is virtual choices seem not to be affected by one's preference package. — Agent Smith
To be is to be a mind. To be a mind is to be a decision-maker.
The world matters in the formation of such minds. Nature has limited, or constrained, the kinds of ideas that we can generate. Here one looks to the ecological conditions that minds adapt to for guidance. Nature has also insured that we can hit on the right ideas very often. Ideas are then not arbitrary. They are adaptive; they guide behavior. If the ideas are bad, they are rejected. The constraints on our hypotheses are tied to our creative potential....