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If there is a god then he surely isnt all merciful and all loving like islam and Christianity claimNietzsche was not a religious scholar and never seriously studied the traditions he was commenting on. A lot of his "history" is just made up speculation to suit his points. I would advise against swallowing it uncritically. From the standpoint of history, it is more on the level of creative fiction. — Count Timothy von Icarus
It's pretty simple to examine history though. And plenty of historical scholars like Hannah Arendt even detail the history quite well. Further still, we can see the intellecual Jews highly appreciated Nietzsche's Genealogy. It helped them in overcoming the neurosis which was plaguing their kind... (Nietzsche and Zion pg 10-12 Jacob Golomb).
Your little spat there means nothing compared to these scholars who have actually impacted the world while you loaf around here trying to say small things in defending a life denying dogma.
Who exactly were slaves here? — Count Timothy von Icarus
Jews in this case.
It was the Jews who, in opposition to the aristocratic equation (good = aristocratic = beautiful = happy = loved by the gods), dared with a terrifying logic to suggest the contrary equation, and indeed to maintain with the teeth of the most profound hatred (the hatred of weakness) this contrary equation, namely, "the wretched are alone the good; the poor, the weak, the lowly, are alone the good; the suffering, the needy, the sick, the loathsome, are the only ones who are pious, the only ones who are blessed, for them alone is salvation—but you, on the other hand, you aristocrats, you men of power, you are to all eternity the evil, the horrible, the covetous, the insatiate, the godless; eternally also shall you be the unblessed, the cursed, the damned!" — Nietzsche, Genealogy 7
I get that you don’t really study this stuff much, but I do, so carry on with the obtuse bs you're attempting in order to obfuscate, but you're just ignorant on the matter really:
Nietzsche not only supplied the European Jews with the conceptual means to understand their self-hatred and to regard anti-Semitism as a manifestation of inferior mentalities....
The Jewish psychoanalysts (and Herzl as well, as we shall see) were especially attracted by Nietzsche's genealogical methods of unmasking. Nietzsche proclaimed these as a way of freeing oneself from religious, metaphysical, and social ideologies that had previously provided ready-made and inauthentic identities, and thereby attaining a solid sense of selfhood and individual identity. The death of the divine Father-the Jewish God-and the decline of the authority of the human father were responsible for bringing the sons to the schizophrenic state they were now in. — Jacob Golomb, Nietzsche and Zion
And in The Antichrist 24 Nietzsche spells it out quite clearly the origins of Christianity and antisemitism are unoriginal copies of Judaism:
the Christian church, put beside the “people of God,” shows a complete lack of any claim to originality. Precisely for this reason the Jews are the most fateful people in the history of the world: their influence has so falsified the reasoning of mankind in this matter that today the Christian can cherish anti-Semitism without realizing that it is no more than the final consequence of Judaism.
Further still, we know Philo Judeas, a Helenic Jew was responsible for creating the Christian Logos in CE 22-24 with his work "Die Vita Contemplativa" by Hellenizing the Old Testament with Plato's teachings... which would be 8-6 years before Christ began teaching at 30 CE.
So, I'll go with the academics on this one while being wary of you, a Christian, who is really just defending his beliefs against their ugly truths...
And Nietzsche was the first real philosopher to even consider the historical account, of philosophy, through history, philology and etymology... that he didn't write history books doesn't mean he wasn't a discerning scholar of history... pretty weak reasoning there if I may say. -
If there is a god then he surely isnt all merciful and all loving like islam and Christianity claimWell, you specifically were, which caused you to reify what I was saying towards that particular end. Something one muat be careful of when reading.
A pretty digestible book that could benefit your understanding here is a book by Hannah Arendt "The Human Condition." Im that book she spella out how constellations of thought have changed over centuries. You can just search for a pdf of it to read at your leisure. Not all religions were for the weak, but Judaeo-Christian morality emphasizes this.
The first two Essays in Nietzsche's Genealogy of Morals is a much quicker read, but I'll tell you that many people aren't neaely as discerning as they ought to be while reading Nietzsche. If you read Genealogy of Morals, read the preface too. And make doubly certain of doing your due diligence. One must follow Nietzsche carefully to understand his meanings in depth.
Apologies for disappearing, I fell asleep. Welcome aboard.
PS: religion is about faith, not knowing.
PSS: most here wont engage with such a limited OP. They find them too lacking and probably too common. That's okay though, we all start somewhere, and you seem eager enough to learn and discuss things. Though you'll find a few here who aren't so adjusted to baring, banning and ignoring.
An okay place to gather some knowledge, but the community as a whole is severely lacking. There are posting gurus who live here in these hinterlands of thought. They're fragile nihilists in disguise as philosophers. Except this whole community has little to no impact on the world, let alone on philosophical thought.
Better off reading philosophers of impact rather than the ramblings of the relatively powerless madmen here. -
If there is a god then he surely isnt all merciful and all loving like islam and Christianity claimYou pretty much heard what you wanted to hear. I told you that the formula of Jesus was:
1. His own values.
2. To love his fate.
3. To build bridges where others would give up.
I suggest you learn to read more discerningly for these forums, friend.
What I did was sanitized it of religion and made it secular.
If you need a label you can label me an atheist. -
If there is a god then he surely isnt all merciful and all loving like islam and Christianity claimThe Bible is mostly a language game that transfigured the values of ancient cultures. The invetor of the concept of "Light and Darkness" Zarathustra, had noticed there was often a certain internal damage done to a person who experiences war. A few Judaeo-Christian values were appropriated from Zarathustra's Zoroastrianism and other mythologies.
The Abrahamic religions grew out of a necessity to justify the lives of slaves against those who treated them as property and trash to be disposed of. Think of it as a style of metaphysical capoeira that armed the masses against their masters.
Jesus' aim is that of God's grace, to usher the sheep to heaven as a good shepherd should for his flock. Jesus in the Gospels is vastly different than the Jesus in say Pauline doctrine. Jesus haa his own equation. And that's in truth what Christianity is all about.
Jesus, a Jew, was rejected from his society for transfiguring the Jewish values to be less resentful, there was no sin (the divorce between man and God) in the gospels, nothing came between Jesus and another, not even those who would kill him. He lived his life to the glad tidings... and the reality of heaven is more like following Jesus' equation, not the doctrine of the Disciples, which is mostly just an injection of Judaism back into Christianity. Not a new faith, but more so a new way of life.
If people were to act like Jesus, then they would feel themselves as if they were in a kingdom of Heaven... otherwise they're remaon under the resentful wrathful and angry laws of God...God cannot be omnipotent and be denied half of the nature of omnipotence.
So the moral of the story is live to the Glad Tidings of Jesus Christ to feel heavenly. -
Quine: Reference and ModalityThis would give us conclusions like "LLMs use language appropriately, so LLMs are language users," etc., and "LLMs are conscious so long as their behavior makes us refer to them as such. — Count Timothy von Icarus
LLMs upset Douglas Hofstadter as he states his whole theory behind GEB is wrong or LLMs are conscious... -
Quine: Reference and ModalityI win — Banno
Not really, I settled this like a month ago... showing Quine uses set theory to inform on linguistics which I infered from studying ordinals and Quine's detailing you cant reference words or substitute them through different modalities because the total set of receptors aren't the same. And some how that confused you greatly... because you obviously never read Quine except for like a few pages.
Reference via different modalities is generally fallacy of equivocation. Plain and simple. Not sure how this got a month of discussion to not even figure that out yet. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?I edited the prior, but will get back to you Sir.
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Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?But Hilbert's Hotel can accommodate infinitly many new guests. Making the infinite finite means it's defined identity is actually finite, not infinite. Thus your example here is poor imo.
I'll address a few points later, I'm going back to sleep for the time being though, also cause I need to ruminate some more on the topic cause I normally don't consider this topic much. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?Probably because — BC
Actually, I don't generally think much of the state cause I do what I want regardless of the law because I'm generally not a malicious person. I can be cruel at times, like today, I knew it would eat at me for the rest of my life not relaying my father's last conversation with me to his step mother. She was crushed, and even though I felt a little at odds telling an old woman who I once cared about, as to how she played a huge role in destroying my fathers dreams and his family, it had to be done. I'll probably end up contacting her again here in a few days to let her know that I forgive her, but I'm going to let a B ruminate on just how ignorant and insulting her actions truly are to my father and my family in general. That aside...
I'm talking shit about the state simply because I understand what States do, as I worked for the state for quite some time. At first it was just a cool gig, that was less corporate bullshit, more of my speed in aggressiveness and activity. But you begin to see and realize things like you're really just a paid gangster. Im mostly building upon ideas to understand them better and get more experience discussing certain aspects. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?Well, see, there's your problem you think people can own land, and empty land at that. What stops someone from settling empty land? The state.
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Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?Don’t you see that you and your frienss could go to some untamed bit of land and make something of it of your own determination? Even with people at odds on this Forum, we could all just decide to get up and move somewhere... but States have us by the balls. We are little more than domesticated tools for its disposal. States monopolize power away from its constituents.
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Dreams and Waking States: An Analogy with Removable DiscontinuityYou're welcome. I think it's an interesting idea because I've always been interested in the undefined and asymtotes of functions. Especially since the identity of a number, say for this example we use 5 and 4.9999999999... repeated are the same in math... yet we can not ever reach an asymtote at 5. However, we can achieve 4.9999999999... repeated infinitly... it's odd to me that they're the same identity, yet one can not be reached when there is the asymtote at 5.
Furthermore I think this concept could make for an excellent story because it's creative. Like say through some scanning device it finds an algorithm of a persons sleeping mind, and they hack into the dreams of the sleeper through finding the undefined variables. Like oh, lets plug in nodes to the undefined socket and warp in. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?lmao voting and fiat money isn't power...
And on the contrary... I'm laughing at such a notion of power because you're capable of more, every human is. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?Well my man, that's what happen when a state steals everything from the people... the people look to the state to do everything... to solve their problems... I know I've said it before. And you're presenting the perfect person I was talking about, hence why you want to VOTE...
Mighty big contribution of you towards the end you desire.
Power relegated to voting and fiat money. -
Dreams and Waking States: An Analogy with Removable DiscontinuityQuidquid luce fuit, tenebris agit... "What goes on in the light occurs in the dark, and the otherway round as well."
Though, I do like this conception of yours. The dream being the undefined part of the function. Also welcome aboard, an intriguing first post. -
The case against suicideMost people aren't even functioning at 75% of their capabilities. Muted gene expression from a shit diet and lacking energy from allowing their sedentary BMR to rule them. The list goes on...
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Quine: Reference and ModalityObervation sentences are stimulus-synonymous for a speaker if their stimulus meanings are the same for him. But whereas one’s stimulations and their ranges are a private affair, stimulus synonymy makes sense socially. Sentences are stimulus-synonymous for the community if stimulus-synonymous for each member. This still does not work between languages, unless the community is bilingual. — Quine, Pursuit of Truth
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Epistemic Stances and Rational Obligation - Parts One and TwoWell, I think this Pincock lives up to his name. That a stance may allow for the bridging of a gap in knowledge doesn't make it obligatory. Other stances can render the stance mutable imo, especially when theoretical lacks real-world relevance and practicality.
A theoretical win may not be able to be scalable for several reasons which might take a HOW-to approach. Quine details that we can't ever know WHY a something failed in an experiment that should technically work — in theory. -
A discussion on Denying the AntecedentThat's fine, you can pick up Quine any time to learn... you said keep it brief if someone agrees with you. I kept it brief.
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Epistemic Stances and Rational Obligation - Parts One and TwoI'm still curious, what this achieves? Pretty much seems like a reprhasing of Quine. IE plagiarism.
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A discussion on Denying the AntecedentQuine on modalities... modalities resist substitutivity for reasons like this... swapping the modality in this case brings a falsehood.
That was an excellent first post. I could learn a lot from you. -
Do you wish you never existed?Interesting I wasn't aware, in fact, my father should have done this to his father, who had a few million to his name, via business, but he destroyed my father's dreams and family to go off with his secretary. But my father always was spineless in standing up to his pops.
And so my father went on his way to become independent, but was ultimately torn to piecemeal by a cavern dwelling minotaur of consciousness... My father stopped eating and drinking a few weeks ago. I creamated my father last week, so no need to for me to do such a thing. My mother is sweet in all her ignorance, and doubly innocent due to it, even if she was peculiarly absent. She was there, but never really could fathom me, or even my sister. She doesn't even realize that sometimes her advice is so insulting, regardless, I can't bring myself to hate my parents, especially not my mom. -
Epistemic Stances and Rational Obligation - Parts One and TwoMy question is what's even the appeal of this way of thinking? Seems more like a way of telling others how they ought to think... when it's generally those who think outside the box that press the envelope...
I dont get why people even argue about this kinda shit... "because these epistemic receptors were triggered its obviously gotta be sameness of stimulation between people even though they don't share a homology of nerve endings between the two... to the point its oblogatory for everyone because we all share the same neurons and thought processes..."
Sorry but we're not all one normal person who thinks all the same way...who are exact replicas of the next with the same genetic code and make up and same neurons... -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?
A thousand goals have there been hitherto, for a thousand peoples have there been. Only the fetter for the thousand necks is still lacking; there is lacking the one goal. As yet humanity hath not a goal.
But pray tell me, my brethren, if the goal of humanity be still lacking, is there not also still lacking—humanity itself?—
Thus spake Zarathustra. -
Do you wish you never existed?There are realities where I probably have committed suicide by now. But not this one, I've found a pathway out of my most abysmal hours.
most likely, but even still, I prefered using antinatalism more as an argument against my ignorant parents when I was a kid, before I even knew what (anti)natalism was... it offended me that my parents would give birth to me with so little regard to me afterwards. Even though always present they were still, oddly enough, absentee parents. Never making an effort to ever know me. All while expecting me to live a certain way that I decided I never agreed to do so. To live to a way of life that made me feel sick to my stomach.
I'm a bit of an antinatalist, but I still voted No. -
Are International Human Rights useless because of the presence of National Constitutions?I dont think so. International law tends to be there for the same reason federal/state law exists in the US: Different jurisdictions. And perhaps in those cases of rebellion when a government is over thrown to the point of lawlessness... then international law will come in handy.
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Artificial intelligenceYou're allowed to discuss AI and perhaps even post some content, when discussing differences in output, the main take away I get from it is don't use AI to make low effort posts and try to pass it off as your own work.
If you have an original piece, and want an AI to edit it then post, I'd probably go to a Mod and send them the original first and then the edited to see if it's okay. -
Nietzsche's "There are no facts." Our needs define our senses.Ah, did you mean AS misinterpreted? My fault. ^_^
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Nietzsche's "There are no facts." Our needs define our senses.putting that on the ole reading list. Appreciate you.
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Nietzsche's "There are no facts." Our needs define our senses.Facts are historical. — tim wood
That's exactly the point of me pointing to the fact in Nietzsche's WtP 258
My leading doctrine is this: there are no moral phenomena, but only a moral interpretation of phenomena. The origin of this interpretation itself lies beyond the pale of morality.
What is the meaning of the fact that we have imagined a contradiction in existence? This is of paramount importance: behind all other valuations those moral valuations stand commandingly. Supposing they disappear, according to what standard shall we then measure? And then of what value would knowledge be, etc. etc.??? — Nietzsche, WtP 258
Leads directly into Nietzschedevelop[ing] this idea further in Human All Too Human, again in Joyful Wisdom/Gay Science, in TSZ&BGE, and in Genealogy, all the way through to will to power. — DifferentiatingEgg
From the second aphorism of HATH, and I explain this in the other post also (
), had you read the aphorisms you'd see...We can see Nietzsche discusses this very concept as early as HATH (Aphorism 2), all the way to Ecce Homo and Antichrist... Which even Peter Gast gets right in WtP... — DifferentiatingEgg
Inherited Faults of Philosophers:...A lack of the historical sense is the hereditary fault of all philosophers...there are no eternal facts, as there are likewise no absolute truths. Therefore, historical philosophising is henceforth necessary, and with it the virtue of diffidence. — Nietzsche HATH § 2
So you see, I did discuss it, just not directly point to it... but fact is, there wasn't a wrong interpretation in that other than you thinking you had me on a wrong interpretation...
Nice, thank you for that additional gradation. What book is that in? -
Save as DraftSome people ready many books, some people read a quality selection of books many times. For example, since January Ive read and listened to Quine's Pursuit of Truth like 6 times. Once is never enough for my methodology.
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Save as Draftthat has nothing to do with Nietzsche... and I've been reading everything but Nietzsche lately... because I've already developed a careful mastery of Nietzsche.
Besides, as T Clark says, the new discussions get saved as drafts in the drafts section. -
Save as DraftI'd wager you are, regardless. Especially since you attempt to throw around the foundation of their thought so readily... a quick search of a few key terms and yeah... you're knee deep homie... hence "Christian."
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Save as DraftGetting to the bottom of why TPF doesn't have a standard Save as Draft function is the point. There's one post I could find about drafts and Jamal said he would see about getting it implemented...
So the only information I had to go off of was that Jamal could see if a save as draft feature could be implemented for the inbox... So I made the post to see if it could be implemented for the website.
Questioning something isn't whining dumbass. But I can see how a "Christian" could confuse the two...
DifferentiatingEgg
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